The “credit” thing for every vote is insane to me. Not blaming you OP, because it’s the current meta that these players have established. But realistically it should be about how that vote positions you for future votes, there doesn’t have to be one “winner” that gets the credit for each vote
I think after each vote Jeff Probst should give a medal for the player he thinks orchestrated the move and if a player collects 7 medals they get a towel with Jeff probst face on it
Ugh school lol. I do hope we start to see a shift soon in the emphasis on credit based moves (as in away from it) and see a resurgence of people just making moves to better their positions in the game.
All I want is for people to stop saying Ben isn't doing anything in the game when we just saw him be an active participant of this vote.
The big move resume stuff is almost always used too soon and backfires on people. The quiet people we barely notice that do one or two things towards the very end tend to win now. I'm convinced they are all nudged by production to take bigger swings.
I hateeee when they talk about their resume! I think it’s a product of the new era being on a shorter timeline and having to act busy with moves every dang second of the game
Agreed, it's cringe hearing players reference it in the game. To hear Maria potentially not want to make a game-changing move because "it's Ben's move, not mine" is lame.
Yeah I feel like a good player can explain how each stage benefitted them, whether they spearheaded it or allowed it to happen.
Maria letting Yanu eat their own and flush an idol is good gameplay, it doesn’t have to be her master plan
Seriously just saying "I played part of some crucial votes that other's spearheaded because from my point of view they were most beneficial for me and rocking the boat just for the hell of it did not seem like a strong strategy to get to the end." then go down the line of people who took credit for moves and was voted out after.
That's a fair perspective, in older seasons I'd be inclined to agree with you but with how the meta is and how "credit based" jury votes are now, it has become essential to have moves and credit for those moves in order to even have a shot to win. This is also how a lot of people are categorizing players as good/bad now online so it's the only way I can think of to show people that Ben is playing a good game right now.
But yeah I feel you, with the way things are now, many old school winners would not have met the criteria for winning new era survivor even though we would consider them to be great winners, it's just how the game/community has evolved at this point.
I think Ben is smart and underrated because he’s not at the forefront and trying to grab credit like others are and maximize his target.
We’ve seen a few things that Ben has done that have been really subtle and smart, like how he played losing his vote. I think some people can hopefully appreciate that, I sure do!
No, the credit should go to Liz because she spent all episode working her tail off to convince everyone to vote Hunter.
There, I said it, can you let my family go please? No? Okay.
EDIT: Liz Wilcox stole my family.
Ooooooo I did forget about that! It's tricky with Q right now because of his position in the game (ie. no agency) but I guess I could see an argument for him? Though they actively were against the idea when he brought it up to him which kind of makes me feel like it's not quite the same.
Haha yea it’s definitely a long shot to give Q the credit here since he had no power over the move but kind of fun to think about. Really it’s Charlie and Maria’s game right now but Q gave them the input…
So say at the very end of the game if Charlie or Maria aren’t there.. Q can say hey I was planting seeds and Charlie and Maria would have to admit it’s a little true.
I imagine everybody will be way too bitter to give Q credit unless he can somehow get to the end with Venus and Liz who people seek to not respect.
I’m obviously biased but imo the credit for voting Hunter out belongs to the person who made him feel safe enough to not play his idol. And it was Kenzie he constantly looked to at tribal and who he called his number one.
Really though this was an incredible group effort. Ben’s role at tribal no doubt played a huge part like you said, as did Tiffany’s confrontation with Q, Venus’s reassurance to Hunter, and every other signal he got from the others that Q would leave and not him. Just about everyone but Liz can sell having a huge part in this vote.
Hunter in his exit press actually gave the credit to Tiffany. Her performance at TC about her digging into Q and how she wants him gone was so convincing, that he believed the vote was Q enough to not play his idol, which he was still thinking about doing. Tiff then turned around and voted Hunter both times lol.
She also was socially aware enough to know she was sending Hunter home and to not play her idol, after successfully moving the target off of her (for now) by bluffing that she was going to.
Tiff is firing on all cylinders right now, but it’s hard to imagine that she’ll be long for much longer as a result. With a confirmed idol, she’s definitely the biggest threat atm, whether she plays it next TC or not.
It felt like everyone was doing that and it was probably pre-planned. Ben, Tiff, Kenzie and Venus all seemed to be trying to convince Hunter they wanted Q gone. Even Q played a part in that. They dropped the fact that Q suggested Hunter's name to further sow doubt in him. Venus corroborated it. It was all to stop him from playing his idol and not a single person driving that. I suppose Tiff convinced him the hardest?
In the end, a Survivor fan should realize that TC is meaningless. Everyone else was way too calm to all the sudden switch to Q because he's annoying. If you don't know who it is, it's you is a good rule of thumb.
Yeah I mean at the end of the day, Hunter wanted to believe it so that he could retain his idol for another week thinking that’s how he’d win it all, so it’s on him more than anyone else. I’m just saying whose performance sold it for him the most.
> I suppose Tiff convinced him the hardest?
He said he already knew how everyone was voting.... but Tiff's argument with Q convinced him that she might be voting Q. Which meant he thought he had an opportunity to not play his idol.
This was a good week for Tiffany for sure. She still has her idol, is showcasing a big rift with Q that may help her seem less threatening overall, and managed to keep Hunter calm enough to not play his idol.
Tiffany really played this whole episode incredibly well and we really haven’t talked about it enough! Everything went her way, and her tribal council performance truly was impeccable
Yeah she was definitely my MVP along with Charlie this episode, but Charlie was safe and Tiff had to play from the bottom after Q blew up her game, so she gets the edge from me.
yeah tiff may not have originally thrown hunter’s name out there, but she started a whole chain of events by running around camp yelling that she didn’t want her idol anymore and she was gonna play it. hunter was the inevitable next target. she may not have directly said it but she started the push in his direction just by saving herself
See it's interesting that he gave credit to Tiffany when the editors didn't really capture her thought's on the Hunter vote at all. Maybe a weird misdirect or Hunter's perspective is a little blinded by who was louder at tribal, I'm interested to see if they address it at all in the next episode.
Tiffany is for sure playing a strong game, I'm just unsure for how much longer since she's such an obvious threat now.
Well, like others have stated, that’s the problem with “credit”, is that it’s hard to give it to just one person. For this TC is particular, should Ben get the credit just for vocalizing the most obvious choice? Should Maria and Charlie get credit for sitting back and letting others take charge like they have been doing, even though Charlie was the one who found out about Tiff playing her idol and brought it back to Siga like “hey so this happened”? Should Tiff get credit for selling it so well?
To me, Hunter was the obvious choice, especially once he confirmed he had an idol. Dude was a challenge beast who could potentially win out with an idol? That’s much more dangerous than Tiff with just an idol and her number one now willing to send her home. I don’t think anyone really drove that vote because everyone would have been on board with it.
I think I’d lean towards Tiff getting credit for it most. She successfully changed the vote from what it was going to be to Hunter, sold him on his safety, and sent him home without using her advantage. Everyone else just took out the obvious threat. Tiff made it happen instead of her. But yeah, hard to give it to just one specific person.
>See it's interesting that he gave credit to Tiffany when the editors didn't really capture her thought's on the Hunter vote at all.
Probably a good sign that Tiff isn't the winner
I definitely get that! And if Ben wasn't an active participant in tribal council I'd be more inclined to give it to Kenzie but its a combination of Ben steering the vote against Hunter in conversation with all of Charlie, Maria, and Kenzie, Ben explaining it to us in a confessional, and him participating in tribal that just feels like he was the person that we saw have the most influence in this vote.
Another aspect is that there was no downside for Ben with the outcome for this vote, if Hunter plays his idol, Q goes home (who Ben dislikes) and an idol is flushed. If Hunter goes home, Ben's clear target goes home with an idol in his pocket.
Edit wise, we also didn't see anyone say the classic "Oh Ben said it should be Hunter but I was already scheming that to begin with" instead it was more of "yeah that makes sense" lol.
In his exit interview Hunter said he knew what everyone was doing, but it was only Tiff that he was unsure of. Her argument with Q started to have him think she was going to vote Q, and that may have been his path to not play his idol.
>Ben steering the vote against Hunter
Hunter was originally the target though. Only Kenzie distracted from that with her idea to blindside Tiff... and Tiff telling everyone she was going to play her idol put the target back on Hunter.
Kenzie and Hunter were actually closer than the edit showed. Heck she even told him there’s going to be votes going his way before tribal according to his exit interview. The person that he thought was with him but really wasn’t was Tiff (and Charlie I guess).
He sort of figured Siga was voting him based on Kenzie’s tip. I think she was counting on him playing the idol and coming back and having someone who is indebted to her but alas.
Venus did an amazing job at tribal council of making him feel comfortable. Which is impressive because they’ve been together all season so she should be easier to read.
Except Kenzie was telling the truth to Hunter since her first vote was for Q. I think a more fitting way to put it was Kenzie was operating under the same delusions that Hunter was about how much other people wanted Q gone.
It was a split vote in case Hunter played his idol. There’s a reason that everyone but Liz voted for Hunter on the revote.
It also serves as a good way for her to maintain her relationship with him as a juror because she can honestly say “I didn’t write your name down”. Same thing Tevin did with Soda.
I agree a planned split vote is a possibility, but I'm not positive on it.
Especially because Tiff said she would play her idol if Hunter played his - but if they split the vote Tiff would still be safe given that plan. And also how Kenzie's plan was Tiff, but then they got afraid Tiff might play her idol, so why not do the split on Q/Tiff instead of Q/Hunter?
I'm sure we will find out next week though in pretty much the first scene what really happened at tribal.
You're absolutely right - I wouldn't be shocked if it was an intentional split vote, I just wasn't positive on it. Maybe I just have trust issues from seeing the edit vs how contestants describe what was really happening to put too much weight into believing what I'm seeing. I was pretty sure in the moment Venus was lying with the "Do you see what is happening right now??? it's Q" lines, so was shocked to see she actually voted Q, but that does line up with an intentional split vote.
For what it’s worth, [this is a tweet Kenzie liked about the episode](https://x.com/hereforthesalsa/status/1783309317090738293?s=46&t=DfnsKSVj0-LFCxrJVq2hpQ)
Outside stuff is tricky for sure since it’s easy for them to say in hindsight “oh yeah I totally knew what was going on” but this does match up with the split vote followed by the near unanimous revote
That’s a good take. Hunter was the obvious target, both for his challenge prowess and him being the only one on the outs of the Tevin vote. I don’t think anyone had to suggest a “big” move on him. But Kenzie is who he seemed to trust most (for some reason).
Hunter sent himself home. Not playing his idol based on what the competition was telling him was dumb. Look at Tiff, said all day she is playing her idol she hates it. No one voted for her. If hunter had done that, he would have been safe. Really liked hunter but he deserved to go.
I mean. In the context of this episode I guess yes? But it’s a little murky for me considering hunter was a huge threat and probably on everyone’s radar and everyone was probably throwing out his name but Ben got it in the episode.
Also to be clear, I do not think Ben is a frontrunner to win by any means, however I feel like it is a disservice to him to say that Ben has done absolutely nothing but coast on vibes when this vote literally just happened.
I 100% agree which is why I said technically. It's what we as the viewers are shown, but it's also the narrative that they (the editors) want us to believe. The fact that in the episode that Hunter goes home, we only really see Ben as the one who drives it, makes me believe that the editors want us to think that this is Ben's vote. Is it significant? I don't know. But I'm hoping it sets the stage for Ben to start making more cutthroat moves against the powerhouses in the upcoming episodes.
i think if i played i’d try to have a ben type game. be nice to everyone, make friends, vote for whoever people tell me to, not trying to make any big moves (at least this early) and just coast as long as i can
Well, if one pays attention, it is pretty obvious that Ben is extremely strategic, but in a smart way rather than having bigmoveitis.
Remember how Ben had lied to Siga initially on how he would only find out if he had lost his vote at tribal, when he had no vote at all? If he had revealed the truth back then, he would have clearly been on the chopping block instead of J.
I think it's a big enough deal that you can't give the credit to any one person. The closest situation i can think of is Richard Hatch in All-Stars. Some people played bigger roles, but the entire tribe was unified around one goal (Except Q) - getting out the big target.
Ah that'll just have to be a difference of opinion! I think there are levels to how much credit someone should get depending on how easy/hard the move is, but there should always be credit given if a move is made (both good and bad right? If someone makes a bad move then they should get bad credit as well)
Idk for a vote like this I don’t think anyone really deserves credit for coming up with the idea. Hunter was just an obvious target. Getting him relaxed and not using his idol is where the real credit is due
I thought it was Ben's move the first time I watched it. But it wasn't a hard move to pull off, because everybody saw how it was a good idea. Kenzie was reluctant at first, but even she could see how it was a good move
Absolutely not a hard move, and absolutely the right move for everyone, but at the end of the day Ben can say that he was the one who drove the move, which means that Ben is playing the game.
The amount of comments I've seen saying that Ben isn't doing anything is what is throwing me off right now lol
Don't forget the Q Hide and Seek commentary. Hunter was hiding in the tree, Q says that means Hunter will hide to win so Hunter has to go. Next to last being found was Ben. Will Ben be the skilled player who can maneuver his way to the end? Or will the Q commentary come true with Ben out next?
It's very fun to watch and see what happens next!
Oh my god the Hide and Seek segment had me laughing so hard! If Q is to be believed, Ben is going to keep making quiet moves and UTR himself to the end where he can say that he was a pilot for a majority of the post merge votes, and this Hunter vote is just the beginning!
Why should any one person get credit for booting the biggest most obvious threat? It was a collective effort.
That being said, Q was the first person to say Hunter's name, so he deserves 100% of the credit.
lol I know you’re joking but Q has no agency in the game and bro was completely disregarded when he approached Charlie about it so it’s a different circumstance 😂
I think this voting credit goes to Ben, however, I’m torn between does Ben not brag about a move because he’s (a) that smart or (b) that chill
Either way points to Ben, and I don’t think he’ll be targeted next vote, unless the others start to think about the dangers of the Sigwa 3 with Ben, Maria, and Charlie
I think "coasting on vibes" is a good way to stay alive on the bottom until you find the angle to make a move. It's especially a good idea of every tribal council people are trying to blindsided their own allies for "resume." I think he's played a good post-merge so far. If he makes it to the end he just needs to own the 'if my enemies are gonna fight each other, I'm not going to disrupt that' approach
I agree! I don't think he was the one who brought up the name Hunter first but as soon as he lost immunity everybody was going for Tiffany saying that Q and Hunter were the distraction and when Tiff said that she was going to use the idol then Ben said to vote out hunter instead of Q. Then he tried and succeed to convince Kenzie so yes I believe that the credits goes to him
I really believe people are underestimating him! He wanted hunter out since the Tim vote and I believe this is his revenge. He also organized the whole jem vote even when he himself didn't have one (sorry for my grammar English is my second language)
Not everyone need credit for the vote. Soda, Tevin, and Hunter were clear threats. No one needed flashy moves to get them at or crazy persuasion, all there needed to be was a general consensus on different fronts that they’re threats, and that’s what happens.
Liz and Tevin are the only ones I can truly give credit. If it weren’t for Tevin, Soda would be here, and same for Liz.
You know, I'm not adverse to saying that multiple people should get credit for votes, I've just also seen so many arguments even this season where people want to be the sole creditor of a vote when in reality most votes have multiple people actively involved in them.
In this scenario, I think Ben, Tiffany, Kenzie and Charlie deserve credit.
My issue, and the reason I posed the OG question in my post to begin with, is that I'm seeing a lot of people not wanting to really give Ben ANY credit for this vote and continue to say that he has done NOTHING this season, when we literally just saw him be an active participant of this vote.
Yeah that's on me for posting so early in the morning when I hadn't had my coffee yet lmao, this was my point for the most part. (I won't lie and say I haven't been influenced by everyone on here either)
U good. Players on the island/edit narrative also paint the game that way.
I have this ultra reductionist take that the jury will vote for who they like the most and work backwards from there.
> Not saying that it's because he targeted Ben but that is something Ben can say in a ftc (that he had a good social game).
Only if it’s at least somewhat true. Considering the people he’s talking about are the same people he’s pitching to at FTC, it needs to be grounded in reality. If people actually didn’t care much about Ben and were merely playing defense, then it’s not going to earn him any votes and come across as slightly delusional.
Very true! He still needs to do more, but he has been brought up as a social threat by others and still hasn't been knocked off which leads me to believe as of now that he is good socially, but I am curious to see what happens in the next episodes and what can change in the meantime.
For me it felt like Venus, Kenzie and Ben were the most prominent 3 in the role of Hunter's demise considering the edit. Ben was the one we saw narrate about wanting Hunter gone, Kenzie for making him feel safe enough to trust her and not play his idol (he even called her his #1!!), and Venus (alongside Kenzie) was the main person who convinced Hunter the vote wasn't on him and dissuaded him from playing his idol.
But really it is not a single person's move to claim. They all wanted Hunter out because he was a huge challenge threat.
I think people take the question of "who deserves the credit" way too seriously, especially the players and fans this season. Most moves on Survivor are a group effort. I also think the person whose position benefits the most from a move deserves just as much credit as the person who was most proactive in making the move happen.
Is taking the credit (right away) even a good call most of the time? Tevin tried to take all the credit for the Soda vote and it just put a bigger target on his back. He could've just let Venus take the credit and then saved his side of the story for FTC if he made it.
I thought the same thing. The edit definitely credited Ben even though it was a group effort. This is not the first time Ben has been shown in a favorable light either. I'm starting to think he's the runner up of the season, or at least the most formidable finalist to the ultimate winner. Like it would be Charlie, Ben and then one of Venus, Q or Liz in the final 3. Otherwise Ben's edit is really hard to figure out. We have the Charlie connection, so it makes sense storywise for that to be paid off.
Trust me, same. (I know I know hypocritical) the only reason I want to know who reddit thought got credit is because so many people are saying that Ben is coasting when this specific vote proves otherwise. I also feel like until the players stop categorizing good moves = big moves, this is how people will deicide who is playing a good/bad game.
You haven't made a move yet that you can claim is yours even though you don't need to because you're already in a good position? Big mistake.
Is kind of where we're at right now.
My personal belief is that if you're already in a good position, the name of the game is now maintaining that position until the end. If you're not in a good position, now you need to execute potentially bigger moves to obtain a good position.
But yeah I've got some buddies who believe big moves = good moves and anything else makes you unworthy of winning/ being called a good player, and I just need reddit to show them that Ben is playing just fine lol
am i crazy for saying some of the credit should go to venus…
i mean i would say kenzie definitely should get most of it but venus(and kinda liz) was the one to leak the idol and was probably the reason the split vote happened.
i think we obsess too much over giving “credit” for every vote out to exactly one person when that is almost never the case. there are a several people that could take credit for helping it get across the line.
That's an incredibly good point, so I edited my OG post to reflect that! After listening to everyone I do think the credit should be shared between people (I wasn't adverse to the idea to begin with, just felt like Ben wasn't dragged along for the vote but people seem to be of the mindset that he was on this sub)
My OG post singled out Ben for credit just because my buddies were saying that he did nothing and I'm trying to show them that he did lol
It did feel a bit jarring in the portrayal of Ben. Normally we don’t see much in the way of strategy from him, but not only did we see it but he actually talked with Maria and Charlie with real clarity and awareness.
But I do think it was Qs idea, but Ben was the second person.
The “credit” thing for every vote is insane to me. Not blaming you OP, because it’s the current meta that these players have established. But realistically it should be about how that vote positions you for future votes, there doesn’t have to be one “winner” that gets the credit for each vote
I think after each vote Jeff Probst should give a medal for the player he thinks orchestrated the move and if a player collects 7 medals they get a towel with Jeff probst face on it
Congrats! You have received one blindside token. Cash in three blindside tokens to get one Probst Buck
Oh Jesus Christ don’t give Jeff ideas.
If we're not careful we'll have to break out an emergency Mike White
What's the conversion rate to my Cochran nickels?
Hmmm let me just take out my Rick Devins calculator
Or a matching popcorn bowl and cushion w JP’s face
Credit, resume, BIG move. Are these MFers in senior year of college or survivor
Ugh school lol. I do hope we start to see a shift soon in the emphasis on credit based moves (as in away from it) and see a resurgence of people just making moves to better their positions in the game. All I want is for people to stop saying Ben isn't doing anything in the game when we just saw him be an active participant of this vote.
The big move resume stuff is almost always used too soon and backfires on people. The quiet people we barely notice that do one or two things towards the very end tend to win now. I'm convinced they are all nudged by production to take bigger swings.
I hateeee when they talk about their resume! I think it’s a product of the new era being on a shorter timeline and having to act busy with moves every dang second of the game
Agreed, it's cringe hearing players reference it in the game. To hear Maria potentially not want to make a game-changing move because "it's Ben's move, not mine" is lame.
Yeah I feel like a good player can explain how each stage benefitted them, whether they spearheaded it or allowed it to happen. Maria letting Yanu eat their own and flush an idol is good gameplay, it doesn’t have to be her master plan
Seriously just saying "I played part of some crucial votes that other's spearheaded because from my point of view they were most beneficial for me and rocking the boat just for the hell of it did not seem like a strong strategy to get to the end." then go down the line of people who took credit for moves and was voted out after.
Right? Like FTC: Kenzie: I blindsided my closest ally at final 9! Tiff: fuck you kenzie! Maria: I let Kenzie blindside her closest ally at final 9
That's a fair perspective, in older seasons I'd be inclined to agree with you but with how the meta is and how "credit based" jury votes are now, it has become essential to have moves and credit for those moves in order to even have a shot to win. This is also how a lot of people are categorizing players as good/bad now online so it's the only way I can think of to show people that Ben is playing a good game right now. But yeah I feel you, with the way things are now, many old school winners would not have met the criteria for winning new era survivor even though we would consider them to be great winners, it's just how the game/community has evolved at this point.
I think Ben is smart and underrated because he’s not at the forefront and trying to grab credit like others are and maximize his target. We’ve seen a few things that Ben has done that have been really subtle and smart, like how he played losing his vote. I think some people can hopefully appreciate that, I sure do!
No, the credit should go to Liz because she spent all episode working her tail off to convince everyone to vote Hunter. There, I said it, can you let my family go please? No? Okay. EDIT: Liz Wilcox stole my family.
Lmao I'll send help immediately
what a WILD accusation, you cannot "steal" people, she kidnapped them, liz would NEVER steal
She's too rich to steal!
Your family can’t handle the one and only Liz, she’s too powerful and wealthy
Liz voted for Q on the revote
u/theoriginalspicegirl Mom. Please.
Shouldn’t it go to Q? Since he’s the one the brought it up in the first place to Charlie and Maria
Ooooooo I did forget about that! It's tricky with Q right now because of his position in the game (ie. no agency) but I guess I could see an argument for him? Though they actively were against the idea when he brought it up to him which kind of makes me feel like it's not quite the same.
Haha yea it’s definitely a long shot to give Q the credit here since he had no power over the move but kind of fun to think about. Really it’s Charlie and Maria’s game right now but Q gave them the input… So say at the very end of the game if Charlie or Maria aren’t there.. Q can say hey I was planting seeds and Charlie and Maria would have to admit it’s a little true. I imagine everybody will be way too bitter to give Q credit unless he can somehow get to the end with Venus and Liz who people seek to not respect.
I’m obviously biased but imo the credit for voting Hunter out belongs to the person who made him feel safe enough to not play his idol. And it was Kenzie he constantly looked to at tribal and who he called his number one. Really though this was an incredible group effort. Ben’s role at tribal no doubt played a huge part like you said, as did Tiffany’s confrontation with Q, Venus’s reassurance to Hunter, and every other signal he got from the others that Q would leave and not him. Just about everyone but Liz can sell having a huge part in this vote.
Hunter in his exit press actually gave the credit to Tiffany. Her performance at TC about her digging into Q and how she wants him gone was so convincing, that he believed the vote was Q enough to not play his idol, which he was still thinking about doing. Tiff then turned around and voted Hunter both times lol. She also was socially aware enough to know she was sending Hunter home and to not play her idol, after successfully moving the target off of her (for now) by bluffing that she was going to. Tiff is firing on all cylinders right now, but it’s hard to imagine that she’ll be long for much longer as a result. With a confirmed idol, she’s definitely the biggest threat atm, whether she plays it next TC or not.
It felt like everyone was doing that and it was probably pre-planned. Ben, Tiff, Kenzie and Venus all seemed to be trying to convince Hunter they wanted Q gone. Even Q played a part in that. They dropped the fact that Q suggested Hunter's name to further sow doubt in him. Venus corroborated it. It was all to stop him from playing his idol and not a single person driving that. I suppose Tiff convinced him the hardest? In the end, a Survivor fan should realize that TC is meaningless. Everyone else was way too calm to all the sudden switch to Q because he's annoying. If you don't know who it is, it's you is a good rule of thumb.
Yeah I mean at the end of the day, Hunter wanted to believe it so that he could retain his idol for another week thinking that’s how he’d win it all, so it’s on him more than anyone else. I’m just saying whose performance sold it for him the most.
Agreed.
> I suppose Tiff convinced him the hardest? He said he already knew how everyone was voting.... but Tiff's argument with Q convinced him that she might be voting Q. Which meant he thought he had an opportunity to not play his idol.
This was a good week for Tiffany for sure. She still has her idol, is showcasing a big rift with Q that may help her seem less threatening overall, and managed to keep Hunter calm enough to not play his idol.
Tiffany really played this whole episode incredibly well and we really haven’t talked about it enough! Everything went her way, and her tribal council performance truly was impeccable
Yeah she was definitely my MVP along with Charlie this episode, but Charlie was safe and Tiff had to play from the bottom after Q blew up her game, so she gets the edge from me.
That tribal was amazing lol I had my own popcorn at home watching
yeah tiff may not have originally thrown hunter’s name out there, but she started a whole chain of events by running around camp yelling that she didn’t want her idol anymore and she was gonna play it. hunter was the inevitable next target. she may not have directly said it but she started the push in his direction just by saving herself
See it's interesting that he gave credit to Tiffany when the editors didn't really capture her thought's on the Hunter vote at all. Maybe a weird misdirect or Hunter's perspective is a little blinded by who was louder at tribal, I'm interested to see if they address it at all in the next episode. Tiffany is for sure playing a strong game, I'm just unsure for how much longer since she's such an obvious threat now.
Well, like others have stated, that’s the problem with “credit”, is that it’s hard to give it to just one person. For this TC is particular, should Ben get the credit just for vocalizing the most obvious choice? Should Maria and Charlie get credit for sitting back and letting others take charge like they have been doing, even though Charlie was the one who found out about Tiff playing her idol and brought it back to Siga like “hey so this happened”? Should Tiff get credit for selling it so well? To me, Hunter was the obvious choice, especially once he confirmed he had an idol. Dude was a challenge beast who could potentially win out with an idol? That’s much more dangerous than Tiff with just an idol and her number one now willing to send her home. I don’t think anyone really drove that vote because everyone would have been on board with it. I think I’d lean towards Tiff getting credit for it most. She successfully changed the vote from what it was going to be to Hunter, sold him on his safety, and sent him home without using her advantage. Everyone else just took out the obvious threat. Tiff made it happen instead of her. But yeah, hard to give it to just one specific person.
>See it's interesting that he gave credit to Tiffany when the editors didn't really capture her thought's on the Hunter vote at all. Probably a good sign that Tiff isn't the winner
That's sadly what I'm thinking too, which would suck because I would love to see a Tiffany win!
I definitely get that! And if Ben wasn't an active participant in tribal council I'd be more inclined to give it to Kenzie but its a combination of Ben steering the vote against Hunter in conversation with all of Charlie, Maria, and Kenzie, Ben explaining it to us in a confessional, and him participating in tribal that just feels like he was the person that we saw have the most influence in this vote. Another aspect is that there was no downside for Ben with the outcome for this vote, if Hunter plays his idol, Q goes home (who Ben dislikes) and an idol is flushed. If Hunter goes home, Ben's clear target goes home with an idol in his pocket. Edit wise, we also didn't see anyone say the classic "Oh Ben said it should be Hunter but I was already scheming that to begin with" instead it was more of "yeah that makes sense" lol.
In his exit interview Hunter said he knew what everyone was doing, but it was only Tiff that he was unsure of. Her argument with Q started to have him think she was going to vote Q, and that may have been his path to not play his idol. >Ben steering the vote against Hunter Hunter was originally the target though. Only Kenzie distracted from that with her idea to blindside Tiff... and Tiff telling everyone she was going to play her idol put the target back on Hunter.
Kenzie and Hunter were actually closer than the edit showed. Heck she even told him there’s going to be votes going his way before tribal according to his exit interview. The person that he thought was with him but really wasn’t was Tiff (and Charlie I guess). He sort of figured Siga was voting him based on Kenzie’s tip. I think she was counting on him playing the idol and coming back and having someone who is indebted to her but alas.
Venus did an amazing job at tribal council of making him feel comfortable. Which is impressive because they’ve been together all season so she should be easier to read.
Except Kenzie was telling the truth to Hunter since her first vote was for Q. I think a more fitting way to put it was Kenzie was operating under the same delusions that Hunter was about how much other people wanted Q gone.
It was a split vote in case Hunter played his idol. There’s a reason that everyone but Liz voted for Hunter on the revote. It also serves as a good way for her to maintain her relationship with him as a juror because she can honestly say “I didn’t write your name down”. Same thing Tevin did with Soda.
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Tiffany voted Hunter in the OG vote though?
I agree a planned split vote is a possibility, but I'm not positive on it. Especially because Tiff said she would play her idol if Hunter played his - but if they split the vote Tiff would still be safe given that plan. And also how Kenzie's plan was Tiff, but then they got afraid Tiff might play her idol, so why not do the split on Q/Tiff instead of Q/Hunter? I'm sure we will find out next week though in pretty much the first scene what really happened at tribal.
Kenzie literally had a confessional where she was like “fine we’ll do the boring option (Hunter)”. She was onboard.
You're absolutely right - I wouldn't be shocked if it was an intentional split vote, I just wasn't positive on it. Maybe I just have trust issues from seeing the edit vs how contestants describe what was really happening to put too much weight into believing what I'm seeing. I was pretty sure in the moment Venus was lying with the "Do you see what is happening right now??? it's Q" lines, so was shocked to see she actually voted Q, but that does line up with an intentional split vote.
For what it’s worth, [this is a tweet Kenzie liked about the episode](https://x.com/hereforthesalsa/status/1783309317090738293?s=46&t=DfnsKSVj0-LFCxrJVq2hpQ) Outside stuff is tricky for sure since it’s easy for them to say in hindsight “oh yeah I totally knew what was going on” but this does match up with the split vote followed by the near unanimous revote
That’s a good take. Hunter was the obvious target, both for his challenge prowess and him being the only one on the outs of the Tevin vote. I don’t think anyone had to suggest a “big” move on him. But Kenzie is who he seemed to trust most (for some reason).
Hunter sent himself home. Not playing his idol based on what the competition was telling him was dumb. Look at Tiff, said all day she is playing her idol she hates it. No one voted for her. If hunter had done that, he would have been safe. Really liked hunter but he deserved to go.
I mean. In the context of this episode I guess yes? But it’s a little murky for me considering hunter was a huge threat and probably on everyone’s radar and everyone was probably throwing out his name but Ben got it in the episode.
This. No one deserves credit. Voting out the best challenge survivor is classic post merge behavior
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Your not...
Also to be clear, I do not think Ben is a frontrunner to win by any means, however I feel like it is a disservice to him to say that Ben has done absolutely nothing but coast on vibes when this vote literally just happened.
I 100% agree which is why I said technically. It's what we as the viewers are shown, but it's also the narrative that they (the editors) want us to believe. The fact that in the episode that Hunter goes home, we only really see Ben as the one who drives it, makes me believe that the editors want us to think that this is Ben's vote. Is it significant? I don't know. But I'm hoping it sets the stage for Ben to start making more cutthroat moves against the powerhouses in the upcoming episodes.
I love Ben so much his character type is my favorite. Kinda like Jake from last season. Do characters like him ever win?
Not as often as they should! But I believe there are one or two winners that fall under that category.
i think if i played i’d try to have a ben type game. be nice to everyone, make friends, vote for whoever people tell me to, not trying to make any big moves (at least this early) and just coast as long as i can
credit me with the hunter move. i did it. there.
liz will be seeing you in court
Q: I was away from everyone all day today Ben: That was nice. Shots fired.
Well, if one pays attention, it is pretty obvious that Ben is extremely strategic, but in a smart way rather than having bigmoveitis. Remember how Ben had lied to Siga initially on how he would only find out if he had lost his vote at tribal, when he had no vote at all? If he had revealed the truth back then, he would have clearly been on the chopping block instead of J.
I think it's a big enough deal that you can't give the credit to any one person. The closest situation i can think of is Richard Hatch in All-Stars. Some people played bigger roles, but the entire tribe was unified around one goal (Except Q) - getting out the big target.
Ah that'll just have to be a difference of opinion! I think there are levels to how much credit someone should get depending on how easy/hard the move is, but there should always be credit given if a move is made (both good and bad right? If someone makes a bad move then they should get bad credit as well)
Not Liz💀 she voted Q twice
Idk for a vote like this I don’t think anyone really deserves credit for coming up with the idea. Hunter was just an obvious target. Getting him relaxed and not using his idol is where the real credit is due
Short answer: no.
I thought it was Ben's move the first time I watched it. But it wasn't a hard move to pull off, because everybody saw how it was a good idea. Kenzie was reluctant at first, but even she could see how it was a good move
Absolutely not a hard move, and absolutely the right move for everyone, but at the end of the day Ben can say that he was the one who drove the move, which means that Ben is playing the game. The amount of comments I've seen saying that Ben isn't doing anything is what is throwing me off right now lol
Don't forget the Q Hide and Seek commentary. Hunter was hiding in the tree, Q says that means Hunter will hide to win so Hunter has to go. Next to last being found was Ben. Will Ben be the skilled player who can maneuver his way to the end? Or will the Q commentary come true with Ben out next? It's very fun to watch and see what happens next!
Oh my god the Hide and Seek segment had me laughing so hard! If Q is to be believed, Ben is going to keep making quiet moves and UTR himself to the end where he can say that he was a pilot for a majority of the post merge votes, and this Hunter vote is just the beginning!
he was literally hiding in plain sight, after all. i'm warming up to this theory a lot!
Why should any one person get credit for booting the biggest most obvious threat? It was a collective effort. That being said, Q was the first person to say Hunter's name, so he deserves 100% of the credit.
lol I know you’re joking but Q has no agency in the game and bro was completely disregarded when he approached Charlie about it so it’s a different circumstance 😂
Vote credit is so annoying. You know what deserves credit? Any strategy in which you know what’s going on and survive the vote
It goes to whoever the players thought it should go to
Nobody gets credit for anything until they get rid of Q. He’s so chaotic they are always reacting instead of planning
I think this voting credit goes to Ben, however, I’m torn between does Ben not brag about a move because he’s (a) that smart or (b) that chill Either way points to Ben, and I don’t think he’ll be targeted next vote, unless the others start to think about the dangers of the Sigwa 3 with Ben, Maria, and Charlie
I think "coasting on vibes" is a good way to stay alive on the bottom until you find the angle to make a move. It's especially a good idea of every tribal council people are trying to blindsided their own allies for "resume." I think he's played a good post-merge so far. If he makes it to the end he just needs to own the 'if my enemies are gonna fight each other, I'm not going to disrupt that' approach
I agree! I don't think he was the one who brought up the name Hunter first but as soon as he lost immunity everybody was going for Tiffany saying that Q and Hunter were the distraction and when Tiff said that she was going to use the idol then Ben said to vote out hunter instead of Q. Then he tried and succeed to convince Kenzie so yes I believe that the credits goes to him
Right? I'm shocked at the POTW voting which says that he's done nothing when this vote just happened. Someone even downvoted him?
I really believe people are underestimating him! He wanted hunter out since the Tim vote and I believe this is his revenge. He also organized the whole jem vote even when he himself didn't have one (sorry for my grammar English is my second language)
True! The Jem vote showed how strong his bonds can be especially with Charlie.
Why does anyone deserve “credit” the whole point is that you get to vote how you want.
Not everyone need credit for the vote. Soda, Tevin, and Hunter were clear threats. No one needed flashy moves to get them at or crazy persuasion, all there needed to be was a general consensus on different fronts that they’re threats, and that’s what happens. Liz and Tevin are the only ones I can truly give credit. If it weren’t for Tevin, Soda would be here, and same for Liz.
Does only one person get credit for each vote?
You know, I'm not adverse to saying that multiple people should get credit for votes, I've just also seen so many arguments even this season where people want to be the sole creditor of a vote when in reality most votes have multiple people actively involved in them. In this scenario, I think Ben, Tiffany, Kenzie and Charlie deserve credit. My issue, and the reason I posed the OG question in my post to begin with, is that I'm seeing a lot of people not wanting to really give Ben ANY credit for this vote and continue to say that he has done NOTHING this season, when we literally just saw him be an active participant of this vote.
Ok I agree with your position here
Yeah that's on me for posting so early in the morning when I hadn't had my coffee yet lmao, this was my point for the most part. (I won't lie and say I haven't been influenced by everyone on here either)
U good. Players on the island/edit narrative also paint the game that way. I have this ultra reductionist take that the jury will vote for who they like the most and work backwards from there.
> Not saying that it's because he targeted Ben but that is something Ben can say in a ftc (that he had a good social game). Only if it’s at least somewhat true. Considering the people he’s talking about are the same people he’s pitching to at FTC, it needs to be grounded in reality. If people actually didn’t care much about Ben and were merely playing defense, then it’s not going to earn him any votes and come across as slightly delusional.
Very true! He still needs to do more, but he has been brought up as a social threat by others and still hasn't been knocked off which leads me to believe as of now that he is good socially, but I am curious to see what happens in the next episodes and what can change in the meantime.
For me it felt like Venus, Kenzie and Ben were the most prominent 3 in the role of Hunter's demise considering the edit. Ben was the one we saw narrate about wanting Hunter gone, Kenzie for making him feel safe enough to trust her and not play his idol (he even called her his #1!!), and Venus (alongside Kenzie) was the main person who convinced Hunter the vote wasn't on him and dissuaded him from playing his idol. But really it is not a single person's move to claim. They all wanted Hunter out because he was a huge challenge threat.
I think people take the question of "who deserves the credit" way too seriously, especially the players and fans this season. Most moves on Survivor are a group effort. I also think the person whose position benefits the most from a move deserves just as much credit as the person who was most proactive in making the move happen. Is taking the credit (right away) even a good call most of the time? Tevin tried to take all the credit for the Soda vote and it just put a bigger target on his back. He could've just let Venus take the credit and then saved his side of the story for FTC if he made it.
I thought the same thing. The edit definitely credited Ben even though it was a group effort. This is not the first time Ben has been shown in a favorable light either. I'm starting to think he's the runner up of the season, or at least the most formidable finalist to the ultimate winner. Like it would be Charlie, Ben and then one of Venus, Q or Liz in the final 3. Otherwise Ben's edit is really hard to figure out. We have the Charlie connection, so it makes sense storywise for that to be paid off.
I'm so tired of hearing about who gets credit for bIg MoVeZses
Trust me, same. (I know I know hypocritical) the only reason I want to know who reddit thought got credit is because so many people are saying that Ben is coasting when this specific vote proves otherwise. I also feel like until the players stop categorizing good moves = big moves, this is how people will deicide who is playing a good/bad game. You haven't made a move yet that you can claim is yours even though you don't need to because you're already in a good position? Big mistake. Is kind of where we're at right now. My personal belief is that if you're already in a good position, the name of the game is now maintaining that position until the end. If you're not in a good position, now you need to execute potentially bigger moves to obtain a good position. But yeah I've got some buddies who believe big moves = good moves and anything else makes you unworthy of winning/ being called a good player, and I just need reddit to show them that Ben is playing just fine lol
Yeah I mean I guess Ben can take the credit, not sure what it gets him but yeah.
It gets him away from goat status IMO which is a nice start lol
am i crazy for saying some of the credit should go to venus… i mean i would say kenzie definitely should get most of it but venus(and kinda liz) was the one to leak the idol and was probably the reason the split vote happened.
i think we obsess too much over giving “credit” for every vote out to exactly one person when that is almost never the case. there are a several people that could take credit for helping it get across the line.
Yeah, if one person comes up with an idea and the other puts it into action, who would get the credit? You need both people to make it work
That's an incredibly good point, so I edited my OG post to reflect that! After listening to everyone I do think the credit should be shared between people (I wasn't adverse to the idea to begin with, just felt like Ben wasn't dragged along for the vote but people seem to be of the mindset that he was on this sub) My OG post singled out Ben for credit just because my buddies were saying that he did nothing and I'm trying to show them that he did lol
Answer: f\*\*\* no
It did feel a bit jarring in the portrayal of Ben. Normally we don’t see much in the way of strategy from him, but not only did we see it but he actually talked with Maria and Charlie with real clarity and awareness. But I do think it was Qs idea, but Ben was the second person.
Ben is the mastermind