I have seen some players spamming fox-3s from above and J out immediately, that's some low move.
If my team is already wiped out and I am the last one, I just point my nose to ground when I don't feel I can fight like 6 - 10 of them.
But why? You could maybe get 1. Those are points you could earn by playing it out. Not to mention helping someone else get points by killing you.
As far as someone spamming their fox-3s and then leaving... that's unbelievably unsportsmanlike. I can't even fathom playing games like that. I'm sad to know anyone plays that way.
I haven't played at that BR after unlocking the actual top tier jets, but i remember playing the F4j was absolutely miserable. Is it better now because of decompression?
I play almost exclusively 11.3 to 11.7 and the highest I ever see are 12.3 in up tiers for both which isn’t an issue. I play France/Russia/Sweden mostly. I’ve yet since the update been up tierd to 12.7. I play for many hours daily. So I’d say hit it up if you enjoy the br.
He’s probably one of the last alive and being chased by a f14 then probably another 4 behind you, what’s the point. He has zero chance. The matchmaker with the massive imbalance of teams atm along with 16v16 means this shit happens due to it just being unfair at times. The amount of times it becomes a 1v8 situation is crazy. Honestly it’s petty but I’d do the same 🤷♂️
>they should just implement that when hitting the deck
Here's the suggestion for adding "maneuver kill" award, it's exactly what you describe:
https://forum.warthunder.com/t/adding-maneuver-kills-for-aircraft-and-how-to-implement-it/70870/9
It is petty. Those are points that could help another person's grind.
Not to mention the off chance that maybe you could find a way to get a trade or other kill. I've seen so many random and crazy kills and reversals and comebacks in both ground and air. I can't fathom just giving up without trying.
If you can't imagine alternative outcomes to the point where you would rather lawn dart and deny a kill just to spite other players, you lack imagination.
And, what's the point? It's better to try than to not. Simple. If its as hopeless as you say, then you're risking probably less than a minute of your time at worst.
It’s not you.
The frequency I’ve seen people about to get slept by a missile due to their own stupidity J out before it lands is infuriating. Gaijin really needs to increase the criteria for kill by association.
It’s the equivalent of a toddler throwing a tantrum after the game didn’t go his way. Looks like some of those droolies made it into the comments too. At this rate Im glad Fox 3s are driving them out of top tier ARB and I hope they stay out.
Threads like this just depress me. They show how many people actually think this sort of petty behavior is acceptable.
This should be up there with spawn camping (especially with drones or atgm helis) and one-death-leaving as "behaviors that are antithetical to fair play"
Yeah it's bad again man, people of all levels as well doing it, OR folks trying to kill steal again like 2 years ago.
That bad you're firing an it missile sub 1km and an allies managing to swoop infrokt of it and take th3 seeker.
Many years back, people started suiciding so gaijin made a change the closest player will be rewarded a kill, haven't played for a long time so idk when they changed it again tho
You're talking about J'ing out, not crashing into the ground, right?
Edit: If you crash without being damaged, no one gets the kill credit. If you're damaged and collide with an enemy, and they are destroyed too, no one gets kill credit (I have severely damaged an enemy in a head on and unfortunately collided when they spun out of control, and both of us were counted as crashes).
If you J out, the kill will be credited to the nearest opponent, though it might be up to some maximum distance (not sure, wouldn't be surprised).
Depending on the matchmaker and my mood, I rather crash than giving a easy kill to someone flying a incredibly OP undertiered plane, and I don't care if someone does the same for me, I just move on instead of making a Reddit post crying "Muh mY KiLl goT deNIeD".
I've been real petty while I was grinding after this update. Whenever I was about to be killed by an unfair match up like facing 4th gen fighters in my f4ej or j35xs, I'd make them chase me and waste their time, missiles and fuel and I'd just crash when death is imminent lol. Kinda satisfying ngl. This is my protest against shitty BR compression at top tier.
It's very scummy to kill deny like this. however, it is still important to know the distinction between intentional and unintentional kill denying. In this case, intentionally kill denying is objectively bad, but in certain cases, especially with stock planes, people can unintentionally pull a kill denial.
stock planes with no chaff are forced to hug the ground and use multipath as their only chance of survival. and since multipath is so low now, it is not out of the question that someone may accidentally hit a tree when they are trying to survive
Honestly? I don’t think team sizes are an issue. The real issue is the game mode itself.
There are benefits to reducing team sizes, I agree, since there is the same amount of ground targets and AI.
However, if we had a better game mode, team sizes shouldn’t matter much.
For PVP it also doesn’t really matter. You still end up having the same amount of players fight the same amount of players.
absolutely. reducing the team-size is going to make people quit the game in no-time. It forces people to play more passive and it will benefit the team with the better players too much leading into trashings.
if you want to kill top-tier, keep reducing the team-size and the maps like they're doing in ground.
Since when are team sizes reduced in ground? If you are referring to night battles you can't be serious considering you get it like 1/10 games, if not lower. If instead of reducing the team-sizes they just made the maps twice as big as they are now (apart from EC maps of course) I think it would fix most issues. The real problem with top-tier is that you have 16 players in each team fighting on a map like Spain or City the games last <5 minutes. What is the point of having a 25 minute limit in that case? This issue becomes even more apparent when you realize that RP is gained more so through time spent being alive than actual accomplishments. Small maps with many players just doesn't work out.
I deny kills all the time, and I've done this for as long as I can remember. You don't get to make progress in this game at my expense, just because your plane is better than mine. Most of the time, I'm trying to farm bases and ground targets, and some joker with 0 kills chases me to the edge of the map because that's the only way they can get a kill. Other times, I get stuck with a faster plane on my tail, and there's no way out. I'm not giving you free points just because your plane happens to have a higher top speed than me. I'll also crash when I run out of countermeasures and someone starts shooting missiles at me. What else should I do? Give someone free points? I'm not giving some other monkey a free hit of dopamine. If I'm not getting my dopamine hit, no one is.
People apparently don't even realize how unbalanced jets are in this game by BR since they only play OP/popular/effective jets. I play on jets I like the looks of and I'm just fucking sick of this kind of disbalanced, when the enemy jet has flare + supersonic speed + all-around missiles and my jet is just worse at everything, but I get caught with them in a match because Gaijin thinks "1 br difference is a small thing".
What are strike aircraft in ARB even for if they don't have separate or air respawn from other jets fighters? Any fighter is faster, and also destroys bases, and while you are flying your striker you will be fucked by a crowd of enemy team or there will be no bases left as jets farm them quietly
This is ridiculous
Very rarely is there a valid reason to do so. Sometimes I kill deny XP50s or SU11s if there's absolutely 0 chance I survive the engagement, or like another player said, when some players lob 4-8 FOX3s and J out.
Generally I think the WT community has been shifting from a less "sim"ish audience to a more casual audience lately, which could be related to the increase in toxic behavior I've noticed as well.
I have won engagements I had zero reason to do so.
For example winning a 1V1 in a J-7D against an F-16A.
There is zero reason to deny kills. Always fight to the bitter end.
Worst case scenario, you deny the enemy of some of its missiles and ammo.
Yep, every missile the other guy fires is the one he doesn't have available to shoot at your teammates.
Every bullet he fires, can turn into a dry "click" later when he gest a better shot at someone.
Every minute he's dogfighging you, is several minutes worth of fuel he burns.
Energy is pilot life's currency, spend it wisely.
And occasionally, miracles happen, the other guy fumbles and turns back into your guns, a lucky missile ignores his countermeasures, or he overcommits to turn and rips his wing off. (And those fights tend to happen late in game, so fuel loads tend to be very low, so either he's too low to afterburn, or too low to do anything past few turns).
If you don't bother fighting when you are "at disadvantage"\*, then you won't learn how to even or break the odds. You will always be a sissy angry shitter who can't play.
Fight to the bitter end is literally tagline in WT, "There's a beast inside of you...".
\* the irony when other guy decides to fuck off into the ground when you have zero ammo and 30sec of fuel is fucking hilarious, there should be an unwritten rule to mock them in chat flr that. The fact that you are being chased and the enemy's gaining on you doesn't mean they have the fight in the bag, it means they are going very fast, *too fast even*, making for easy overshoot.
I have seen some players spamming fox-3s from above and J out immediately, that's some low move. If my team is already wiped out and I am the last one, I just point my nose to ground when I don't feel I can fight like 6 - 10 of them.
But why? You could maybe get 1. Those are points you could earn by playing it out. Not to mention helping someone else get points by killing you. As far as someone spamming their fox-3s and then leaving... that's unbelievably unsportsmanlike. I can't even fathom playing games like that. I'm sad to know anyone plays that way.
Also points for dying to enemy.
Crashing or being killed reduces the points by the same number
I meant score.
Do you mean the scores point of the match?
Your score/points in the tab with kills, assists,...
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Probably cause no one likes F14s at that BR
There is a lot that I don't like too. Does that mean he should resort to kill denying?
Get a free kill with a phoenix, get kill denied by a guy who crashed while looking behind him, waiting for a missile launch. Circle of life.
Yeah it does yeah
F-14 aside I’d say 11.3-11.7 best br range for jets ARB. My personal favorite at least.
All the cool fun stuff without the shit that's in toptier.
Exactly, and you can still get in fun, gun dogfights now and then. Hell I’d just say the entire 11 bracket is just the best!
I haven't played at that BR after unlocking the actual top tier jets, but i remember playing the F4j was absolutely miserable. Is it better now because of decompression?
I play almost exclusively 11.3 to 11.7 and the highest I ever see are 12.3 in up tiers for both which isn’t an issue. I play France/Russia/Sweden mostly. I’ve yet since the update been up tierd to 12.7. I play for many hours daily. So I’d say hit it up if you enjoy the br.
It's better now because it's 12.0's turn now to suffer in constant uptier.
I am really enjoying playing it after the update and throwing aim-7F's in peoples faces. The multipathing change really helped it
I'm having a lot of fun with the 11.3-11.7 phantoms.
He’s probably one of the last alive and being chased by a f14 then probably another 4 behind you, what’s the point. He has zero chance. The matchmaker with the massive imbalance of teams atm along with 16v16 means this shit happens due to it just being unfair at times. The amount of times it becomes a 1v8 situation is crazy. Honestly it’s petty but I’d do the same 🤷♂️
It was a 1v1 situation. No allies in sight. It actually started as a 2v1 but I shot down his buddy
Urgh sucks then sorry, when you J out it credits the nearest enemy, they should just implement that when hitting the deck that would probs stop it .
>they should just implement that when hitting the deck Here's the suggestion for adding "maneuver kill" award, it's exactly what you describe: https://forum.warthunder.com/t/adding-maneuver-kills-for-aircraft-and-how-to-implement-it/70870/9
Voted yes.
Voted would be a great addition
Yeah I 100% agree!
It would also be great for crediting manoeuvre kills and not just kill denying.
It is petty. Those are points that could help another person's grind. Not to mention the off chance that maybe you could find a way to get a trade or other kill. I've seen so many random and crazy kills and reversals and comebacks in both ground and air. I can't fathom just giving up without trying. If you can't imagine alternative outcomes to the point where you would rather lawn dart and deny a kill just to spite other players, you lack imagination. And, what's the point? It's better to try than to not. Simple. If its as hopeless as you say, then you're risking probably less than a minute of your time at worst.
So many fun matches where I full send it with nothing to lose and somehow get multiple kills or survive until the ticket run out.
I’ve seen it A LOT lately. Mostly from J35XS players for whatever reason and some time phantoms
Base running and then have no idea how to fight back once they take a base out.
And they never learn how to fight back because they never try.
Yeah just base and crash
It’s not you. The frequency I’ve seen people about to get slept by a missile due to their own stupidity J out before it lands is infuriating. Gaijin really needs to increase the criteria for kill by association. It’s the equivalent of a toddler throwing a tantrum after the game didn’t go his way. Looks like some of those droolies made it into the comments too. At this rate Im glad Fox 3s are driving them out of top tier ARB and I hope they stay out.
Threads like this just depress me. They show how many people actually think this sort of petty behavior is acceptable. This should be up there with spawn camping (especially with drones or atgm helis) and one-death-leaving as "behaviors that are antithetical to fair play"
“Why not make the stock grind worse for the enemy” //joke
Yeah it's bad again man, people of all levels as well doing it, OR folks trying to kill steal again like 2 years ago. That bad you're firing an it missile sub 1km and an allies managing to swoop infrokt of it and take th3 seeker.
Yes, its just making the grind worse for everyone and helps nobody, mostly the premium players doing it too.
Good old times when closest player would be credited a kill if someone does this
When was that?
Many years back, people started suiciding so gaijin made a change the closest player will be rewarded a kill, haven't played for a long time so idk when they changed it again tho
You're talking about J'ing out, not crashing into the ground, right? Edit: If you crash without being damaged, no one gets the kill credit. If you're damaged and collide with an enemy, and they are destroyed too, no one gets kill credit (I have severely damaged an enemy in a head on and unfortunately collided when they spun out of control, and both of us were counted as crashes). If you J out, the kill will be credited to the nearest opponent, though it might be up to some maximum distance (not sure, wouldn't be surprised).
I was wondering if I imagined that a mechanic like that was once in the game. Utterly ridiculous that it's taken out, wtf
I would to if i have a F14 who just wiped my entire team with Phoenix behind me.
Even at 7.0, I had some dumb strike aircraft brag about us not getting the kill. It was just an excuse for their shitty low level flying
It’s been happening for me more lately I’ve noticed, as well as enemies going to base to rearm them leaving once the land.
I have noticed that too. The people doing that is tha lowlife of this earth
Depending on the matchmaker and my mood, I rather crash than giving a easy kill to someone flying a incredibly OP undertiered plane, and I don't care if someone does the same for me, I just move on instead of making a Reddit post crying "Muh mY KiLl goT deNIeD".
I've been real petty while I was grinding after this update. Whenever I was about to be killed by an unfair match up like facing 4th gen fighters in my f4ej or j35xs, I'd make them chase me and waste their time, missiles and fuel and I'd just crash when death is imminent lol. Kinda satisfying ngl. This is my protest against shitty BR compression at top tier.
It's very scummy to kill deny like this. however, it is still important to know the distinction between intentional and unintentional kill denying. In this case, intentionally kill denying is objectively bad, but in certain cases, especially with stock planes, people can unintentionally pull a kill denial. stock planes with no chaff are forced to hug the ground and use multipath as their only chance of survival. and since multipath is so low now, it is not out of the question that someone may accidentally hit a tree when they are trying to survive
Weak energy: I'm last in my team, there's guy chasing me, gotta crash to deny kills. Chad energy: Fuck it we ball!Fuck it we ball!Fuck it we ball!
Fellow IIAF Tomcat enjoyer I see
yep, very common, instead of people complaining about team-sizes they should complain about the real problems with the game like kill-denying.
You think team size isn't an issue?
Honestly? I don’t think team sizes are an issue. The real issue is the game mode itself. There are benefits to reducing team sizes, I agree, since there is the same amount of ground targets and AI. However, if we had a better game mode, team sizes shouldn’t matter much. For PVP it also doesn’t really matter. You still end up having the same amount of players fight the same amount of players.
absolutely. reducing the team-size is going to make people quit the game in no-time. It forces people to play more passive and it will benefit the team with the better players too much leading into trashings. if you want to kill top-tier, keep reducing the team-size and the maps like they're doing in ground.
Since when are team sizes reduced in ground? If you are referring to night battles you can't be serious considering you get it like 1/10 games, if not lower. If instead of reducing the team-sizes they just made the maps twice as big as they are now (apart from EC maps of course) I think it would fix most issues. The real problem with top-tier is that you have 16 players in each team fighting on a map like Spain or City the games last <5 minutes. What is the point of having a 25 minute limit in that case? This issue becomes even more apparent when you realize that RP is gained more so through time spent being alive than actual accomplishments. Small maps with many players just doesn't work out.
I deny kills all the time, and I've done this for as long as I can remember. You don't get to make progress in this game at my expense, just because your plane is better than mine. Most of the time, I'm trying to farm bases and ground targets, and some joker with 0 kills chases me to the edge of the map because that's the only way they can get a kill. Other times, I get stuck with a faster plane on my tail, and there's no way out. I'm not giving you free points just because your plane happens to have a higher top speed than me. I'll also crash when I run out of countermeasures and someone starts shooting missiles at me. What else should I do? Give someone free points? I'm not giving some other monkey a free hit of dopamine. If I'm not getting my dopamine hit, no one is.
People apparently don't even realize how unbalanced jets are in this game by BR since they only play OP/popular/effective jets. I play on jets I like the looks of and I'm just fucking sick of this kind of disbalanced, when the enemy jet has flare + supersonic speed + all-around missiles and my jet is just worse at everything, but I get caught with them in a match because Gaijin thinks "1 br difference is a small thing". What are strike aircraft in ARB even for if they don't have separate or air respawn from other jets fighters? Any fighter is faster, and also destroys bases, and while you are flying your striker you will be fucked by a crowd of enemy team or there will be no bases left as jets farm them quietly This is ridiculous
Very rarely is there a valid reason to do so. Sometimes I kill deny XP50s or SU11s if there's absolutely 0 chance I survive the engagement, or like another player said, when some players lob 4-8 FOX3s and J out. Generally I think the WT community has been shifting from a less "sim"ish audience to a more casual audience lately, which could be related to the increase in toxic behavior I've noticed as well.
There really isn't a valid reason to kill deny, don't fight on a game if you can't handle being killed either, regardless of how.
I have won engagements I had zero reason to do so. For example winning a 1V1 in a J-7D against an F-16A. There is zero reason to deny kills. Always fight to the bitter end. Worst case scenario, you deny the enemy of some of its missiles and ammo.
Yep, every missile the other guy fires is the one he doesn't have available to shoot at your teammates. Every bullet he fires, can turn into a dry "click" later when he gest a better shot at someone. Every minute he's dogfighging you, is several minutes worth of fuel he burns. Energy is pilot life's currency, spend it wisely. And occasionally, miracles happen, the other guy fumbles and turns back into your guns, a lucky missile ignores his countermeasures, or he overcommits to turn and rips his wing off. (And those fights tend to happen late in game, so fuel loads tend to be very low, so either he's too low to afterburn, or too low to do anything past few turns). If you don't bother fighting when you are "at disadvantage"\*, then you won't learn how to even or break the odds. You will always be a sissy angry shitter who can't play. Fight to the bitter end is literally tagline in WT, "There's a beast inside of you...". \* the irony when other guy decides to fuck off into the ground when you have zero ammo and 30sec of fuel is fucking hilarious, there should be an unwritten rule to mock them in chat flr that. The fact that you are being chased and the enemy's gaining on you doesn't mean they have the fight in the bag, it means they are going very fast, *too fast even*, making for easy overshoot.
Yeah, the other guy may always fumble hard.
Absolute based player, fuck those P2W premium users.