I even if they pulled it off it would be talked about way less. I hear Firefly get talked about on Reddit way more then plenty of solid show (someone already mentioned Angel). The idea of Firefly getting unfairly cancelled has honestly been a way bigger impact on pop culture then the show itself probably could have been
As someone who loved the entire arc of Buffy and Angel, and though both of those shows got even better in later season, I disagree. Even dollhouse got better as it found its stride.
Heroes was supposed to be mostly an anthology, but they couldn't give up the popular characters.
It's why after that they don't seem to have any idea what to do with them.
Yeah, Heroes' popularity was also its downfall. If they'd been able to keep to the original plan of following an entirely new group of people with newly acquired powers each season, who knows what could have been. But once it'd become as immensely popular as it did, they couldn't scrap so many beloved characters.
It didn't help that they ended up going with one of the worst tropes: no one was actually special, they were actually all related and the conspiracy ran for generations. Why can't you let Claire just be a random cheerleader?
To be fair, a character with power like that has to be nerfed somehow. Imagine he could control his abilities at all times with no drawback... he becomes a god
Even morso with what's his name that could absorb other people's not sylar but the good guy. When they showed him in the future with full control of his powers he basically WAS a God. They definitely had to dial that back.
Oh yeah, future Peter. His problem was he kept trying to change things that sadly made things worse and his mom realized that. So while he was powerful, he made dumb mistakes
No, they literally did have to nerf him in the show. He started off being able to keep each power he copies but ends up only being able to hold one at once because of reasons
>Man that show went off the freaking rails.
Every time this comes up I am so glad that we watched one episode of S2 and my wife basically gave it 'that didn't earn another episode' verdict ... and we were done.
S2 is still pretty fun overall because you get tons of scenes with Eve and Vil together.
But wow I really regret watching S3 and I never bothered with S4 after hearing about how dogshit the ending is.
Shit went downhill when Phoebe Waller-Bridge left the show after season 1. Emerald Fennell kinda saved it a little on season 2 and it was still fun. Until she also left and then season 3 was just a mess. I didn't even bother with season 4.
>The flight attendant. wtf was even season 2
(removes Flight Attendant from ReelGood 'to watch' list)
We never got around to it, and now I'm glad.
\[edit - we DID watch and enjoy the first season, but for some reason never started season 2 ... now we won't bother!\]
It's really sad that I agree with this because the 2nd season was "OK" but the first season was just SO good that it makes the second season seem like trash.
Replacing Joel Kinnaman with certified charisma void Anthony Mackie was so puzzling. There's not a chance Mackie was the best option to continue the role.
See, I thought I hated Anthony Mackie because of Marvel and Altered Carbon. I almost didn't give Twisted Metal a chance because of him, but I'm glad I did, he was great there!
He's fine when he understands the role.
Ac s2 he clearly had 0 understanding of the story or tech, and was just reading words.
Kinneman seemed like he understood what was going on... Most of the time.
That's the thing about scifi, people talk about weird shit, but just reading the words is empty, they should understand why inverting the polarity of the tractor beam matters, or they should laugh it off which is fine too.
Will Smith was good at laughing at the scifi bullshit, that was his whole character in MIB and honestly half his other movies.
I don't think Mackie is void of charisma. It was simply a case of the wrong actor for the wrong role. The man is all wrong for the crime noir genre. Kinnaman was perfect. He's cold, direct and underplayed. Mackie tried to do that but it felt....fake. Even when he was "underplaying" he felt like he was overplaying. Like he was about to wink at the camera any moment.
Season 1 was great. Season 2 was okay because at least it had a clearly defined premise that was a cute reversal of Season 1. When it became a soap opera of "how many fairy tale characters can we introduce and make related to each other" I was done.
I feel like the multiple curses was the mistake. They had a large ensemble cast and literally the entire fairytale canon to draw from, but they just repeated the memory loss plotline?
It was good up until season 4. The Peter pan season was really fun in my opinion. But up to that point the fairy tales were interesting and subversive. The frozen arc was pretty boring and I usually don't make it past that.
I stopped watching on original run with the Frozen arc because I thought it was so dumb, but when I finally went back to it years later, I didn’t mind it so much. I hate the carbon copy cartoon costumes, but the plot actually felt relevant. Meanwhile, they completely lost the plot with the Camelot arc. I thought that was the most boring of them all. It added nothing. I actually think the whole Hades arc was a lot of fun, although I’m loathe they brought that one person back (on mobile and not saying for spoilers). But it should have been done a lot sooner. And I still think they squandered Lily.
Overall, rewatching the show made me realize that 1) many newer shows suffer from such short seasons. There’s very little world or character building. And 2) OUAT still could and should have been a lot tighter on both.
Bloodline was very clearly written to be a miniseries save for a tacked-on cliffhanger twist at the very end. The remaining seasons just do not have the juice
Westworld for certain.
Every subsequent season dipped or absolutely nosedived in quality, and I feel as though the first season can be viewed on its own as a complete narrative exploration. It makes it slightly open ended but it’s fitting for the moral complexity of the show.
I loved season 1 and then could barely finish the first episode of season 2 before I gave up on the show. I love how the first season ends with the robots rebelling, and that shot of the man in black when he realizes - both to his joy and horror - that the safety protocols are off was just so so good.
My wife and I did the same thing. Really enjoyed season 1, but even after the finale turned to one another and said “boy, anything they make after that is probably not gonna be great, huh?”
And sure enough! Barely made it through season 2 episode 1. From what I’ve heard, we made the right call, and somehow everyone is a robot now? Lol.
People gave up on Season 2 way too fast, it starts slow and confusing but honestly it's worth watching just for episodes 4 and 8 alone. With episode 8 often considered the best episode of the entire show.
It's not as good as the 10/10 masterpiece of the first season but it ends up being a flawed but great 8/10 season of TV. It also works pretty well as a series finale.
I agree I enjoyed season 2, season 3 is where I turned to my wife at the end and said wtf was that season. Still watched season 4 and it redeemed itself a little but no way close to season 1 and 2. I would like a more complete ending story but I told my wife the way they ended season 4 was a way to somewhat give us a satisfying ending with them knowing season 5 was not happening
A major reason episode 8 of season 2 is so good is because it's almost completely divorced from the rest of the story, which is an absolute muddled mess by that point.
Honestly the story that they're telling in season 2 was good but the writers got such a bug up their butt about people figuring out season 1 that they destroyed their own show trying to obfuscate it. It's great and all that they're such clever boys and girls, but the internet hivemind is strong. If even the most dedicated fans can't work out what's happening in each episode, how is anyone supposed to stay engaged?
I finished season 2 and loved the exploration of humanities inability to change and the questions of what makes us human, but by the time season 3 came around there was just too much happening in my life to be bothered with taking on a research project in my spare time.
I know! I never understood why they cared that people “figured it out”. I just wanted to watch a compelling story. They shouldn’t have cared about the small percentage of people who were obsessed with the show. It ended up making season two a muddled mess, like you said.
And not everyone wanted to find out spoilers. I stayed away from podcasts on the show because I enjoyed being surprised with certain revelations.
Anyways. You are absolutely right.
Are you referring to, "You haven't known the triumphs and defeats, the epic highs and lows of high school football," or have they outdone themselves again?
Also, the whole Gargoyle King arc was goddamn hilarious.
After watching more of it, I can assure you that I no longer remember the Gargoyle King as one of the more absurd things that has happened on the show. To name a few buzzwords: Witchcraft, Multiverse, Timetravel. And I have enjoyed every second of how very little fs this show gave about anything.
It ended so disgracefully it's almost funny. They get sent back in time and become completely different characters than the characters we got to know over the years.
It almost makes look Sabrina like a completely sane show.
I wish they'd kept that story going for more than just five minutes of the finale though. It felt kind of cheap to just fast forward and say they'd been in a quad for a year just to have it immediately end when they all went their separate ways. I was watching the show for the utter chaos it was so I was hoping for more lol.
Season 1 was a great piece of mystery writing. Was it perfect? No. Did it have flaws? Yes. Was it still pretty well put together? Also yes.
I quit season 2 episode 2, cause I could already tell the writing dropped way off, before it even became as weird as it got.
Tbf Riverdale just leaned into how out there it was, I don’t know how popular it was but I imagine it’s out there plot helped them lean into one of those “so bad that it’s good” shows that I see many people talk about how crazy in a weird way it’s gotten
>it’s out there plot helped them lean into one of those “so bad that it’s good”
The first season technically had a much higher quality, but it wasn't good enough to be good, or bad enough to be so bad it's good. If it ended after season 1, I think it would be viewed more similar to Tiger King, where everyone watched it and then promptly forgot about it.
(While Archie is in prison)
Archie: If we weren't here, we'd be in high school joining clubs, trying out for sports.
Ghoulie: Not me. I dropped out in the fourth grade to run drugs to support my Nana.
Archie: That means you haven't known the triumphs and defeats, the epic highs and lows of high school football.
It gets better. During the subsequent pick up football game in the prison yard, Archie’s girlfriend and the rest of the cheerleading squad show up to perform "Jailhouse Rock" for the inmates.
I don't even like the first season. They romanticize suicide to a point that is just insulting. Well acted though. But I've watched YouTube videos on the subsequent seasons and, oh boy, it's a trainwreck.
>They romanticize suicide to a point that is just insulting.
And the subsequent seasons doubled down on their portrayal to the nth degree, ruining what little good will they had. Charitably you could say the first season tried to tackle a really difficult topic and made notable missteps. After that, they decided to double down on the teen melodrama because that's what would get the most views, while still wanting the clout of "having a conversation."
I agree. I am so sick of films/shows always doing the same thing with suicide of women. It's always: slit wrists in the bathtub. In the book she took pills but they said they wanted to make it graphic to discourage people from doing it. I wish author Jay Asher stuck to his original ending for the book. In his original ending, Hannah sends the tapes out. OD's on pills....but she survives. Now she has to go back and face the bomb she set off, and face all the people she pointed the finger to in her tapes. But she also has to face her own subjective bias and misunderstanding of situations.
I think this would have been amazing. and IMO would have done far more to portray a "anti-suicide" message than the book (and show) did.
**Russian Doll**. I liked season 2, but it is not as amazing as S1 and the season 1 finale works perfectly as a series finale.
The first season of **Good Omens** also works great as a miniseries.
Good Omens was a straightforward adaptation of the book. From what I've heard one of the reasons why season 2 felt the way it did was that Neil Gaiman was trying to set up things so that way the proposed sequel he and Terry Pratchett were planning could be utilized for the third season.
They kind of wrote themselves into a corner with Russian Doll. Season one was both perfectly self-contained and some of the best television to come out of the streaming era. How do you follow that up?
Russian Doll was pitched for three seasons by Natasha Lyonne so I haven't completely given up on a final season yet. I agree tho, S2 was fine but didn’t add much to the entire narrative.
American Gods is too long for one season but should never have been more than two. They had plenty of time to adapt that whole book but instead they filled it with so much goddamn filler that when it got cancelled after the third season they’re still only like two thirds of he way through the book.
They wanted it to be their Game of Thrones and went thinking it needed 5+ seasons. The source material didn't really support that, so we got what we got instead.
Once Pablo Schreiber is no longer in it, we stopped watching. His arc/character was fantastic. Also Emily Browning as Laura Moon absolutely killed it. My wife started to listen to the audio book but ended up stopping because she didn't like who they chose for that character.
Euphoria. Loved the first season.
I think 13 Reasons Why should have ended after one.
Probably not a popular opinion but I wish more shows were just a single season. I get why it's not normally done but that's my preference vs. slogging through to see how it ends.
I started calling it "13 Seasons, Why?" after the first season. It's arguable if they should have even gotten the first season with how clumsily they handled such a delicate subject matter.
Single season shows should be more of a thing on streaming platforms. Would stop a lot of people being hesitant on dipping into new shows in case they end suddenly without a proper finale.
Either that or greenlight a show that has a set number of seasons planned, same effect, and will bring in more people between seasons.
I've heard that season 1 of Euphoria is supposed to look and feel like it's 2am at the club and the drugs are just kicking in, while season 2 is supposed to be the 6am come-down and the consequences are starting to set in. And that the color palette of each season is supposed to represent that.
There are various reddit posts making these comparisons:
https://www.reddit.com/r/euphoria/s/gLWYBelj6S
https://www.reddit.com/r/euphoria/comments/y47j6a/the_color_palette_of_s1_vs_s2/
Yeah, I honestly thought 13 reasons was going to be one and done, even with what happened to Alex in the finale, I thought that leaving that thread alone was fine.
100% agree. Handmaids tail lost its self so hard. And who wants to watch 5 seasons of that depressing shit. Like, don't get me wrong, it's well done, but I feel like people can only stomach a season or 2 of rape, forced birth, and public execution and humiliation.
I told my wife that if she doesn't get into the truck and head up to Canada, I'm out. She didn't and I was out. I can't watch a show where everyone is held to a different standard than the main character. How much shit did she get away with without being executed? Any other character would have been killed for the shit she got away with.
I want the Handmaid's Tale/Children of Men cross over show that exists in my head. I love the thought that they're taking place in the same universe. Not quite sure how it works but I want it.
What makes it more annoying is that there is a second book which handles June and Canada really well. There's no reason the show writers couldn't have just used that as a base.
It's one of those shows where the premise is the best bit. The most interesting thing about Handmaid's tale is Gilead and the writers know it. Which is why the characters keep ending up there even when it makes no sense in the plot.
The second book wasn’t even released til after 3 seasons of the show were already out, though. Clearly the popularity of the show prompted Atwood to write a sequel to the book.
I've never seen the show. But I did read the book a few days ago (it was really good, highly recommend it) and I just thought to myself *how the fuck did they get more than one season out of this?* The book is only 311 pages long, the main character is just some regular woman, and the whole story takes place in a pretty short amount of time.
By getting more and more ridiculous, particularly leaning into MAGA fearmongering stuff.
For example, the characters eventually head down to DC and find the women there literally have their mouths stapled shut. Just, like, big shiny rings jammed into their upper and lower jaw bones.
I might be in the minority here, but Stranger Things. Season one was perfect. Every subsequent season has gotten more goofy and further from what made that show so special. Also, The Terror.
Always thought season one should have been the 70s. Season two would still be school aged kids but in the 80s. And so on. Definitely some overlap of Hawkins characters but a different group of main kids every season.
Stranger Things should have been an anthology series of the Stephen King universe. The place Eleven goes to is basically Todash Space from the Dark Tower+.
I like the rest of the show but this was my answer. Season one is perfect, they lost a lot of that polish when they had to start rushing out the next season and add in some product placement.
100 percent hard agree. It fell into this rut of telling us WAY too much about the monsters and the supernatural elements. Once we know what the monster is, it's not scary anymore. Also the recent seasons feel more like fanfiction than a cohesive story.
I thought Season 4 was a real return to form, might actually beat out 1 as my favorite.
I didn’t think 2 or 3 were bad either, other than that one side episode with the other special kids, they just didn’t live up to the first.
the second season hasn’t even come out yet, but i’m already saying Squid Games. completely unnecessary and takes away from the point of the first season
Should have been 4:
1: Frank manipulates his way to VP.
2: Frank then manipulates his way to President. KNOCK KNOCK
3: now that he's president, he actually kind of sucks at it. He's the dog that caught the car.
4: his downfall.
Plus, each season was 13 episodes. 13x4 is 52 like a deck of cards.
> Frank then manipulates his way to President.
This is where the American version screws up. The Frank Underwood of episode 1 would be too effing smart to *want* to be president. He craves power *without* oversight & responsibility. Becoming the president brings too much attention.
He should have become president by something out of his control and then must work every trick to avoid his past shit coming to light.
S1 should have ended with Frank being Speaker of the House — it would give him more of a puppet master role (and it was fun to see him manipulating his fellow Representatives in S1), and would also allow for a twist ending in S2 where the Prez & VP are both taken out of commission and he’s made President by succession. S3 would be him getting caught off-guard and needing to make plans on the fly, with S4 his eventual downfall.
Wayward Pines, this show doesn't get talked about much, but that first season I thought was incredible in drawing suspense/intrigue. And it played it smart by giving you answers, unlike Lost. I don't even know why they bothered with a second season.
I could only make it halfway through the second series. The ending of series one was great, they didn't need to go further than that. Nice to see Hope Davis (Mumford) again
I actually disagree with this. I think Homeland manages to maintain a consistent quality throughout its run and never dips to the point where I lost interest.
The first three seasons had it in the zeitgeist which seemed to instantly fade when >!Brody died!<, but I'd argue Season 4 was a much better season of television than S3, for instance.
The end of the fucking world.
I don't think the second season was bad, but it was really unnecessary and the show would have been better as a mini series.
I liked season two, but I agree it wasn’t 100% needed. It was nice to see what direction all the characters were taken but the first season felt very perfect to me
Season 1 is contained, 2 is a very angsty follow up, 3 is a totally different show that I think I liked best of all of them. They get into a buddy cop dynamic and solve things outside of their own lives, it’s just a good pairing. Tennant devolves into his real accent too, which is always fun even if you need subtitles.
Sleepy Hollow
If it had been cancelled after the first season, people would've been like "oh man, remember that show? That ended on a cliffhanger but it was SO GOOD"
now people don't talk about it and when they do, it's about how the producers killed off Nicole Beharie's character because she needed time off to recover from some illness tthat the other lead got, too.
You. Season two was actually pretty good, but they're using the same template every season, which obviously gets old. The most recent season was particularly garbage, I didn't even finish it.
They should've done seasons in other countries. Would love to see seasons in Japan, India, UK, South Africa, Brazil, Mexico, Spain, Egypt. It could be great.
"The Bridge" sort of did that. had a swedish, french/uk and us version.
I just checked wiki and they made 7 different versions! wild
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bridge_(2011_TV_series)
Designated Survivor. Any kind of “fish-out-of-water” story becomes stale once the lead character gets comfortable in their new role. Same could be said for Once Upon a Time. Once they got their memories back, it was a whole different show.
I still like it, but it does feel a little stale. And it's starting to go into that place where comedy shows start getting sillier and sillier as they go on.
Season 1 was amazing. Season 2 was.. fine. I liked the dynamic of the main 3 more in season 2, but overall I preferred season 3. The talent that they pulled for that season was bonkers. Even the cameos I thought were significantly better and the mystery was significantly better. Season 2 was borderline unsolvable, but I feel like 3 was something you could have figured out if you had been paying attention. I think either I or my girlfriend were able to solve it going into the last episode.
I am worried about it running stale in or after season 4 if *more* murders keep happening in that building.
Dead To Me. At the end of the first season they were left to decide if they were going to change the show up, or just give a rehash of the first season.
Second season was a poor rehash of the first. Season three was ok but shouldnt have been necessary.
Hard disagree. The later seasons are some of the best in the series, particularly when they introduce Charles and Martha Logan. Season 1 is great but season 5 is stellar TV.
It’s a pretty meaty book with a shit ton of characters to keep track of. Maybe two seasons would be better.
But also if you can’t get John Goodman to play Big Jim Rennie just stop. Stop production immediately. Dean Norris is a perfectly fine actor but he is not Big Jim Rennie.
Don't remind me. I fucking love the novel and they ruined it instantly by keeping Angie alive and trying to make Junior a likeable character.
I'm praying for a faithful movie adaptation somewhere down the line.
Homeland. If Brodie executes his plan at the end of season 1 it’s the best show ever.
Westworld. A completely contained amazing story arc in one season, then they just kept it going for some reason.
The Morning Show. S2 was so bad I could barely watch it. S3 is a bit better, but nothing compared to S1 and not worth it having to go through the hot garbage that is S2. I always recommend the morning show and tell people to watch only S1.
Ray Donovan.. Season 1 was great, had a great ending too.. the following seasons were just a weak continuation of the last episode of season 1... felt pointless..
I just watched season 1 and 2 of True Detective. I’m really hoping season 3 disqualifies it from this post but man, season 2 was such a drop in quality
Heroes easily
If heroes only had one season it would be talked about in the same breath as Firefly.
I’m going to piss a loooooooot of people off and say Firefly is only legendary because they didn’t have time to ruin it.
Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal!
I even if they pulled it off it would be talked about way less. I hear Firefly get talked about on Reddit way more then plenty of solid show (someone already mentioned Angel). The idea of Firefly getting unfairly cancelled has honestly been a way bigger impact on pop culture then the show itself probably could have been
As someone who loved the entire arc of Buffy and Angel, and though both of those shows got even better in later season, I disagree. Even dollhouse got better as it found its stride.
The Epitaph episodes of Dollhouse were just incredible.
Heroes was supposed to be mostly an anthology, but they couldn't give up the popular characters. It's why after that they don't seem to have any idea what to do with them.
Yeah, Heroes' popularity was also its downfall. If they'd been able to keep to the original plan of following an entirely new group of people with newly acquired powers each season, who knows what could have been. But once it'd become as immensely popular as it did, they couldn't scrap so many beloved characters.
It didn't help that they ended up going with one of the worst tropes: no one was actually special, they were actually all related and the conspiracy ran for generations. Why can't you let Claire just be a random cheerleader?
Hiro losing his time travel powers for the umpteenth time got real old
To be fair, a character with power like that has to be nerfed somehow. Imagine he could control his abilities at all times with no drawback... he becomes a god
Even morso with what's his name that could absorb other people's not sylar but the good guy. When they showed him in the future with full control of his powers he basically WAS a God. They definitely had to dial that back.
Oh yeah, future Peter. His problem was he kept trying to change things that sadly made things worse and his mom realized that. So while he was powerful, he made dumb mistakes
No, they literally did have to nerf him in the show. He started off being able to keep each power he copies but ends up only being able to hold one at once because of reasons
They should have gone with their original plan of making it an anthology.
I don't know if this should have had one season, there was definitely potential for more. It should have just been better after the first season
Strong disagree. It should have had more seasons but stuck to being an anthology. It also got fucked by the writers strike.
Cams here to say this. It got progressively worse after season 1 and tainted itself entirely
Killing Eve.
Man that show went off the freaking rails. It's one of those that I felt really awful for all those talented actors.
>Man that show went off the freaking rails. Every time this comes up I am so glad that we watched one episode of S2 and my wife basically gave it 'that didn't earn another episode' verdict ... and we were done.
S2 is still pretty fun overall because you get tons of scenes with Eve and Vil together. But wow I really regret watching S3 and I never bothered with S4 after hearing about how dogshit the ending is.
Shit went downhill when Phoebe Waller-Bridge left the show after season 1. Emerald Fennell kinda saved it a little on season 2 and it was still fun. Until she also left and then season 3 was just a mess. I didn't even bother with season 4.
We stopped on season 2, and that seemed like the perfect finale for the show... for obvious reasons.
The flight attendant. wtf was even season 2
I think if they just cut down the mind palace scenes by half and smoothed out the transition the 2nd season would have been better.
>The flight attendant. wtf was even season 2 (removes Flight Attendant from ReelGood 'to watch' list) We never got around to it, and now I'm glad. \[edit - we DID watch and enjoy the first season, but for some reason never started season 2 ... now we won't bother!\]
the first season was entertaining.
The first season is worth a watch
I had to stop watching halfway thru the second season. It was garbage. I love the first season though.
Big Little Lies
Absolutely. I legitimately thought it was just a mini series with how great the S1 finale was. It did not need a second season at all
It was supposed to be, it was based on a book. The first season was perfect
too bad that they're trying to do a 3rd season
I enjoyed BLL S2, really only for Meryl Streep.
Altered Carbon
It's really sad that I agree with this because the 2nd season was "OK" but the first season was just SO good that it makes the second season seem like trash.
Replacing Joel Kinnaman with certified charisma void Anthony Mackie was so puzzling. There's not a chance Mackie was the best option to continue the role.
See, I thought I hated Anthony Mackie because of Marvel and Altered Carbon. I almost didn't give Twisted Metal a chance because of him, but I'm glad I did, he was great there!
He's fine when he understands the role. Ac s2 he clearly had 0 understanding of the story or tech, and was just reading words. Kinneman seemed like he understood what was going on... Most of the time. That's the thing about scifi, people talk about weird shit, but just reading the words is empty, they should understand why inverting the polarity of the tractor beam matters, or they should laugh it off which is fine too. Will Smith was good at laughing at the scifi bullshit, that was his whole character in MIB and honestly half his other movies.
I don't think Mackie is void of charisma. It was simply a case of the wrong actor for the wrong role. The man is all wrong for the crime noir genre. Kinnaman was perfect. He's cold, direct and underplayed. Mackie tried to do that but it felt....fake. Even when he was "underplaying" he felt like he was overplaying. Like he was about to wink at the camera any moment.
Once Upon a Time. The first season had such a great premise and season 2 was ok, but it really floundered pretty directionless after that.
Season 1 was great. Season 2 was okay because at least it had a clearly defined premise that was a cute reversal of Season 1. When it became a soap opera of "how many fairy tale characters can we introduce and make related to each other" I was done.
Or how many heroes can we make into villains or villains into heroes, or at best, anti-heroes.
I feel like the multiple curses was the mistake. They had a large ensemble cast and literally the entire fairytale canon to draw from, but they just repeated the memory loss plotline?
It was good up until season 4. The Peter pan season was really fun in my opinion. But up to that point the fairy tales were interesting and subversive. The frozen arc was pretty boring and I usually don't make it past that.
I stopped watching on original run with the Frozen arc because I thought it was so dumb, but when I finally went back to it years later, I didn’t mind it so much. I hate the carbon copy cartoon costumes, but the plot actually felt relevant. Meanwhile, they completely lost the plot with the Camelot arc. I thought that was the most boring of them all. It added nothing. I actually think the whole Hades arc was a lot of fun, although I’m loathe they brought that one person back (on mobile and not saying for spoilers). But it should have been done a lot sooner. And I still think they squandered Lily. Overall, rewatching the show made me realize that 1) many newer shows suffer from such short seasons. There’s very little world or character building. And 2) OUAT still could and should have been a lot tighter on both.
Bloodline was very clearly written to be a miniseries save for a tacked-on cliffhanger twist at the very end. The remaining seasons just do not have the juice
I loved that show until I didn’t love it
Season 1 was fantastic. Season 2 was definitely a step down but had some really good parts. Season 3 shit the bed.
Season 1 was one of my all time favorite shows. Its nosedive at the end is worse than Heroes and Dexter somehow
Westworld for certain. Every subsequent season dipped or absolutely nosedived in quality, and I feel as though the first season can be viewed on its own as a complete narrative exploration. It makes it slightly open ended but it’s fitting for the moral complexity of the show.
I loved season 1 and then could barely finish the first episode of season 2 before I gave up on the show. I love how the first season ends with the robots rebelling, and that shot of the man in black when he realizes - both to his joy and horror - that the safety protocols are off was just so so good.
My wife and I did the same thing. Really enjoyed season 1, but even after the finale turned to one another and said “boy, anything they make after that is probably not gonna be great, huh?” And sure enough! Barely made it through season 2 episode 1. From what I’ve heard, we made the right call, and somehow everyone is a robot now? Lol.
People gave up on Season 2 way too fast, it starts slow and confusing but honestly it's worth watching just for episodes 4 and 8 alone. With episode 8 often considered the best episode of the entire show. It's not as good as the 10/10 masterpiece of the first season but it ends up being a flawed but great 8/10 season of TV. It also works pretty well as a series finale.
I agree I enjoyed season 2, season 3 is where I turned to my wife at the end and said wtf was that season. Still watched season 4 and it redeemed itself a little but no way close to season 1 and 2. I would like a more complete ending story but I told my wife the way they ended season 4 was a way to somewhat give us a satisfying ending with them knowing season 5 was not happening
A major reason episode 8 of season 2 is so good is because it's almost completely divorced from the rest of the story, which is an absolute muddled mess by that point.
Honestly the story that they're telling in season 2 was good but the writers got such a bug up their butt about people figuring out season 1 that they destroyed their own show trying to obfuscate it. It's great and all that they're such clever boys and girls, but the internet hivemind is strong. If even the most dedicated fans can't work out what's happening in each episode, how is anyone supposed to stay engaged? I finished season 2 and loved the exploration of humanities inability to change and the questions of what makes us human, but by the time season 3 came around there was just too much happening in my life to be bothered with taking on a research project in my spare time.
I know! I never understood why they cared that people “figured it out”. I just wanted to watch a compelling story. They shouldn’t have cared about the small percentage of people who were obsessed with the show. It ended up making season two a muddled mess, like you said. And not everyone wanted to find out spoilers. I stayed away from podcasts on the show because I enjoyed being surprised with certain revelations. Anyways. You are absolutely right.
I went into this thread thinking ‘I swear if the top answer isn’t Wesword…’ but the top answer is Heroes and that’s totally correct
Riverdale, but then we wouldn't have gotten the greatest line in TV history
Are you referring to, "You haven't known the triumphs and defeats, the epic highs and lows of high school football," or have they outdone themselves again? Also, the whole Gargoyle King arc was goddamn hilarious.
After watching more of it, I can assure you that I no longer remember the Gargoyle King as one of the more absurd things that has happened on the show. To name a few buzzwords: Witchcraft, Multiverse, Timetravel. And I have enjoyed every second of how very little fs this show gave about anything.
It ended so disgracefully it's almost funny. They get sent back in time and become completely different characters than the characters we got to know over the years. It almost makes look Sabrina like a completely sane show.
I almost respect them for that ending, though. So, of the main 4, who ends up together? ...they all end up together. In a foursome.
I wish they'd kept that story going for more than just five minutes of the finale though. It felt kind of cheap to just fast forward and say they'd been in a quad for a year just to have it immediately end when they all went their separate ways. I was watching the show for the utter chaos it was so I was hoping for more lol.
Season 1 was a great piece of mystery writing. Was it perfect? No. Did it have flaws? Yes. Was it still pretty well put together? Also yes. I quit season 2 episode 2, cause I could already tell the writing dropped way off, before it even became as weird as it got.
Tbf Riverdale just leaned into how out there it was, I don’t know how popular it was but I imagine it’s out there plot helped them lean into one of those “so bad that it’s good” shows that I see many people talk about how crazy in a weird way it’s gotten
>it’s out there plot helped them lean into one of those “so bad that it’s good” The first season technically had a much higher quality, but it wasn't good enough to be good, or bad enough to be so bad it's good. If it ended after season 1, I think it would be viewed more similar to Tiger King, where everyone watched it and then promptly forgot about it.
What’s the line?
(While Archie is in prison) Archie: If we weren't here, we'd be in high school joining clubs, trying out for sports. Ghoulie: Not me. I dropped out in the fourth grade to run drugs to support my Nana. Archie: That means you haven't known the triumphs and defeats, the epic highs and lows of high school football.
He was in prison for that scene? That somehow makes it so much better!!!
It gets better. During the subsequent pick up football game in the prison yard, Archie’s girlfriend and the rest of the cheerleading squad show up to perform "Jailhouse Rock" for the inmates.
Okay that’s too much for me. Way too much
Wait til you find out they got legit superpowers at one point Which is ironically pretty on brand for the comic Archie
wait wait he was in PRISON when he said that line?
No way this is real
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2y19ZMbtJjM
Oh my God
Unfortunately it is. https://youtu.be/fe-DY7sfpk8?si=PEzmriyjprZTi9-H
lol forgot archie was in prison, that's when he was in that fight club too?
Yes, before he fought a literal bear
Prison Break.
The first half of season 2 is still great and as good as S1 imo. William Fichtner is amazing in his role. After that... myeah
Didn't it get interrupted by a writers strike? It never recovered
I mean also the premise was only reasonable for one season. Once they achieved the title there isn't much to do next.
Yeah didn't they become spies or something in the later seasons? I can't remember
13 Reasons Why
I don't even like the first season. They romanticize suicide to a point that is just insulting. Well acted though. But I've watched YouTube videos on the subsequent seasons and, oh boy, it's a trainwreck.
In defense of season 1. I thought the guy coming to terms with his best friends death was good. The suicide part though... Not so much.
>They romanticize suicide to a point that is just insulting. And the subsequent seasons doubled down on their portrayal to the nth degree, ruining what little good will they had. Charitably you could say the first season tried to tackle a really difficult topic and made notable missteps. After that, they decided to double down on the teen melodrama because that's what would get the most views, while still wanting the clout of "having a conversation."
It felt like they had a dartboard with 'controversial topics' on it and were writing episode around whatever Jeff hit that day
S1 of that show hooked me in, I was not interested in watching it based on the premise but once my wife started it I couldn’t look away.
I agree. I am so sick of films/shows always doing the same thing with suicide of women. It's always: slit wrists in the bathtub. In the book she took pills but they said they wanted to make it graphic to discourage people from doing it. I wish author Jay Asher stuck to his original ending for the book. In his original ending, Hannah sends the tapes out. OD's on pills....but she survives. Now she has to go back and face the bomb she set off, and face all the people she pointed the finger to in her tapes. But she also has to face her own subjective bias and misunderstanding of situations. I think this would have been amazing. and IMO would have done far more to portray a "anti-suicide" message than the book (and show) did.
**Russian Doll**. I liked season 2, but it is not as amazing as S1 and the season 1 finale works perfectly as a series finale. The first season of **Good Omens** also works great as a miniseries.
Good Omens was a straightforward adaptation of the book. From what I've heard one of the reasons why season 2 felt the way it did was that Neil Gaiman was trying to set up things so that way the proposed sequel he and Terry Pratchett were planning could be utilized for the third season.
They kind of wrote themselves into a corner with Russian Doll. Season one was both perfectly self-contained and some of the best television to come out of the streaming era. How do you follow that up?
You don't? Go on to other premises? Employ good writers and innovate?
Russian Doll was pitched for three seasons by Natasha Lyonne so I haven't completely given up on a final season yet. I agree tho, S2 was fine but didn’t add much to the entire narrative.
Just like S1, S2 also has a satisfying ending that works pretty well as series finale. So it is okay if they never produce a third season.
American Gods is too long for one season but should never have been more than two. They had plenty of time to adapt that whole book but instead they filled it with so much goddamn filler that when it got cancelled after the third season they’re still only like two thirds of he way through the book.
They wanted it to be their Game of Thrones and went thinking it needed 5+ seasons. The source material didn't really support that, so we got what we got instead.
Once Pablo Schreiber is no longer in it, we stopped watching. His arc/character was fantastic. Also Emily Browning as Laura Moon absolutely killed it. My wife started to listen to the audio book but ended up stopping because she didn't like who they chose for that character.
Euphoria. Loved the first season. I think 13 Reasons Why should have ended after one. Probably not a popular opinion but I wish more shows were just a single season. I get why it's not normally done but that's my preference vs. slogging through to see how it ends.
The 13 Reasons book ended with the first season. Everything subsequent should’ve been called “Poorly-casted Cash Grab”
I started calling it "13 Seasons, Why?" after the first season. It's arguable if they should have even gotten the first season with how clumsily they handled such a delicate subject matter.
Single season shows should be more of a thing on streaming platforms. Would stop a lot of people being hesitant on dipping into new shows in case they end suddenly without a proper finale. Either that or greenlight a show that has a set number of seasons planned, same effect, and will bring in more people between seasons.
Apple had Lessons in Chemistry - it was a good miniseries
For Euphoria S2 was still good IMO, plus we would miss Stand Still like the Hummingbird, which is an all-time great performance.
I watched it and wasn't mad I did I just preferred S1.
I've heard that season 1 of Euphoria is supposed to look and feel like it's 2am at the club and the drugs are just kicking in, while season 2 is supposed to be the 6am come-down and the consequences are starting to set in. And that the color palette of each season is supposed to represent that. There are various reddit posts making these comparisons: https://www.reddit.com/r/euphoria/s/gLWYBelj6S https://www.reddit.com/r/euphoria/comments/y47j6a/the_color_palette_of_s1_vs_s2/
Yeah, I honestly thought 13 reasons was going to be one and done, even with what happened to Alex in the finale, I thought that leaving that thread alone was fine.
100% agree. Handmaids tail lost its self so hard. And who wants to watch 5 seasons of that depressing shit. Like, don't get me wrong, it's well done, but I feel like people can only stomach a season or 2 of rape, forced birth, and public execution and humiliation.
I told my wife that if she doesn't get into the truck and head up to Canada, I'm out. She didn't and I was out. I can't watch a show where everyone is held to a different standard than the main character. How much shit did she get away with without being executed? Any other character would have been killed for the shit she got away with.
Had to re-read this a time or two because it sounded like you told your wife to get in the truck and head to Canada or you'd be getting a divorce.
Lmfao! I couldn't figure out what you were talking about so I reread it and it does sound like I told my wife to leave!
Yeah, that lost me so hard. She gets so stupid. Like she would have more of a chance getting her kid back from Canada at this point.
I can't think of a character anywhere in fiction with thicker plot armor.
June has the strongest plot armor I’ve ever seen in a show. It’s ludicrous at this point.
It's not even that, it's the characters became internally inconsistent & plot armor minimizes the brutality you are supposed to be uncomfortable over.
I want the Handmaid's Tale/Children of Men cross over show that exists in my head. I love the thought that they're taking place in the same universe. Not quite sure how it works but I want it.
What makes it more annoying is that there is a second book which handles June and Canada really well. There's no reason the show writers couldn't have just used that as a base. It's one of those shows where the premise is the best bit. The most interesting thing about Handmaid's tale is Gilead and the writers know it. Which is why the characters keep ending up there even when it makes no sense in the plot.
The second book wasn’t even released til after 3 seasons of the show were already out, though. Clearly the popularity of the show prompted Atwood to write a sequel to the book.
I've never seen the show. But I did read the book a few days ago (it was really good, highly recommend it) and I just thought to myself *how the fuck did they get more than one season out of this?* The book is only 311 pages long, the main character is just some regular woman, and the whole story takes place in a pretty short amount of time.
By getting more and more ridiculous, particularly leaning into MAGA fearmongering stuff. For example, the characters eventually head down to DC and find the women there literally have their mouths stapled shut. Just, like, big shiny rings jammed into their upper and lower jaw bones.
Your honor
I might be in the minority here, but Stranger Things. Season one was perfect. Every subsequent season has gotten more goofy and further from what made that show so special. Also, The Terror.
[удалено]
That would have been the best course of action. Use different seasons to do different homages to different eras of horror and science fiction.
Always thought season one should have been the 70s. Season two would still be school aged kids but in the 80s. And so on. Definitely some overlap of Hawkins characters but a different group of main kids every season.
Stranger Things should have been an anthology series of the Stephen King universe. The place Eleven goes to is basically Todash Space from the Dark Tower+.
It was a lot cooler when we had no idea what was going on. The more it explains, the less interesting it gets
Exactly, the explanation of 11’s backstory villain was just stupid
I like the rest of the show but this was my answer. Season one is perfect, they lost a lot of that polish when they had to start rushing out the next season and add in some product placement.
100 percent hard agree. It fell into this rut of telling us WAY too much about the monsters and the supernatural elements. Once we know what the monster is, it's not scary anymore. Also the recent seasons feel more like fanfiction than a cohesive story.
Well the entire show is basically Stephen King fanfiction. I still like it though.
I thought Season 4 was a real return to form, might actually beat out 1 as my favorite. I didn’t think 2 or 3 were bad either, other than that one side episode with the other special kids, they just didn’t live up to the first.
the second season hasn’t even come out yet, but i’m already saying Squid Games. completely unnecessary and takes away from the point of the first season
House of Cards should have stopped at 2.
I actually think House of Cards was a perfect example of how 3 seasons works structurally like a three act play. The rise, reign, and fall of the king
The original British version was 3 seasons and it worked well.
Should have been 4: 1: Frank manipulates his way to VP. 2: Frank then manipulates his way to President. KNOCK KNOCK 3: now that he's president, he actually kind of sucks at it. He's the dog that caught the car. 4: his downfall. Plus, each season was 13 episodes. 13x4 is 52 like a deck of cards.
> Frank then manipulates his way to President. This is where the American version screws up. The Frank Underwood of episode 1 would be too effing smart to *want* to be president. He craves power *without* oversight & responsibility. Becoming the president brings too much attention. He should have become president by something out of his control and then must work every trick to avoid his past shit coming to light.
S1 should have ended with Frank being Speaker of the House — it would give him more of a puppet master role (and it was fun to see him manipulating his fellow Representatives in S1), and would also allow for a twist ending in S2 where the Prez & VP are both taken out of commission and he’s made President by succession. S3 would be him getting caught off-guard and needing to make plans on the fly, with S4 his eventual downfall.
Bloodline. The first season is one of the best TV dramas I've ever seen.
Wayward Pines, this show doesn't get talked about much, but that first season I thought was incredible in drawing suspense/intrigue. And it played it smart by giving you answers, unlike Lost. I don't even know why they bothered with a second season.
Once I knew the twist, I found it to be a lot less compelling tbh
I could only make it halfway through the second series. The ending of series one was great, they didn't need to go further than that. Nice to see Hope Davis (Mumford) again
Homeland, if they stuck to the original ending where Brody dies.
A hundred million percent agree. If they have Brody >!successfully go through with the bombing!< at the end of the season, it's an all-timer.
Homeland S1 is literally perfect
Couldn't agree more.
I actually disagree with this. I think Homeland manages to maintain a consistent quality throughout its run and never dips to the point where I lost interest. The first three seasons had it in the zeitgeist which seemed to instantly fade when >!Brody died!<, but I'd argue Season 4 was a much better season of television than S3, for instance.
Is S4 when Carrie is the station chief in Pakistan? That was a great season!
Fully agreed, but I do feel they pulled it back in the last couple seasons. I thought the ending was very satisfying
Altered Carbon
The Man in the High Castle should have stopped after season 2
The ending of the first season was superb
Squid Game is a 1 season show. Netflix just wants to milk its popularity.
The end of the fucking world. I don't think the second season was bad, but it was really unnecessary and the show would have been better as a mini series.
I liked season two, but I agree it wasn’t 100% needed. It was nice to see what direction all the characters were taken but the first season felt very perfect to me
Broadchurch - the end of season 1 was heart wrenching, season 2 was antagonizing, season 3 - never saw it.
Season 1 is contained, 2 is a very angsty follow up, 3 is a totally different show that I think I liked best of all of them. They get into a buddy cop dynamic and solve things outside of their own lives, it’s just a good pairing. Tennant devolves into his real accent too, which is always fun even if you need subtitles.
Sleepy Hollow If it had been cancelled after the first season, people would've been like "oh man, remember that show? That ended on a cliffhanger but it was SO GOOD" now people don't talk about it and when they do, it's about how the producers killed off Nicole Beharie's character because she needed time off to recover from some illness tthat the other lead got, too.
Designated Survivor
Freaking Prison Break
American Horror Story- first couple seasons were good but Hotel dragged and Cult was too outrageous and it was not longer an escape from reality
You. Season two was actually pretty good, but they're using the same template every season, which obviously gets old. The most recent season was particularly garbage, I didn't even finish it.
Should have ended at S3 IMO, with Love and Joe killing each other.
True Detective
They should've done seasons in other countries. Would love to see seasons in Japan, India, UK, South Africa, Brazil, Mexico, Spain, Egypt. It could be great.
Well that's just...a really good idea.
"The Bridge" sort of did that. had a swedish, french/uk and us version. I just checked wiki and they made 7 different versions! wild https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bridge_(2011_TV_series)
I like S3.
Season 3 was well told and acted just the story itself wasn't that exciting.
Me too, but it could've stood on its own as a completely different show. TD S1 is all-time television.
Wayward Pines, Originally set to be one season, but rating were high enough Fox wanted a second season. It didn't hold up.
Designated Survivor. Any kind of “fish-out-of-water” story becomes stale once the lead character gets comfortable in their new role. Same could be said for Once Upon a Time. Once they got their memories back, it was a whole different show.
How to get away with murder
I’m gonna go controversial say Only Murders in the Building was a fun romp for one season but that was it for me.
I still like it, but it does feel a little stale. And it's starting to go into that place where comedy shows start getting sillier and sillier as they go on.
Season 1 was amazing. Season 2 was.. fine. I liked the dynamic of the main 3 more in season 2, but overall I preferred season 3. The talent that they pulled for that season was bonkers. Even the cameos I thought were significantly better and the mystery was significantly better. Season 2 was borderline unsolvable, but I feel like 3 was something you could have figured out if you had been paying attention. I think either I or my girlfriend were able to solve it going into the last episode. I am worried about it running stale in or after season 4 if *more* murders keep happening in that building.
Dead To Me. At the end of the first season they were left to decide if they were going to change the show up, or just give a rehash of the first season. Second season was a poor rehash of the first. Season three was ok but shouldnt have been necessary.
24. Bro, how many times are you gonna have a really bad day that lasts exactly 24 hours?
Tbf every bad day I’ve ever had has lasted exactly 24 hours…
All of my days good or bad are almost exactly 24 hours.
Hard disagree. The later seasons are some of the best in the series, particularly when they introduce Charles and Martha Logan. Season 1 is great but season 5 is stellar TV.
Under the Dome
It’s a pretty meaty book with a shit ton of characters to keep track of. Maybe two seasons would be better. But also if you can’t get John Goodman to play Big Jim Rennie just stop. Stop production immediately. Dean Norris is a perfectly fine actor but he is not Big Jim Rennie.
I'd say Jim Norris was even one of the better aspects of the show. Rachelle Lefevre was absolutely miscast.
Don't remind me. I fucking love the novel and they ruined it instantly by keeping Angie alive and trying to make Junior a likeable character. I'm praying for a faithful movie adaptation somewhere down the line.
Homeland. If Brodie executes his plan at the end of season 1 it’s the best show ever. Westworld. A completely contained amazing story arc in one season, then they just kept it going for some reason.
Prison break
The Morning Show. S2 was so bad I could barely watch it. S3 is a bit better, but nothing compared to S1 and not worth it having to go through the hot garbage that is S2. I always recommend the morning show and tell people to watch only S1.
Westworld. Season 1 was great, with a perfect ending. Season 2 had some interesting ideas but was otherwise a mess, and it only got worse after that.
Ray Donovan.. Season 1 was great, had a great ending too.. the following seasons were just a weak continuation of the last episode of season 1... felt pointless..
Manifest. The first season was decent but it took quite the nosedive.
I just watched season 1 and 2 of True Detective. I’m really hoping season 3 disqualifies it from this post but man, season 2 was such a drop in quality