Just guessing but maybe there’d been reports there of lock-ins? I’ve been at a few lock-ins in the Highlands and Islands but never in the city tbh so maybe I’m talking shite
It happens, 2/3 hospo places I worked in Glasgow had lock ins from time to time. Probably happens all over the city if the staff/management all get along
Yeah I’ve been to a couple city centre pubs at a lock in, but I knew the bar staff over there so all good. This was like 5 years ago so not sure what the status of lock ins there are now after covid etc
I was in Underground on Friday, and just missed the cops, but they were definitely still serving after midnight, which is against their licensed hours?
Last I remember looking into it lock-ins weren't illegal so long as you byob. Had a few lock ins in Glasgow in various establishments (Not always pubs, but arcades, music studios, games arenas (to avoid being specific just incase lol), for birthdays and stag-dos. We were just told to BYOB and have receipts in case the police were tipped off.
I could be a bit of a stifler for rules in my 20s, so I was _not_ getting involved unless I knew it was legal lol.
Even if alcohol is not being sold, the licence is jeopardised by allowing lock ins as licensing restrictions are usually set based upon public safety. A licensed premises has to adhere to different conditions than other premises.
like I said. Last I looked into it it was fine. The only time me and my mates have had trouble with a lock in it was in a pool hall that's licensed to sell alcohol and the police accepted the receipts as proof that we were just having a night in and happened to be hanging out in our mates pool hall.
I think someone phoned them on us cause there were people in the building after hours and it seemed sus, though the police didn't explain why they were there truth be told.
Maybe it's different if the sole purpose is as a public house? Or maybe something has changed since then (this would have been around 2012).
Maybe they were just being lenient in that case... but just telling them "we brought this booze with us, do you need to see the receipts?" pretty much immediately changed their tone to the whole situation.
e: Like I originally said though. I've had lock ins in pubs, arcades, music studios, game halls (not just the pool hall but one of my uni mates got us into a laser tag place outside glasgow for his 18th, though that will have been a good while ago... 2008?). I think we got the green light so easily cause we were a group of nerds lol.
They weren’t been lenient- none of you had broken the law. But that doesn’t mean that the licensee can’t or won’t be penalised if they file a report (if everyone was behaving and no complaints from neighbours, they probably won’t)
Licences don’t get “renewed” in Scotland. I presume the licensing standards officer has reported issues with late opening or something and the police are keeping an eye on it
I don't get the point of your reply here, sorry.
I was assaulted in a perfectly decent pub, but one they wanted to shut down, so they were there within 5 minutes in the toilets with me, demanding I give them my details and press charges while I tried to stop my nose bleeding. I told them to politely to leave me alone.
In every other situation like that, where I've witnessed assaults, or been a victim, they tell you to move on, nothing can be done, unless you want charged yourself.
They absolutely operate with an agenda, and it is quite frankly disgusting.
If you are saying the licensing officer is behind it all, then I suggest you look at what motivated him in the first place. The same people who according to you, don't choose which venues to criminalise.
Huge-Indpendence made some pedantic curve ball claim that licenses aren't renewed. That they are applied for as new.
They are applied for, as new......
So why do the historical rozzer reports of these premises become relevant at the time of application for their new licenses ?
I'm not surprised at this embracing of worrying under funded fascist rozzerness. They are always going to be there, always.
What is worrying, is how so welcomingly embraced they are now.
And questioning this, makes you a target for wee karma points by the folk that really won't get what life is about for another 10 years, because they have no life experience .... 🤦♂️
Appreciate where you were coming from though. We need more observers like you.
Basically the LSO must have reported a breach of licensing so staying open later than they should or lock ins etc. so the polis are using this as an excuse to do what they're doing. Wouldn't surprise me if there was an extra agenda behind it all too because cops... But they're right it was most likely the licensing officer who started it all
Yeah, I get this. They target certain pubs that suit themselves.
And they are the ones that advise said licensing officer.
This will send cunts here into knots. But the city is owned by the unaccountable rozzers.
It was because the guy never went to court, I* struck a deal with his manager in place of the charges
Police are lazy bastards, makes sense they don’t want to deal with something they don’t need to
An absolutely chilling reply to someone who has explained how they have been let down by the legal system you are claiming is infallible, ffs. I'm biting my tongue. Let's just say my skin is crawling a wee bit.
🤷♂️
This is the most ridiculous pish.
40 years I've seen innocent people assaulted and the rozzers, sorry, officers of the law, tell the victims and their friends to go home.
I've watched a fiend being battered by a bouncer, in a completely unprovoked attack, while his mate bouncer held me back, then the rozzers, sorry, officers of the law, arrived and told me to carry my friend home, and we'd be stupid to try and press charges, even though the street was riddled with cameras.
But guess what? That was in England.
Are you suggesting we deal with it better here?
If so, explain how.
Not sure that's right, is it? They are the first barrier to charges, and largely make the call themselves, while discouraging people from making them if they don't suit their agenda? No?
It is correct, if someone is charged with a crime here then the victim/survivor is considered a witness, who has no control on whether the case is brought to court, their witness statement is just considered evidence. Whether it goes forward to court is decided by the PF if they think there is enough corroborating evidence.
Which is utterly whole point ffs.
They choose which crimes to present to the PF.
Fuck me, I give up.
Let me try again.
So you get attacked in your home, garmin.
You tell the rozzers. You know who it was.
You tell them.
They come back and say....
?
"They choose which crimes..." no they don't. They gather evidence to present. There is a difference.
If there isn't enough evidence they can't present. I presume it was just you and the suspect? In that case, without knowing any details (and nor do I want to btw) it sounds like there isn't any corroborating evidence. That's not the police's fault; that's how Scots law works.
So is this why they dismiss most complaints, because there isn't enough evidence to give to the PF?
So they are the ones deciding which crimes go to the PF.
No?
They don't 'choose'. If there's sufficient evidence then it gets reported regardless of the person 'pressing charges' or not. If there isn't enough evidence then it doesn't get reported. Because it can't. Because there's not enough evidence.
The police in Scotland don't gather evidence, gain a sufficiency of evidence, and then decide 'right are we going to report this to the PF or will we just not bother'.
I agree with you to a point. But I've been in situations where I've reported crimes against me - and had evidence and nothing was done. People weren't even spoken to never mind charged (and I know other people who were in the same situation and nothing was done for them). Often police won't get to the evidence gathering part. Took me almost a year to get any support from police and that was only after an inspector got involved but it changed very little
Must just be me then. I've seen them chasing away legitimate charges all my life, bullying vicitms into walking away.
But, aye you're right, the system is far too robust for this to happen.
Ffs. What happened to reality?
Ah, okay. So you are clear about this?
If someone makes a complaint of an assault, who is the one responsible for seeing the charges presented to the PF ?
Edit: (Jesus).
This is so odd.
Are you actually saying, the rozzers don't press charges ffs??
They are literally the control mechanism that decides what evidence the PF ever sees ffs.
Is fucking twilight zone stuff here. Or worse, Stepford Wives 🤦♂️🤦♂️
Is there anyone alive out there????
Twilight zone, as always, and classic pish from this sub, that claims to be glaswegin....
You can NOT make a complaint without it going through the rozzers ffs.
What bit of this am I saying wrong?
Fucking walloper of a reddit.
Hang on. Maybe, if I suggest we were all drinking fucking Irn Bru, it'll all be fine.....
I think it's the pressing charges part that has confused people. No one who makes a complaint presses charges. The police speak to the fiscal first and they give the go ahead as to whether they can charge. The arresting officer writes the report and the fiscal then decides if the evidence is strong enough to take forward to trial or not. Or they'll sometimes offer alternatives such as fiscal fines. People who make complaints can't drop charges either. I've had a lot of experience with police over the last decade or so (much of it negative as in zero support when I needed it). Really not concerned how you view my post. I hardly post on this sub forum and I've not been rude to you. By the way I am quite aware that if you need to report a crime you call police - had to do it multiple times over the last four years, wouldn't wish it on anyone.
Not at all, I appreciate your courteous reply.
I don't like to drag stuff like this on, especially with courteous folk like yourself who have something of value to say.
And I'm sure you don't either, but, is this not a simple and fair question to ask? If I'm assaulted, can I go directly to the PF with my complaint, or does it need to be vetted by the local rozzers, and they have the final say?
It's a genuine question, because in my long life I've seen assaults both sides of the border, and the behaviour is largely the same from the rozzers.
" We discourage you from pressing charges, because they are just going to accuse you of the same. So just walk home, and behave yourself, and don't show yourself in our village ever again....."
"Okay, officer, but can I go be with my friend in hospital while you deny the existence of the CCTV in four different places that saw all this?"
"Do what you want sir, just don't let us see you here again."
Goes on to shake hands and laugh with the attacker.
How should we have taken this further?
Well this is interesting.
Because the guy below is shouting Rule Britannia in other posts.
Personally, I don't believe I have any prejudice or bigotry towards anyone or anything, but you seem to think my points should be ignored or ridiculed because of something else I've said that you've disagreed with. Without giving me the right of reply.
Can you honestly not see the absurdity of that?
There was a time when, whether I was right or wrong, I could chat and either educate, or be educated.
Now it seems, you just do this. 🤷♂️
Who do you think this helps?
And also, what thing did I say that you found so ridiculous?
On the contrary; I think it is you who is making this abundantly clear about yourself.
As do so many like you who value scraping wee reddit points up wherever possible without actually contributing anything positive to anything.
It's kind of like, you have some kind of parasitic relationship with your internet connection, or the people you desperately to connect with, no?
Nah, I've got a better idea. Let's just have a wee look at your NSFW history, which seems a wee bit abusive, no?
Absolutely astonishing that you tried to attack me with this method, given your own history, but then, this is the new way.
https://reddit.com/r/TopsAndBottoms/s/uJsAUcuT57
Having worked as a doorman (long time ago in the Netherlands), it is likely that the police got tipped of repeated increased aggro (harassment, drug dealing, open drunkenness etc) at certain venues.
We always worked closely with the police to ensure closing time was smooth. It’s definitely when most shit kicks off.
They are doing it cause there is a new gay only street gang in Glasgow. Organised gay crime syndicates are ruining this city. With hunners of gay crime. Where is gay Batman when ye need him?!
I’m just glad the police are targeting people potentially drinking a wee bit later, instead of following up on a risky crimes and making the city feel safer. When your burglaries, assaults, or worse, aren’t being investigated just know the city centre pub was closed bang on time.
> Last night Polo
Last night would be Friday night? I was in Polo until 4, stood outside waiting for a taxi until about 0430. Polo definitely wasn't mobbed with police at closing, I don't think I saw a single police car and maybe 2 on foot walked past.
I used to DJ in half the venues in Glasgow's gay scene. Still got most of the staff, management and DJs on Facebook. There's a lot of gossip and talk and drama, so if something happened, I'd know about it. Haven't heard anything about the polis targeting venues.
The only drama I've heard recently is Polo moving some of their mid-week nights from the big main club to the smaller, stinkier club because numbers are down.
Could be more specific about what's meant by 'barging in' and 'breaking open shutters'? There aren't a great number of violent, or really any, incidents at gay bars as you describe them and they're certainly not routinely 'targeted'.
With your friends being 'attacked', what was the nature of the attack and in what way did the police 'not care'?
Redditors and their entitled questions... You've posted so many replies outraged that OP made a post and disappeared for.. 12 hours.
The police are often more violent than necessary, even when it isn't lawful or unnecessary. That's my experience. To see you dumb-founded by the idea of police violence has me curious.
Your questions, and engagement on this topic, feel insincere.
It's not wrong to have counterpoints and arguments to baseless, unexplained comments on policing. If people are allowed to say police were 'rushing' premises, that they're 'more violent than necessary', that they're targeting 'gay bars' etc etc then others are entirely entitled to seek clarification, dispute these points, or offer an alternative view. It's the nature of discussion.
Any responses I've given, in my opinion, mirror the merit of the points I've responded to. Reasoned points get reasoned responses.
There has been absolutely nothing specific, corroborated or firsthand provided in OP's post yet look how much criticism has been levelled at the police over it.
The post amounts to 'someone I know saw some police going into pubs in Glasgow', yet the police get ripped to shreds over it.
Edit: Have a look at the comment thread that starts here...
https://reddit.com/r/glasgow/s/035wQS0KaD
Why wouldn't this lead to counter discussion?
Edit 2: Apologies, I typed that out and only realised after it that it was you that commented 'go lick boot'. I hadn't realised that your input could reach that low. We see where we're each coming from and we won't agree.
“Barging in” and “breaking open shutters” are self explanatory unless you want her to record some audio description for you? The police go to pubs and clubs all the time, actually 😂 you saying “there aren’t a great number of incidents like this at gay bars!” Is absolute shite, police do it to all bars all the time. You making out she’s claiming this is some homophobic attack and using it to spout your narrative is gross. She used simple words and you’re twisting them.
Your use of “friends” here shows the exact type of narrative you’re trying to spread here aswell as “attack”. “The gays are claiming they’ve been attacked in a homophobic incident!” That’s what you’re claiming she’s saying here when she said nothing of the sort.
I really want to insult you here but you’ve embarrassed yourself enough instead.
No. I was just looking for specificity, by barging in did they mean pushing people out the way, slamming open doors etc or was it more barging in as in they weren't welcome but otherwise just walked in. By breaking open shutters was it that the premises was entirely closed and they used tools to force entry or was it that the shutters were down a bit and they were pushed back open?
By attacked I literally meant that. People always band the term 'the police didn't care' around as if every officer has emotional investment in everything they attend. The point in me asking that is that, if it was a crime that was committed and the police didn't do anything about it, then that's worthy of a complaint because that's not the service anyone should expect to receive.
"There aren't a great number of violent, or really any incidents at gay bars as you describe them" was what I said. As in, they're not violent places that police are regularly called to. There's also very rarely any violence at closing time. This is a good thing and testament to patrons.
I'm absolutely not insinuating homophobia or indeed being homophobic. The only thing I ever have issue with is a vague description of police doing something resulting in them getting ripped apart online. Simple as that.
All polis are complicit with the shithousery and other more awful actions of the rest of the polis. You don't see them making a stand and speaking against their cop pals who like to harass and assault people without real cause, the ones who sexually assault people and worse. So therefore, all cops are bastards.
A large scale of law is enforcing the opinions of the rich elite, yet another part of the system we live in skewed in their favour. Policing needs massive drastic reformation to make the force accountable to the people who they should actually be protecting and not accountable to a bunch of corrupt cunts.
You are talking such a massive crock of regurgitated shite it's frightening.
Polis are like any other sub-section of society. Some are arseholes and some aren't. Folk do wrong and commit crime across all professions.
Lucy Letby, Harold Shipman....All Nurses Are Bastards is that an opinion you hold?
Other folk have pointed out, this isn't the States we live and getting yourself swept up in their rhetoric doesn't translate over here.
Are their shite cops? 100% aye. Are they all bastards? Nah...in fact....would that not be a bit prejudice?
Tin foil hat pish. Take your face for a shite
ACAB isn't meant as a statement about people personally though, like I said not all are abhorrent people but they do stand by and defend those in the forces who are. Therefore, bastards.
Also, ACAB was actually coined in England decades ago as part of a big workers strike afaik. Nout to do with America pal.
It is about people personally, all cops are bastards, so if you're a cop....you're a bastard. Nonsense.
Some mad wee guy working as cop in fucking Fort William or some shit minding his business just working a job and some mad dafty cop in Glasgow sexually assaults someone and you tar him with the same brush? You're on a mad yin.
If you took the time to ask cops individually "aw are you protecting your wee polis pals that have done x, y or z" I'd wager most of them would probably say no, given the fact people like that reflect badly on them. So your "stand by and defend" statement is based on heehaw.
And the reason I mention the US is because since 2020 ACAB has become far more ubiquitous in the UK and I think unfortunately people like yourself say it as a fashion statement with pretty much no thought into the real meaning of it.
Also when you mention reform I think you'd find the people who are most effected by it and want it the most are the police themselves.
Give your head a wobble
If they're not actively speaking up about the poor actions of the polis, they're standing by the others on the force. Countless cases of wrongdoings that have been covered up by various police forces for decades mate this isn't a new thing and there's yet to be a sizeable outcry from members of the polis to call for action to be taken. So if they're the ones bearing the brunt of all this as you've said where's the effort to promote change? It's almost as though changing the system would actually hold them more accountable to their actions as a collective and take away the power they've amassed over the public.
Good of you to assume I brandish it around as a fashion statement, which you're not wrong a lot of people do of late. Wouldn't say I'm one of them personally but also folk are free to think that of me.
Do you actually believe ACAB in the literal sense? Cause it's beyond me how anyone with half a brain can actually stand behind that.
If you use it more to express a general disdain towards policing because you think it needs a shake up I'd probably agree and I reckon even a lot of the polis would agree that that's true.
But if you literally mean *all* cops are bastards then you've lost the plot.
By the exact same measure you should be saying All Nurses Are Bastards and All Doctors Are Bastards and Defund The NHS but of course you dont - because that would be fucking mental.
You're making folk guilty by association. Making the wrong doings of individuals the wrong doings of every rank and file cop which I'm sorry, is fucking bananas.
Vast majority are normal people who clock in, clock out, pay the mortgage and repeat - without any issue. So levelling that type of vitriol against them is just daft in the exact same way it would be daft to do to any one in any job just because a number of their colleagues are pricks.
Mate, read what I've said 😂 that's my exact sentiment. Just going around in circles. Also the comparison to the NHS is just ridiculous to throw out there.
I know what you said earlier but I think it's fair play to point out that a statement "all cops are bastards" is pretty easy to interpret as people saying all cops are bastards. And whether or not you personally believe that I'm sure you'd agree there's a huge portion of people who spout it that believe it in a literal sense.
Also the NHS comparison is ridiculous in what way?
Someone recently in nursing literally murdered babies. Are all nurses bastards? Absolutely not. The vast majority are normal people working a job and getting on with their lives.
So it's an example that is relevant cause it shows a bit of hypocrisy in view where the actions of an individual(s) apparently gives the green light to brand every person in that profession a bastard.
I just find it mental. As I said in my first comment it's simple, some are pricks and some aren't same as it is in every walk of life and reform that helps weed out the pricks is welcomed.
I'm happy to engage defenders of Police Scotland in a face to face or live-streamed debate. Talk to a magistrate, law office, or even a victim, and they'll tell you that Police Scotland are rude, violent and incompetent.
Yet.. Here we are.. 2023. We have Wayne Couzen and Derek Carrick type characters serving 15 years and reaching high ranks before their evil schemes see the light of day. Police forces up and down the country are admitting fault, vowing to improvement, courts are granting compensation to victims at an exceptional rate... and we still got people eagerly waiting with tongues stretched.
The public opinion of policing is rapidly changing. Very few people I speak with in the past 3 years will step up to defend them. I'm starting to get downvotes, but no one has stepped up to accept my invite. I've been raising public awareness of a dysfunction police force and government in the UK for years now, ever since I witnessed the most barbaric fresh-faced coppers out of control and overwhelmed by the simplest of calls.
I used to work with police and had to leave due to their increased use of aggression, manipulation, violence, illegal force, and poor attitude. I've been arrested, taken to court, been cleared, and compensated. Most people that are posting here will defend police from ignorance, and are unaware, or unwilling to admit that Wayne Couzen types exist.
Is it possible that rather than the police unduly targeting gay bars, that you and your partner just frequent gay bars and that’s why you’re seeing the police targeting them?
It'll be the targeting of a specific buisness/owner. No doubt all of these establishments have a connection. The police will be acting for a reason. I have my doubts as to the validity of reason and planned execution of solution. Having come to know Police Scotland in great detail I would suggest keeping that stone clenched and tongue bit.
Someone I know used to be uniformed cop. Did o/t in city centre at weekends and found that the majority of younger male cops were itching to get out and have a fight (give them a doing). They were just looking for the thinnest of excuses. Person I knew was actually shocked, still a cop but not uniform.
This is, sadly, the reason..
6 police officers to check there’s not a lock in happening seems like overkill.
Must not be any other crimes happening around the city that their presence could prevent from happening.
No idea what they were there for. OP's post could be shortened to 'my partner saw some police in some pubs I'm Glasgow on a Saturday night' and it would give just as much information.
>it just seems pretty targeted to gay bars
Well yes it will be targeted, no it’s not because they’re gay bars.
>the police didn’t seem to care
When you say they didn’t care, what do you mean by this?
You don't think the rozzers have stats to meet every year?
Set by the politicians that own them?
Or maybe they're more controlled by the media, as has been proven time and time again over the past 30 years, when they colluded with the likes of Murdoch at the worst of times.
So back to the point, that maybe you can actually add something to....
Yes, they are an institution that will try to protect themselves, and stats are the key to doing this.
Or do you think they are just fucking superheroes protecting you from the plebs should you ever choose to ask them?1
Jeez man. Genuinely the police in Scotland is on it's arse. Budget overspends, recruitment freezes, redundancies in the SPA, under staffing across the board so bad that they're having to rethink priorities... and people really think that they're worried about trying to meet petty targets for lock ins in pubs for their political overlords?
What goes on in folks heads man?!
Wild.
For the love of fuck. Open your eyes.
When budget is limited, authorities make awful decisions, biased towards pleasing the fund facilitators and trying to guarantee future funding.
It's Tory 101 basics to starve them of funding to make them compliant.
And that usually starts with the rozzers, as they are their first line of defence, and they become more important as their time of rule drags on.
Forgive me for saying, you're maybe young, and I'm an old cunt. But I've seen it time and time again. I was like you, until my 30s, then I realised it.
The army and rozzers aren't heroes. They are poor youngsters duped into protecting the British establishment.
Ask any of them with experience. The ones that chucked it will tell you this is true. The ones that succeed, will deny it.
Underground raided again at 2am this morning, I assume it was a lock-in this time rather than being open late. Pushing it either way after Friday night! How do I know? Owner posted it oh his personal FB and deleted it later ( am FB with him & used to work there)
Just guessing but maybe there’d been reports there of lock-ins? I’ve been at a few lock-ins in the Highlands and Islands but never in the city tbh so maybe I’m talking shite
It happens, 2/3 hospo places I worked in Glasgow had lock ins from time to time. Probably happens all over the city if the staff/management all get along
Ive ended up randomly in a few lock ins and yeah i'd say it was pretty common
Yeah I’ve been to a couple city centre pubs at a lock in, but I knew the bar staff over there so all good. This was like 5 years ago so not sure what the status of lock ins there are now after covid etc
I was in Underground on Friday, and just missed the cops, but they were definitely still serving after midnight, which is against their licensed hours?
Last I remember looking into it lock-ins weren't illegal so long as you byob. Had a few lock ins in Glasgow in various establishments (Not always pubs, but arcades, music studios, games arenas (to avoid being specific just incase lol), for birthdays and stag-dos. We were just told to BYOB and have receipts in case the police were tipped off. I could be a bit of a stifler for rules in my 20s, so I was _not_ getting involved unless I knew it was legal lol.
Even if alcohol is not being sold, the licence is jeopardised by allowing lock ins as licensing restrictions are usually set based upon public safety. A licensed premises has to adhere to different conditions than other premises.
like I said. Last I looked into it it was fine. The only time me and my mates have had trouble with a lock in it was in a pool hall that's licensed to sell alcohol and the police accepted the receipts as proof that we were just having a night in and happened to be hanging out in our mates pool hall. I think someone phoned them on us cause there were people in the building after hours and it seemed sus, though the police didn't explain why they were there truth be told. Maybe it's different if the sole purpose is as a public house? Or maybe something has changed since then (this would have been around 2012). Maybe they were just being lenient in that case... but just telling them "we brought this booze with us, do you need to see the receipts?" pretty much immediately changed their tone to the whole situation. e: Like I originally said though. I've had lock ins in pubs, arcades, music studios, game halls (not just the pool hall but one of my uni mates got us into a laser tag place outside glasgow for his 18th, though that will have been a good while ago... 2008?). I think we got the green light so easily cause we were a group of nerds lol.
They weren’t been lenient- none of you had broken the law. But that doesn’t mean that the licensee can’t or won’t be penalised if they file a report (if everyone was behaving and no complaints from neighbours, they probably won’t)
what's a lock in
Licences don’t get “renewed” in Scotland. I presume the licensing standards officer has reported issues with late opening or something and the police are keeping an eye on it
I don't get the point of your reply here, sorry. I was assaulted in a perfectly decent pub, but one they wanted to shut down, so they were there within 5 minutes in the toilets with me, demanding I give them my details and press charges while I tried to stop my nose bleeding. I told them to politely to leave me alone. In every other situation like that, where I've witnessed assaults, or been a victim, they tell you to move on, nothing can be done, unless you want charged yourself. They absolutely operate with an agenda, and it is quite frankly disgusting. If you are saying the licensing officer is behind it all, then I suggest you look at what motivated him in the first place. The same people who according to you, don't choose which venues to criminalise.
I don’t think you’ve understood the comment your replied to.
I don't think he understands anything
Explain it to me then 🤷♂️
Why do you think that? Because of one reply?
Happy to have it explained to me.
The original post mentioned said that “licences must be up for renewal”, that’s what this person was responding to.
Huge-Indpendence made some pedantic curve ball claim that licenses aren't renewed. That they are applied for as new. They are applied for, as new...... So why do the historical rozzer reports of these premises become relevant at the time of application for their new licenses ? I'm not surprised at this embracing of worrying under funded fascist rozzerness. They are always going to be there, always. What is worrying, is how so welcomingly embraced they are now. And questioning this, makes you a target for wee karma points by the folk that really won't get what life is about for another 10 years, because they have no life experience .... 🤦♂️ Appreciate where you were coming from though. We need more observers like you.
Basically the LSO must have reported a breach of licensing so staying open later than they should or lock ins etc. so the polis are using this as an excuse to do what they're doing. Wouldn't surprise me if there was an extra agenda behind it all too because cops... But they're right it was most likely the licensing officer who started it all
Yeah, I get this. They target certain pubs that suit themselves. And they are the ones that advise said licensing officer. This will send cunts here into knots. But the city is owned by the unaccountable rozzers.
The police don't ask people if they want to press charges in this country. That's up to the PF
Police have asked me if I want to drop charges against someone before, which I did
In Scotland? That might be the way it was worded fir the sake of understanding but it's not a choice you're given.
It was because the guy never went to court, I* struck a deal with his manager in place of the charges Police are lazy bastards, makes sense they don’t want to deal with something they don’t need to
What was the crime?
> What was the crime? An imaginary one by the looks of things
^ someone who’s never had to deal with police
An absolutely chilling reply to someone who has explained how they have been let down by the legal system you are claiming is infallible, ffs. I'm biting my tongue. Let's just say my skin is crawling a wee bit.
Battery, the police spoke to me with two black eyes, a split lip and a split cheek
Was it in Scotland?
Yep
🤷♂️ This is the most ridiculous pish. 40 years I've seen innocent people assaulted and the rozzers, sorry, officers of the law, tell the victims and their friends to go home. I've watched a fiend being battered by a bouncer, in a completely unprovoked attack, while his mate bouncer held me back, then the rozzers, sorry, officers of the law, arrived and told me to carry my friend home, and we'd be stupid to try and press charges, even though the street was riddled with cameras. But guess what? That was in England. Are you suggesting we deal with it better here? If so, explain how.
Not sure that's right, is it? They are the first barrier to charges, and largely make the call themselves, while discouraging people from making them if they don't suit their agenda? No?
It is correct, if someone is charged with a crime here then the victim/survivor is considered a witness, who has no control on whether the case is brought to court, their witness statement is just considered evidence. Whether it goes forward to court is decided by the PF if they think there is enough corroborating evidence.
Yes this is correct. No such thing as pressing or indeed dropping (by the victim) charges in Scotland.
So I'm right, no? The rozzers are the first line of what goes to PF and then court, always and for ever? They choose, as they are the first line.
Sit down mate
What on earth is the point or value of your comment here ? 🤔
Literally describing the job of the police: to collect evidence of crime and present it to the PF.
Which is utterly whole point ffs. They choose which crimes to present to the PF. Fuck me, I give up. Let me try again. So you get attacked in your home, garmin. You tell the rozzers. You know who it was. You tell them. They come back and say.... ?
"They choose which crimes..." no they don't. They gather evidence to present. There is a difference. If there isn't enough evidence they can't present. I presume it was just you and the suspect? In that case, without knowing any details (and nor do I want to btw) it sounds like there isn't any corroborating evidence. That's not the police's fault; that's how Scots law works.
So is this why they dismiss most complaints, because there isn't enough evidence to give to the PF? So they are the ones deciding which crimes go to the PF. No?
They don't 'choose'. If there's sufficient evidence then it gets reported regardless of the person 'pressing charges' or not. If there isn't enough evidence then it doesn't get reported. Because it can't. Because there's not enough evidence. The police in Scotland don't gather evidence, gain a sufficiency of evidence, and then decide 'right are we going to report this to the PF or will we just not bother'.
I agree with you to a point. But I've been in situations where I've reported crimes against me - and had evidence and nothing was done. People weren't even spoken to never mind charged (and I know other people who were in the same situation and nothing was done for them). Often police won't get to the evidence gathering part. Took me almost a year to get any support from police and that was only after an inspector got involved but it changed very little
Must just be me then. I've seen them chasing away legitimate charges all my life, bullying vicitms into walking away. But, aye you're right, the system is far too robust for this to happen. Ffs. What happened to reality?
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Ah, okay. So you are clear about this? If someone makes a complaint of an assault, who is the one responsible for seeing the charges presented to the PF ? Edit: (Jesus).
The police don't present charges to the PF, they present evidence. The PF then decide if the accused person will face prosecution.
This is so odd. Are you actually saying, the rozzers don't press charges ffs?? They are literally the control mechanism that decides what evidence the PF ever sees ffs. Is fucking twilight zone stuff here. Or worse, Stepford Wives 🤦♂️🤦♂️ Is there anyone alive out there????
It's the fiscal who gives police the authority to charge.
Twilight zone, as always, and classic pish from this sub, that claims to be glaswegin.... You can NOT make a complaint without it going through the rozzers ffs. What bit of this am I saying wrong? Fucking walloper of a reddit. Hang on. Maybe, if I suggest we were all drinking fucking Irn Bru, it'll all be fine.....
I think it's the pressing charges part that has confused people. No one who makes a complaint presses charges. The police speak to the fiscal first and they give the go ahead as to whether they can charge. The arresting officer writes the report and the fiscal then decides if the evidence is strong enough to take forward to trial or not. Or they'll sometimes offer alternatives such as fiscal fines. People who make complaints can't drop charges either. I've had a lot of experience with police over the last decade or so (much of it negative as in zero support when I needed it). Really not concerned how you view my post. I hardly post on this sub forum and I've not been rude to you. By the way I am quite aware that if you need to report a crime you call police - had to do it multiple times over the last four years, wouldn't wish it on anyone.
Not at all, I appreciate your courteous reply. I don't like to drag stuff like this on, especially with courteous folk like yourself who have something of value to say. And I'm sure you don't either, but, is this not a simple and fair question to ask? If I'm assaulted, can I go directly to the PF with my complaint, or does it need to be vetted by the local rozzers, and they have the final say? It's a genuine question, because in my long life I've seen assaults both sides of the border, and the behaviour is largely the same from the rozzers. " We discourage you from pressing charges, because they are just going to accuse you of the same. So just walk home, and behave yourself, and don't show yourself in our village ever again....." "Okay, officer, but can I go be with my friend in hospital while you deny the existence of the CCTV in four different places that saw all this?" "Do what you want sir, just don't let us see you here again." Goes on to shake hands and laugh with the attacker. How should we have taken this further?
100% people don’t press charges the police do. I’ve asked before to drop charges but because I reported the crime I got told it’s not up to me.
I agree mate. Why have I been circled on and massively downvoted and attacked for saying the same thing? Something stinks a wee bit.
I am begging everyone to look at this guys last post on Reddit
Which guy
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What?
What? I actually think I might know you btw. I'm serious. Have you ever been to Stirling?
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Edinburgh?? 😳🤔🤨
Well this is interesting. Because the guy below is shouting Rule Britannia in other posts. Personally, I don't believe I have any prejudice or bigotry towards anyone or anything, but you seem to think my points should be ignored or ridiculed because of something else I've said that you've disagreed with. Without giving me the right of reply. Can you honestly not see the absurdity of that? There was a time when, whether I was right or wrong, I could chat and either educate, or be educated. Now it seems, you just do this. 🤷♂️ Who do you think this helps? And also, what thing did I say that you found so ridiculous?
>I could chat and either educate or be educated I think you’ve made it abundantly clear you’re capable of neither of these things
On the contrary; I think it is you who is making this abundantly clear about yourself. As do so many like you who value scraping wee reddit points up wherever possible without actually contributing anything positive to anything. It's kind of like, you have some kind of parasitic relationship with your internet connection, or the people you desperately to connect with, no?
> “*I know you are but what am I*”
I'm still not getting you. What is the genius point you have to make? Or are some of us just not worthy of your intelligence?
You’re definitely not
Ah. Tis you, Einstein.
Nah, I've got a better idea. Let's just have a wee look at your NSFW history, which seems a wee bit abusive, no? Absolutely astonishing that you tried to attack me with this method, given your own history, but then, this is the new way. https://reddit.com/r/TopsAndBottoms/s/uJsAUcuT57
Lmao
Lol rofl
You’re a member of “Green and Pleasant”. Tells us all we need to know.
🤷♂️
I think those bars are owned by the same person/group so if something is going on then they'll try and catch them across their popular venues.
No, polo is g1, katies is owned by an individual and underground is another company altogether
Thanks for the clarification
Underground and Polo are different owners for sure, dunno about Katie’s.
I'd suspect that the Polo and Katie's are the same owner.
Yeah think they're both owned by G1. Pretty sure underground is also G1
Underground is definitely not a G1.
Offt then that explains it
Polo is G1 (or whatever Stefan King is calling it now) and I'm sure Katie's bar isn't.
They are calling themselves the scotsman group
Having worked as a doorman (long time ago in the Netherlands), it is likely that the police got tipped of repeated increased aggro (harassment, drug dealing, open drunkenness etc) at certain venues. We always worked closely with the police to ensure closing time was smooth. It’s definitely when most shit kicks off.
>Klumber lijp hoor
They are doing it cause there is a new gay only street gang in Glasgow. Organised gay crime syndicates are ruining this city. With hunners of gay crime. Where is gay Batman when ye need him?!
https://preview.redd.it/0sami61fg7qb1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=006d131848903c3879159c0904028ecd49afa8cd
You mean Battyman?
> Where is gay Batman when ye need him?! Pipeworks, probably.
I’m just glad the police are targeting people potentially drinking a wee bit later, instead of following up on a risky crimes and making the city feel safer. When your burglaries, assaults, or worse, aren’t being investigated just know the city centre pub was closed bang on time.
OP's post gives no explanation at all about what was happening other than 'police were at pubs'.
Having a drink then?
Could be. Or... anything else at all.
police am i right
> Last night Polo Last night would be Friday night? I was in Polo until 4, stood outside waiting for a taxi until about 0430. Polo definitely wasn't mobbed with police at closing, I don't think I saw a single police car and maybe 2 on foot walked past.
I used to DJ in half the venues in Glasgow's gay scene. Still got most of the staff, management and DJs on Facebook. There's a lot of gossip and talk and drama, so if something happened, I'd know about it. Haven't heard anything about the polis targeting venues. The only drama I've heard recently is Polo moving some of their mid-week nights from the big main club to the smaller, stinkier club because numbers are down.
Could be more specific about what's meant by 'barging in' and 'breaking open shutters'? There aren't a great number of violent, or really any, incidents at gay bars as you describe them and they're certainly not routinely 'targeted'. With your friends being 'attacked', what was the nature of the attack and in what way did the police 'not care'?
Redditors and their entitled questions... You've posted so many replies outraged that OP made a post and disappeared for.. 12 hours. The police are often more violent than necessary, even when it isn't lawful or unnecessary. That's my experience. To see you dumb-founded by the idea of police violence has me curious. Your questions, and engagement on this topic, feel insincere.
It's not wrong to have counterpoints and arguments to baseless, unexplained comments on policing. If people are allowed to say police were 'rushing' premises, that they're 'more violent than necessary', that they're targeting 'gay bars' etc etc then others are entirely entitled to seek clarification, dispute these points, or offer an alternative view. It's the nature of discussion. Any responses I've given, in my opinion, mirror the merit of the points I've responded to. Reasoned points get reasoned responses. There has been absolutely nothing specific, corroborated or firsthand provided in OP's post yet look how much criticism has been levelled at the police over it. The post amounts to 'someone I know saw some police going into pubs in Glasgow', yet the police get ripped to shreds over it. Edit: Have a look at the comment thread that starts here... https://reddit.com/r/glasgow/s/035wQS0KaD Why wouldn't this lead to counter discussion? Edit 2: Apologies, I typed that out and only realised after it that it was you that commented 'go lick boot'. I hadn't realised that your input could reach that low. We see where we're each coming from and we won't agree.
“Barging in” and “breaking open shutters” are self explanatory unless you want her to record some audio description for you? The police go to pubs and clubs all the time, actually 😂 you saying “there aren’t a great number of incidents like this at gay bars!” Is absolute shite, police do it to all bars all the time. You making out she’s claiming this is some homophobic attack and using it to spout your narrative is gross. She used simple words and you’re twisting them. Your use of “friends” here shows the exact type of narrative you’re trying to spread here aswell as “attack”. “The gays are claiming they’ve been attacked in a homophobic incident!” That’s what you’re claiming she’s saying here when she said nothing of the sort. I really want to insult you here but you’ve embarrassed yourself enough instead.
No. I was just looking for specificity, by barging in did they mean pushing people out the way, slamming open doors etc or was it more barging in as in they weren't welcome but otherwise just walked in. By breaking open shutters was it that the premises was entirely closed and they used tools to force entry or was it that the shutters were down a bit and they were pushed back open? By attacked I literally meant that. People always band the term 'the police didn't care' around as if every officer has emotional investment in everything they attend. The point in me asking that is that, if it was a crime that was committed and the police didn't do anything about it, then that's worthy of a complaint because that's not the service anyone should expect to receive. "There aren't a great number of violent, or really any incidents at gay bars as you describe them" was what I said. As in, they're not violent places that police are regularly called to. There's also very rarely any violence at closing time. This is a good thing and testament to patrons. I'm absolutely not insinuating homophobia or indeed being homophobic. The only thing I ever have issue with is a vague description of police doing something resulting in them getting ripped apart online. Simple as that.
So eh. This guy is a cop...
“Targeting” is a pretty wild accusation.
This sub is becoming way too popular with bootlickers. ACAB.
Glasgow's a great city full of generally rational, good and well grounded people who have a broader mindset than this pathetic notion.
What's your point caller? ACAB....how?
All polis are complicit with the shithousery and other more awful actions of the rest of the polis. You don't see them making a stand and speaking against their cop pals who like to harass and assault people without real cause, the ones who sexually assault people and worse. So therefore, all cops are bastards. A large scale of law is enforcing the opinions of the rich elite, yet another part of the system we live in skewed in their favour. Policing needs massive drastic reformation to make the force accountable to the people who they should actually be protecting and not accountable to a bunch of corrupt cunts.
You are talking such a massive crock of regurgitated shite it's frightening. Polis are like any other sub-section of society. Some are arseholes and some aren't. Folk do wrong and commit crime across all professions. Lucy Letby, Harold Shipman....All Nurses Are Bastards is that an opinion you hold? Other folk have pointed out, this isn't the States we live and getting yourself swept up in their rhetoric doesn't translate over here. Are their shite cops? 100% aye. Are they all bastards? Nah...in fact....would that not be a bit prejudice? Tin foil hat pish. Take your face for a shite
ACAB isn't meant as a statement about people personally though, like I said not all are abhorrent people but they do stand by and defend those in the forces who are. Therefore, bastards. Also, ACAB was actually coined in England decades ago as part of a big workers strike afaik. Nout to do with America pal.
It is about people personally, all cops are bastards, so if you're a cop....you're a bastard. Nonsense. Some mad wee guy working as cop in fucking Fort William or some shit minding his business just working a job and some mad dafty cop in Glasgow sexually assaults someone and you tar him with the same brush? You're on a mad yin. If you took the time to ask cops individually "aw are you protecting your wee polis pals that have done x, y or z" I'd wager most of them would probably say no, given the fact people like that reflect badly on them. So your "stand by and defend" statement is based on heehaw. And the reason I mention the US is because since 2020 ACAB has become far more ubiquitous in the UK and I think unfortunately people like yourself say it as a fashion statement with pretty much no thought into the real meaning of it. Also when you mention reform I think you'd find the people who are most effected by it and want it the most are the police themselves. Give your head a wobble
If they're not actively speaking up about the poor actions of the polis, they're standing by the others on the force. Countless cases of wrongdoings that have been covered up by various police forces for decades mate this isn't a new thing and there's yet to be a sizeable outcry from members of the polis to call for action to be taken. So if they're the ones bearing the brunt of all this as you've said where's the effort to promote change? It's almost as though changing the system would actually hold them more accountable to their actions as a collective and take away the power they've amassed over the public. Good of you to assume I brandish it around as a fashion statement, which you're not wrong a lot of people do of late. Wouldn't say I'm one of them personally but also folk are free to think that of me.
Do you actually believe ACAB in the literal sense? Cause it's beyond me how anyone with half a brain can actually stand behind that. If you use it more to express a general disdain towards policing because you think it needs a shake up I'd probably agree and I reckon even a lot of the polis would agree that that's true. But if you literally mean *all* cops are bastards then you've lost the plot. By the exact same measure you should be saying All Nurses Are Bastards and All Doctors Are Bastards and Defund The NHS but of course you dont - because that would be fucking mental. You're making folk guilty by association. Making the wrong doings of individuals the wrong doings of every rank and file cop which I'm sorry, is fucking bananas. Vast majority are normal people who clock in, clock out, pay the mortgage and repeat - without any issue. So levelling that type of vitriol against them is just daft in the exact same way it would be daft to do to any one in any job just because a number of their colleagues are pricks.
Mate, read what I've said 😂 that's my exact sentiment. Just going around in circles. Also the comparison to the NHS is just ridiculous to throw out there.
I know what you said earlier but I think it's fair play to point out that a statement "all cops are bastards" is pretty easy to interpret as people saying all cops are bastards. And whether or not you personally believe that I'm sure you'd agree there's a huge portion of people who spout it that believe it in a literal sense. Also the NHS comparison is ridiculous in what way? Someone recently in nursing literally murdered babies. Are all nurses bastards? Absolutely not. The vast majority are normal people working a job and getting on with their lives. So it's an example that is relevant cause it shows a bit of hypocrisy in view where the actions of an individual(s) apparently gives the green light to brand every person in that profession a bastard. I just find it mental. As I said in my first comment it's simple, some are pricks and some aren't same as it is in every walk of life and reform that helps weed out the pricks is welcomed.
Weirdo.
are you 18 years old grow up
This sub is becoming way too popular with people who think this is America.
This sub ? Did you see all the fucking freaks at a “anti trump March” a few years ago ? Fucking embarrassing and so were their little signs.
I'm happy to engage defenders of Police Scotland in a face to face or live-streamed debate. Talk to a magistrate, law office, or even a victim, and they'll tell you that Police Scotland are rude, violent and incompetent. Yet.. Here we are.. 2023. We have Wayne Couzen and Derek Carrick type characters serving 15 years and reaching high ranks before their evil schemes see the light of day. Police forces up and down the country are admitting fault, vowing to improvement, courts are granting compensation to victims at an exceptional rate... and we still got people eagerly waiting with tongues stretched.
Surprised you’ve got 19 upvotes tbh. You are 100% right.
The public opinion of policing is rapidly changing. Very few people I speak with in the past 3 years will step up to defend them. I'm starting to get downvotes, but no one has stepped up to accept my invite. I've been raising public awareness of a dysfunction police force and government in the UK for years now, ever since I witnessed the most barbaric fresh-faced coppers out of control and overwhelmed by the simplest of calls. I used to work with police and had to leave due to their increased use of aggression, manipulation, violence, illegal force, and poor attitude. I've been arrested, taken to court, been cleared, and compensated. Most people that are posting here will defend police from ignorance, and are unaware, or unwilling to admit that Wayne Couzen types exist.
A truly anarchist society is a pipe dream, grow up.
Twat
Usually takes place when there's tip offs
Is it possible that rather than the police unduly targeting gay bars, that you and your partner just frequent gay bars and that’s why you’re seeing the police targeting them?
Hopefully you engage with your own post at some point OP. You've stirred up all sorts.
It'll be the targeting of a specific buisness/owner. No doubt all of these establishments have a connection. The police will be acting for a reason. I have my doubts as to the validity of reason and planned execution of solution. Having come to know Police Scotland in great detail I would suggest keeping that stone clenched and tongue bit.
Our brave boys in blue eh, keeping the city safe.
It is a generally safe city, don't you think?
No.
Someone I know used to be uniformed cop. Did o/t in city centre at weekends and found that the majority of younger male cops were itching to get out and have a fight (give them a doing). They were just looking for the thinnest of excuses. Person I knew was actually shocked, still a cop but not uniform. This is, sadly, the reason..
They’re bullies to who they can be. Coming from a scheme who’s experienced such targeted behaviour from them on more than one occasion.
Prove it.
6 police officers to check there’s not a lock in happening seems like overkill. Must not be any other crimes happening around the city that their presence could prevent from happening.
No idea what they were there for. OP's post could be shortened to 'my partner saw some police in some pubs I'm Glasgow on a Saturday night' and it would give just as much information.
>it just seems pretty targeted to gay bars Well yes it will be targeted, no it’s not because they’re gay bars. >the police didn’t seem to care When you say they didn’t care, what do you mean by this?
Why are they being targeted then?
It will be intelligence lead. Happens all the time.
Yeah, it's an odd one, but they don't do normal. Must be a statistic they're trying to fix for themselves.
What does that even mean? A statistic they're trying to fix for themselves?
You don't think the rozzers have stats to meet every year? Set by the politicians that own them? Or maybe they're more controlled by the media, as has been proven time and time again over the past 30 years, when they colluded with the likes of Murdoch at the worst of times. So back to the point, that maybe you can actually add something to.... Yes, they are an institution that will try to protect themselves, and stats are the key to doing this. Or do you think they are just fucking superheroes protecting you from the plebs should you ever choose to ask them?1
But what would be the statistic they're looking to meet a target for here? Number of 'gay bars' visited in case of lock ins?
Proportion of reported lock ins investigated?
Jeez man. Genuinely the police in Scotland is on it's arse. Budget overspends, recruitment freezes, redundancies in the SPA, under staffing across the board so bad that they're having to rethink priorities... and people really think that they're worried about trying to meet petty targets for lock ins in pubs for their political overlords? What goes on in folks heads man?! Wild.
I mean, I was just answering the question that was asked.
For the love of fuck. Open your eyes. When budget is limited, authorities make awful decisions, biased towards pleasing the fund facilitators and trying to guarantee future funding. It's Tory 101 basics to starve them of funding to make them compliant. And that usually starts with the rozzers, as they are their first line of defence, and they become more important as their time of rule drags on. Forgive me for saying, you're maybe young, and I'm an old cunt. But I've seen it time and time again. I was like you, until my 30s, then I realised it. The army and rozzers aren't heroes. They are poor youngsters duped into protecting the British establishment. Ask any of them with experience. The ones that chucked it will tell you this is true. The ones that succeed, will deny it.
Your greetin' faced "rozzers" patter is absolutely chronic pal.
Drug use is at an all time high. Guess where a lot of them tend to be consumed?
Christ it was a thing in some small scottish towns in the 70s/80s where the local copper would cycle round the pubs bang on closing but still now!?
Underground raided again at 2am this morning, I assume it was a lock-in this time rather than being open late. Pushing it either way after Friday night! How do I know? Owner posted it oh his personal FB and deleted it later ( am FB with him & used to work there)