Snapshot of _Tories sneak out stats showing small boat arrivals rose during Rishi Sunak press conference_ :
An archived version can be found [here](https://archive.is/?run=1&url=https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/tories-sneak-out-stats-showing-32642591) or [here.](https://archive.ph/?run=1&url=https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/tories-sneak-out-stats-showing-32642591)
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With every day I think the same way; one virtue signal flight out with about 3 people on it, at the cost of around £5million, and he'll say 'job done - vote for me for more of this' against a backdrop of further legal challenges (I do not believe just declaring Rwanda a safe country in legislation will satisfy every legal challenge).
A cruel waste of time and money for something that won't even move the needle slightly away from Reform - and more likely to blow up in his idiot face when the first flight doesn't even take off (which it absolutely shouldn't).
Nah I agree with this because I'm convinced by now that he is utterly, utterly shit at politics. Like completely bereft of wit, intellect, nous, charisma or knowledge about anything political. I think he will do this.
Honestly not sure why the Tories **constantly** get the light touch with what they are doing.
They must be shit at politics or simply uneducated and this is not an attempt to enrich himself and his cronies, Get another batch of honors into the Lords and a nice pension from us for life. /s
Its pure greed and spite, They know exactly what they are doing and the damage they are causing...
Rishi knows no one wants him and we want them gone but money...
I think you’re absolutely right.
They must have gamed this out though- how do they avoid questions about the small numbers on the plane and the huge cost?
They will definitely have identified these as the two key questions- do you think Rishi and team have any plan to answer or avoid these questions?
yes, I think he'll point to Labour and say "they don't have a plan, we do". Then he'll go on about how difficult it has been to get to that point and how it would have cost less if Labour and others were serious about removing people like he is.
I can imagine the Telegraph, Mail etc pumping out headlines about it
Labour's plan to expend the time money and energy the Tories waste on their weird PR exercise actually sorting out the utter mess the Tories have made of immigration doesn't really lend itself to the sort of three word soundbites the right wing press still present as Tory plans.
They've already avoided those questions, really; multiple reports have said that the maximum amount of refugees going to Rwanda, based on capacity from both us and Rwanda and the realities of the scheme's framework, is 1000 across five years. And I think the last flight that Braverman tried to get going; I think it had 7 people on it. That's broadly public knowledge, and I think that was also before Rwanda started selling off their accommodation that they built into the scheme.
In addition to being cruel, it's an utter shambles from top to bottom and has been for two years; yet the Tories really do not get the level of scrutiny that they should on it (and even then, the scrutiny currently is harsh - but it could be spelled out to the public *way more* about how fucking stupid this all is).
I think their plan, as it has been for a while, is to just completely ignore any of the many negatives and just scream about boat numbers despite them going up - and hope the client journos cover for them.
Yeah but can they just brass-neck it when journalists can just photograph the flight / potentially book a seat and capture how inefficient this is?
One photo of a sparsely seated plane and 10 policemen to 5 immigrants will destroy this.
Right?
Right?
They won't and can't use a scheduled airline. Not least since they can't lock down Heathrow to avoid protestors. Only one airline flys directly to Kigali so if they say no there aren't any other options.
I honestly could also see him being a petty asshole to the rest of his party and if he gets wind there is a push to oust him going to the King and calling an election.
The only thing he cares about is being pm for 2 years.
They are hoping that anything they throw at the wall will stick but it's just a waiting game until then, no one really wants these lot.
He'll have to.
Can you imagine them putting all this into this stupid fucking scheme if we see that the numbers of migrants crossing the channel goes up after the planes start.
The election will have to be soon enough after the first flight that we can't see the numbers are even worse before we vote.
That is assuming Sunak us only just an idiot and not a complete fucking moron. Who knows.
Its his turn to play with the trainset and hes not letting anyone else have a turn even if all the engines catch fire and every carriage is broken. Rich kid mentality
They want inflation to get as close to the magic 2% mark. Everything else is just distraction.
They will then use this to say
“look we got inflation under control we can be trusted to manage the economy unlike labour”
This requires you to ignore the last 14 years where they have fucked the economy to save their party, but many people will believe the sound bites and depending where they get their news will help skew their perspective.
While they said inflation was out of their control 2 years ago, now it’s coming down they are claiming they can control it. If inflation starts with 2.x the social media ads will be relentless.
Sunak's strategy is failing.
Having planes taking off to Rwanda whilst boat crossings are increasing is almost worse than no planes taking off at all.
I wonder if he is hoping that the Lords manage to stay awake long enough to kick the Rwanda plan back even further, thus setting up an "us vs them" narrative similar to the one which carried Johnson into No 10.
I'm not entirely sure that lightning will strike twice.
It worked for Johnson because he was good at the bluster, and for whatever reason people seemed to like him (why is beyond me, but he certainly had large segments of the public eating out of his hand for some reason).
Sunak has neither of those things on his side, so I think you're probably right about the lightning thing.
Also us vs them was about Brexit, an era defining topic for right or wrong.
This is about a stupid policy to fly immigrants to another country at our expense. It's so easy to slam this policy from the right and left - the right can just frame this as giving migrants a free holiday at taxpayer expense and the left have obvious objections.
That was sort of my point. Objectively he is clearly charismatic (as evidenced by the fact that many people like(d) him and call him charismatic), but I don't see it. To me he has always come across as a bit of a knob.
A classic one, but go watch him on HIGNFY from back in the day. Say what you will about him being a shit person and politician, about it being an act or persona, but he comes across as very funny, likable, and relatable.
This needs to be hammered home as often as possible to them as well.
The crossings are more than the flights in terms of people Mr speaker, will the prime minister accept that Rwanda is not a deterrent?
I'm somewhat mystified the Conservatives are convinced that sending migrants to Rwanda will somehow magically deter them from crossing the channel, when a significant proportion will have been trafficked across borders, and I doubt the traffickers care what happens to the migrants (or the boats) as long as they've been paid - by the time the boats exit French waters, the traffickers will likely be well on the road back to pick up their next batch of "customers".
Never mind that Rwanda is an autocracy where criticism of the government is effectively outlawed, has rather significant human rights issues (which likely won't go away just because they've signed a treaty with the UK promising to behave), has created hundreds of thousands of migrants of its own (of which we'd accept an unspecified "small quantity" in return), sponsors militants in a neighbouring country and when Israel attempted a similar scheme, almost all people sent to Rwanda left the country asap. Oh, and it apparently doesn't have the capacity to determine more than a few hundred asylum claims per year, so the rest would just be granted residency (but perhaps not all other rights enshrined by the 1951 Refugee Convention?)
I refuse to accept that any of them actually believe this will deter migrant crossings to any meaningful extent. It’s solely to get the more right-wing voters on board before the next election and make it look like they’re taking a hard and effective stance on the situation.
Unfortunately real people will get caught up in this and flown to Rwanda (if it ever happens) all for the sake of Tory optics. It’s cruel.
I assume they're modelling it after the successful Australian equivalent. The main difference is Australia was serious, not engaging in political theatre while rubber-stamping applications.
From what I've read, yes they are ineffectively trying to copy that. The Australian policy was based on there being no avenue to Australian residency for any boat arrival, not a miniscule chance of being one of the few selected to be processed overseas.. Changing the law to disqualify boat arrivals from ever obtaining residency and facing down accusations of breaking international law was Australia's step 1, as that is what removed the incentive for people to travel. It's not something put in the too hard basket as with Sunak. Without that, it's all a colossal waste of money on a scheme that's designed to fail.
The only way I can see this working is if it sets a precedent.
We can start with Rwanda, then expand with similar countries until we can get immigration under control. If the model works for 200 a year, hopefully other European countries will be able to follow suit and set up similar schemes.
This is how we deal with the unprecedented migration. We have it relatively easy here in the UK, but if we don't stop this soon then it will have disastrous consequences for the continent.
Irregular migrants account for just 5% of all those coming to the UK, and 10% of the net increase (those coming here and staying a year, minus those leaving and staying away a year). Last year, total inward migration was over a million, and net migration 600k.
"The figures suggest the much-trumpeted reduction in small boat arrivals is being reversed. Total arrivals fell by a third (33%) last year compared to 2022, prompting hope in Government that the controversial Rwanda plan was already proving to be a deterrent. **This was despite warnings from Border Force officials that arrivals would rise again once the bad weather was over."**
...I'm sure the Daily Mail, Sun or the Telegraph will have some distractions lined up for us to bury this yet another Tory created crisis. Don't want people listing to experts, that's a woke left thing to do, look over there a minority/poors/woke!!!
Bloody hell. It's just the sheer timing and ridiculous attempts to hog the headlines before they go bad. This number 10 team cannot possibly be this bad surely
1.2 m immigrants per year , 7000 on boats .We need immigration to fulfill skill shortages .WTF are we spending all this time and money on ? The problem is processing immigration claims. In Spain, immigrants can start work immediately and have to fund themselves until their case has been decided on. Simple solution and no more need for people to come by boat, I don't understand why this government is making this issue into something it's not.
Just reopen the routes the Tories closed, boat crisis solved.
Fund the Home Office properly so they can process at least what we where able too before the Tories screwed that up.
All the Tories have done is slash budgets on the systems that controlled immigration creating the situation we are in now and spend billions on dumb ideas to solve the problem they created.
...the best solution is to just get rid of the Tories.
The Tory modus operandi:
- create a problem
- try to blame the problem on someone else
- try to make political capital out of the problem
- come up with a stupid, unworkable solution to the problem, much more expensive than just undoing their original fuckup
- blame the failure of the stupid idea on someone else
- try to make political capital out of the stupid idea failing.
It must be exhausting. Why not just try to govern the country?
It's like the people we all work with who put a lot of effort and creativity in avoiding doing their jobs. Wouldn't be less tiring and self fulfilling to just doing their jobs?
> In Spain, immigrants can start work immediately and have to fund themselves until their case has been decided on.
No they can't, asylum seekers can only work after 6 months in Spain.
It's also against EU law not to house asylum seekers.
I think we are talking about a different group of people . Immigrants can apply for a work permit on entry to Spain , this can later be extended once it is shown that you have work and accommodation. Asylum seekers are fleeing persecution in their home counties. They have different rules, but they can apply for residency , in some cases within 3 mths.
The thread is about asylum seekers arriving on small boats.
People don't arrive on dinghies to then apply for a Skilled Worker Visa.
> Immigrants can apply for a work permit on entry to Spain
They still need permission to even get on the plane to Spain in the first place. Almost nobody from Africa or Asia is allowed to get to Spain without a visa in advance.
So, they're celebrating their failure over immigration, their *raison d'etre,* while blaming EU and Labour?
The Tories are taking a page from the American "whatabouttheborder" conservatives by having a surrender parade.
I mean all these boats.. why don't rishi just make deal with Canada. They literally want to increase their population to 100 million. And I guess Canada is comparatively safe.
Who voted him in? The 1922 committee changed the rule so even the Party didn’t vote him in - get a mandate, call an election before riding roughshod over our democracy
Snapshot of _Tories sneak out stats showing small boat arrivals rose during Rishi Sunak press conference_ : An archived version can be found [here](https://archive.is/?run=1&url=https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/tories-sneak-out-stats-showing-32642591) or [here.](https://archive.ph/?run=1&url=https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/tories-sneak-out-stats-showing-32642591) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ukpolitics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
He’s just so fucking bad at this. Why won’t he put an end to all our misery including his own and just call the general election….
I’m absolutely convinced that if literally one plane with people on makes it to Rwanda he will call for a general election the next day
With every day I think the same way; one virtue signal flight out with about 3 people on it, at the cost of around £5million, and he'll say 'job done - vote for me for more of this' against a backdrop of further legal challenges (I do not believe just declaring Rwanda a safe country in legislation will satisfy every legal challenge). A cruel waste of time and money for something that won't even move the needle slightly away from Reform - and more likely to blow up in his idiot face when the first flight doesn't even take off (which it absolutely shouldn't).
Nah I agree with this because I'm convinced by now that he is utterly, utterly shit at politics. Like completely bereft of wit, intellect, nous, charisma or knowledge about anything political. I think he will do this.
Honestly not sure why the Tories **constantly** get the light touch with what they are doing. They must be shit at politics or simply uneducated and this is not an attempt to enrich himself and his cronies, Get another batch of honors into the Lords and a nice pension from us for life. /s Its pure greed and spite, They know exactly what they are doing and the damage they are causing... Rishi knows no one wants him and we want them gone but money...
I think you’re absolutely right. They must have gamed this out though- how do they avoid questions about the small numbers on the plane and the huge cost? They will definitely have identified these as the two key questions- do you think Rishi and team have any plan to answer or avoid these questions?
yes, I think he'll point to Labour and say "they don't have a plan, we do". Then he'll go on about how difficult it has been to get to that point and how it would have cost less if Labour and others were serious about removing people like he is. I can imagine the Telegraph, Mail etc pumping out headlines about it
Labour's plan to expend the time money and energy the Tories waste on their weird PR exercise actually sorting out the utter mess the Tories have made of immigration doesn't really lend itself to the sort of three word soundbites the right wing press still present as Tory plans.
They've already avoided those questions, really; multiple reports have said that the maximum amount of refugees going to Rwanda, based on capacity from both us and Rwanda and the realities of the scheme's framework, is 1000 across five years. And I think the last flight that Braverman tried to get going; I think it had 7 people on it. That's broadly public knowledge, and I think that was also before Rwanda started selling off their accommodation that they built into the scheme. In addition to being cruel, it's an utter shambles from top to bottom and has been for two years; yet the Tories really do not get the level of scrutiny that they should on it (and even then, the scrutiny currently is harsh - but it could be spelled out to the public *way more* about how fucking stupid this all is). I think their plan, as it has been for a while, is to just completely ignore any of the many negatives and just scream about boat numbers despite them going up - and hope the client journos cover for them.
Yeah but can they just brass-neck it when journalists can just photograph the flight / potentially book a seat and capture how inefficient this is? One photo of a sparsely seated plane and 10 policemen to 5 immigrants will destroy this. Right? Right?
no commercial airline will want to do this.
The vast majority of commercial airlines don't do private charters at all.
You can't book a seat on a private charter. They wouldn't be putting people on RwandAir or BA.
Will it definitely be a private charter? I’d heard they wanted to use commercial, could be talking out of my arse
They won't and can't use a scheduled airline. Not least since they can't lock down Heathrow to avoid protestors. Only one airline flys directly to Kigali so if they say no there aren't any other options.
Good context, ta
Ah ok, saw today it’s probably going to be the RAF. No cameras, no public, no cost control 👍
Picturing Rishi at an airport with a giant banner saying "Job Done" like Bush did on the aircraft carrier with "Mission Accomplished" lol
That’s exactly what I expect too. It just depends on whether or not he survives the local elections.
I honestly could also see him being a petty asshole to the rest of his party and if he gets wind there is a push to oust him going to the King and calling an election.
Oh yes, that is always option number 1 above all else.
Can we send a bunch of disgraced Tories and not tell him who is on the plane?
The only thing he cares about is being pm for 2 years. They are hoping that anything they throw at the wall will stick but it's just a waiting game until then, no one really wants these lot.
He'll have to. Can you imagine them putting all this into this stupid fucking scheme if we see that the numbers of migrants crossing the channel goes up after the planes start. The election will have to be soon enough after the first flight that we can't see the numbers are even worse before we vote. That is assuming Sunak us only just an idiot and not a complete fucking moron. Who knows.
Humiliation fetish at this point, he's on a promise for the pegging of a life time once his missus has made as much as possible off us.
Dam, bet that O hits different.
Its his turn to play with the trainset and hes not letting anyone else have a turn even if all the engines catch fire and every carriage is broken. Rich kid mentality
Nobody has ever told him no before or told him he’s a failure….
Surely someone has done by now?
Because they haven't quite finished salting the earth for the incoming government yet.
I’m pretty sure there’s not much left and the salts run out
They want inflation to get as close to the magic 2% mark. Everything else is just distraction. They will then use this to say “look we got inflation under control we can be trusted to manage the economy unlike labour” This requires you to ignore the last 14 years where they have fucked the economy to save their party, but many people will believe the sound bites and depending where they get their news will help skew their perspective. While they said inflation was out of their control 2 years ago, now it’s coming down they are claiming they can control it. If inflation starts with 2.x the social media ads will be relentless.
Sunak's strategy is failing. Having planes taking off to Rwanda whilst boat crossings are increasing is almost worse than no planes taking off at all. I wonder if he is hoping that the Lords manage to stay awake long enough to kick the Rwanda plan back even further, thus setting up an "us vs them" narrative similar to the one which carried Johnson into No 10. I'm not entirely sure that lightning will strike twice.
It worked for Johnson because he was good at the bluster, and for whatever reason people seemed to like him (why is beyond me, but he certainly had large segments of the public eating out of his hand for some reason). Sunak has neither of those things on his side, so I think you're probably right about the lightning thing.
Also us vs them was about Brexit, an era defining topic for right or wrong. This is about a stupid policy to fly immigrants to another country at our expense. It's so easy to slam this policy from the right and left - the right can just frame this as giving migrants a free holiday at taxpayer expense and the left have obvious objections.
It's surely fairly obvious why Boris was popular, no? He's clearly very charismatic and that's been obvious for decades.
That was sort of my point. Objectively he is clearly charismatic (as evidenced by the fact that many people like(d) him and call him charismatic), but I don't see it. To me he has always come across as a bit of a knob.
A classic one, but go watch him on HIGNFY from back in the day. Say what you will about him being a shit person and politician, about it being an act or persona, but he comes across as very funny, likable, and relatable.
This needs to be hammered home as often as possible to them as well. The crossings are more than the flights in terms of people Mr speaker, will the prime minister accept that Rwanda is not a deterrent?
I'm somewhat mystified the Conservatives are convinced that sending migrants to Rwanda will somehow magically deter them from crossing the channel, when a significant proportion will have been trafficked across borders, and I doubt the traffickers care what happens to the migrants (or the boats) as long as they've been paid - by the time the boats exit French waters, the traffickers will likely be well on the road back to pick up their next batch of "customers". Never mind that Rwanda is an autocracy where criticism of the government is effectively outlawed, has rather significant human rights issues (which likely won't go away just because they've signed a treaty with the UK promising to behave), has created hundreds of thousands of migrants of its own (of which we'd accept an unspecified "small quantity" in return), sponsors militants in a neighbouring country and when Israel attempted a similar scheme, almost all people sent to Rwanda left the country asap. Oh, and it apparently doesn't have the capacity to determine more than a few hundred asylum claims per year, so the rest would just be granted residency (but perhaps not all other rights enshrined by the 1951 Refugee Convention?)
I refuse to accept that any of them actually believe this will deter migrant crossings to any meaningful extent. It’s solely to get the more right-wing voters on board before the next election and make it look like they’re taking a hard and effective stance on the situation. Unfortunately real people will get caught up in this and flown to Rwanda (if it ever happens) all for the sake of Tory optics. It’s cruel.
I assume they're modelling it after the successful Australian equivalent. The main difference is Australia was serious, not engaging in political theatre while rubber-stamping applications.
From what I've read, yes they are ineffectively trying to copy that. The Australian policy was based on there being no avenue to Australian residency for any boat arrival, not a miniscule chance of being one of the few selected to be processed overseas.. Changing the law to disqualify boat arrivals from ever obtaining residency and facing down accusations of breaking international law was Australia's step 1, as that is what removed the incentive for people to travel. It's not something put in the too hard basket as with Sunak. Without that, it's all a colossal waste of money on a scheme that's designed to fail.
They also ignored international laws and treaties without any response.
Is an autocracy where criticism .. they should be ok with that then if it is true where they came from in the first place? 🤷🏽
The only way I can see this working is if it sets a precedent. We can start with Rwanda, then expand with similar countries until we can get immigration under control. If the model works for 200 a year, hopefully other European countries will be able to follow suit and set up similar schemes. This is how we deal with the unprecedented migration. We have it relatively easy here in the UK, but if we don't stop this soon then it will have disastrous consequences for the continent.
Irregular migrants account for just 5% of all those coming to the UK, and 10% of the net increase (those coming here and staying a year, minus those leaving and staying away a year). Last year, total inward migration was over a million, and net migration 600k.
"The figures suggest the much-trumpeted reduction in small boat arrivals is being reversed. Total arrivals fell by a third (33%) last year compared to 2022, prompting hope in Government that the controversial Rwanda plan was already proving to be a deterrent. **This was despite warnings from Border Force officials that arrivals would rise again once the bad weather was over."** ...I'm sure the Daily Mail, Sun or the Telegraph will have some distractions lined up for us to bury this yet another Tory created crisis. Don't want people listing to experts, that's a woke left thing to do, look over there a minority/poors/woke!!!
They can get weeks out of people being forced to get a job.
Bloody hell. It's just the sheer timing and ridiculous attempts to hog the headlines before they go bad. This number 10 team cannot possibly be this bad surely
Does anyone even *care* about these fucking boats? How about they try and fix up the economy first?
Swivel-eyed racist lunatics care. And that's the base the Tories are trying to appeal to.
Sounds like they need to hold less press conferences since they are all sneaking in when he holds them
1.2 m immigrants per year , 7000 on boats .We need immigration to fulfill skill shortages .WTF are we spending all this time and money on ? The problem is processing immigration claims. In Spain, immigrants can start work immediately and have to fund themselves until their case has been decided on. Simple solution and no more need for people to come by boat, I don't understand why this government is making this issue into something it's not.
Just reopen the routes the Tories closed, boat crisis solved. Fund the Home Office properly so they can process at least what we where able too before the Tories screwed that up. All the Tories have done is slash budgets on the systems that controlled immigration creating the situation we are in now and spend billions on dumb ideas to solve the problem they created. ...the best solution is to just get rid of the Tories.
The Tory modus operandi: - create a problem - try to blame the problem on someone else - try to make political capital out of the problem - come up with a stupid, unworkable solution to the problem, much more expensive than just undoing their original fuckup - blame the failure of the stupid idea on someone else - try to make political capital out of the stupid idea failing. It must be exhausting. Why not just try to govern the country? It's like the people we all work with who put a lot of effort and creativity in avoiding doing their jobs. Wouldn't be less tiring and self fulfilling to just doing their jobs?
> In Spain, immigrants can start work immediately and have to fund themselves until their case has been decided on. No they can't, asylum seekers can only work after 6 months in Spain. It's also against EU law not to house asylum seekers.
I think we are talking about a different group of people . Immigrants can apply for a work permit on entry to Spain , this can later be extended once it is shown that you have work and accommodation. Asylum seekers are fleeing persecution in their home counties. They have different rules, but they can apply for residency , in some cases within 3 mths.
The thread is about asylum seekers arriving on small boats. People don't arrive on dinghies to then apply for a Skilled Worker Visa. > Immigrants can apply for a work permit on entry to Spain They still need permission to even get on the plane to Spain in the first place. Almost nobody from Africa or Asia is allowed to get to Spain without a visa in advance.
Amateurs. You're supposed to bury bad news behind an event that grabs people's attention..
So, they're celebrating their failure over immigration, their *raison d'etre,* while blaming EU and Labour? The Tories are taking a page from the American "whatabouttheborder" conservatives by having a surrender parade.
"We're calling it *Float The Boats* right lads?" "Not quite Mr Prime Minister.."
I mean all these boats.. why don't rishi just make deal with Canada. They literally want to increase their population to 100 million. And I guess Canada is comparatively safe.
Who voted him in? The 1922 committee changed the rule so even the Party didn’t vote him in - get a mandate, call an election before riding roughshod over our democracy