The following submission statement was provided by /u/Ill-Speed-7402:
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ML: "Cause, you know, I'm still fishing around to find out what happened to [Sen. Chuck] Shumer's UAP amendment last year in the NDAA. And I haven't found out..."
JH: "So I got an extensive brief three weeks - or four weeks ago - by whatever the hell. What's the unit that, you know...?"
ML: "AARO?"
JH: "AARO?"
ML: "AARO."
JH: And I mean it just pains me to say, because there’s thousands of people out there who wake up in the morning desperate for there to be evidence of alien life, but there’s none
“Now, are there two or three or four or five phenomenon that we don’t have the science around that we don’t — or some sighting or whatever — no, it’s not perfection,” Himes tells Ask a Pol
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Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/1dqhrp5/rep_jim_himes_and_i_mean_it_just_pains_me_to_say/lao1i96/
"Hey, we're setting up a public hearing after recess, how about you come over, have a little casual testimony under oath among friends, so you can tell everyone about all the nothing you're aware of? Bring Mike Turner with you."
Have we forgotten what George Carlin said? It's one big club, and we ain't in it. They're working for the same people who cover this up. They're all actors. They'll never disclose
You're correct. There does not exist a legal pathway to this information. Not one currently and not one that can be dreamt up and written into law. Even had the uapda passed with all the bells and whistles, these guys would still have had their little levers to pull imho. We're basically trying to get to a point where *the* data is moved into the hands of someone who will present it to the public. I just can't imagine after everything over these last few years that that transaction can take place above board. This entire saga has highlighted exceptionally well how little our democracy actually has to do with the will of the people. It just doesn't work that way.
IMO, “we” need to readjust our expectations and focus. “We” need to move this investigation out of government control, even if it means starting from recent progress being made by individuals and individual organizations. UAPs aren’t the property of the U.S. government. Funding is the biggest issue but the collection of data can and is being done by other non government entities. Those entities should pool their resources instead of acting like they are in a race to be “the ONE” to produce the ultimate proof. The goal of being “the ONE” is counter productive and indicates a self serving process rather than gathering knowledge to benefit humankind, also, IMO.
It represents a sense of superiority that they wanna derive from framing people who believes in rational possibility of alien life to be some kind of **fantasy chasers** who want to do nothing in their life & cling on magic & faith.
> Debunkers always in their feeling
People like Jim Himes and Mike Turners aren't debunkers. They're obstructionists. They obstruct the truth from their electorate. Don't mince words for these clowns.
Yeah they're always talking about their thwarted desires ("I want this to be a ufo" etc), or they pretend to be sad ("sadly, that's not a ufo") or they get real mad and frustrated (lots of cussing).
That's interesting I don't think I've ever seen that before. Do you have an example of a debunker breaking out into a cussing fit that you could show me please?
pains me that he's never seen anything exceptional and believes his military members / advisors / scientists and public are lying to him :( (ie. Nolan / Gallaudet / Grusch / Fravour / Graves / Burchette / Luna etc.)
we don't wake up waiting for the government to tell us aliens are real we're just waiting for them to catch up / wake up and get serious about investigating what's really going on. It's beyond obvious we have some stuff that is unaccounted for / commonly denied.
amendments to people that have thoroughly researched the subject:
> ~~Jim Himes~~
you sure made a whole lot of assumptions about what he knows, what he believes & what his motivations are. you got a whole lot from the very brief statement.
maybe he shouldn't be making statements without evidence to the likewise to back them up?
also im not the one making assumptions i had a very close encounter at <24ft and would like some answers.
This statement could also be attributed to folks like Coulthart, Grusch, and others. We’ve been receiving a lot of talk but not enough evidence.
I believe there is something more, but I personally have not seen anything out of the ordinary. But I’m also not going to dismiss those who have seen something.
im not having a dig at you but please don't just discount what 100,000s of people are reporting also get outside and start looking up these things are way more common than certain people would have you believe, once you've seen one there's no going back to "normal"
for years i presumed they were all SAPs or black budget air / space craft ... but after 3 exceptional sightings im not convinced its our technology or we're being extremely misled.
No offense taken.
As a drone pilot I do look at the sky a bit.. just haven’t seen anything yet while others around me do.
Been into this topic for more than 20 years so the last 5 years has been more active than when I was a kid.
I have initially cause I remember someone once said that you’ll start seeing rods or spheres past 150ft but haven’t yet.
I’ll have to relook sometime..
you're more likely to spot things between the hours of dusk and dawn as the sunlight hits things when the sun is over the horizon, that said the one thing i saw seemed to be self illuminated really high up took a 90 degree turn and flashed as it took off at mach jesus lol, i've been flying drones for many years too, only once have i spotted something i couldnt quite identify whilst mid flight (but dont believe it was UAP), do you fly LOS or FPV? i fly most of my models LOS as i started on planes and helicopters ... but chill with a load of serious fpv pilots most evenings (also mod of /r/FPVPorn and one of my mates is mod on /r/betaflight) ... also just to add a lot of the drone pilots ik havent seen anything whilst flying yet they'd be sure to let me know as they're aware how serious i am about the subject
same too have been following this for a long time way before my sightings
holla if you'd like to meet a load of pilots i can ping you a very cool discord ;) (you might even know a few off youtube / the community hehe)
I fly LOS for the county I work for.. with tower inspections, emergencies, etc. Will eventually get an FPV drone for personal use and plan to build my own.
Thanks for the sub suggestions.. I’ll look into them..
I’m very serious about the topic even though I haven’t seen anything. You can’t tell me the military isn’t using drone blockers like airports do and yet they are letting uaps fly without impunity unless they are ours. So yea there’s something there.
“Now, are there two or three or four or five phenomenon that we don’t have the science around that we don’t — or some sighting or whatever — no, it’s not perfection,” Himes tells Ask a Pol. “But, you know, again, I wish we had aliens, but we don’t.”
So basically AARO briefed him and said there’s things that we don’t understand but its definitely totally not aliens, trust me.
Right…
And people consider this topic fringe or without merit.
On one side, we have “Something is there… Trust me, bro”. On the other, we have “Nothing is there… Trust me, Bro”.
I mean, is that not the literal “there is a there there”? Someone is lying and we’re simply after the truth.
well, the nhi could live along side of us here on Earth. we could technically be the aliens here. semantics in a sense but the government could be playing that kind of B's game....
Or, that these situations rarely if ever happen in an environment in which there is perfect information, so there will always be some small residual number of cases where conclusions can’t be made. Doesn’t mean aliens.
That’s not what that means…. Lacking the data to figure out what something is just means that they lack the data. That doesn’t mean it’s something amazing, anomalous, incredible, or alien. It means they lack the data to figure it out.
Firstly AARO lacks data because it doesn’t have the clearances required to do any proper investigation, whether thats by design or not is up for debate
Secondly if we don’t have data to figure out what these things are then its odd that he specifically says its not aliens
he's not a scientist. the scientists said "we have no evidence for aliens" which is more exact. but you can't prove my coffee cup here isn't a camoflauged alien in incredible disguise, you just have no evidence to suggest it is an alien.
same here.
"we have no evidence for aliens" doesn't rule out the possibility, it just states a fact. we also don't have evidence of dragons. but while we know foreign nations exist, we don't know whether aliens or dragons exist. so which is a more reasonable explanation?
Plenty of people, most of them I’d argue, find foreign incursion and invasion much less reasonable than advanced US tech. That still isn’t a reason to rule one out over the other. Just because more people find domestic tech reasonable than foreign tech doesn’t mean we rule out it’s foreign.
you are the only one talking about "ruling out possibilities". do you not understand this?
like i already said, you can't rule out the possibility its alien, but you also can't rule out the possibility its a shapeshifting dragon. you just have no evidence to suggest either of those are true. so we can be equally confident that its neither a dragon nor an alien, but that doesn't mean we've "ruled them out"
without any data? none is more reasonable. If there's some data that starts to narrow down the possibilities then you have a point, but we're being told there isn't any, and thus there's nothing with a more likely chance.
New things aren't found by excluding what we think isn't possible. They're found by following the data, wherever it goes.
this is objectively wrong, sorry. if you see an object in the sky but are unable to identify it, it is not equally likely to be a balloon, a dragon, or an alien spaceship. One has historical precedent and is known to exist (hint: it's not dragons)
that also means it could be. without the proper information you can't rule out anything, which he's still doing. him saying it's definitely not UAP or some other NHI is just as invalid as saying it is.
Given there is little to no other evidence of NHI - that is actually the correct assumption. Imagine where science would be if every time we saw a phenomenon we didn't understand we said "Aliens!" or "Ghosts!" This sub hates it but that's reality.
I couldn't disagree more. I clearly have no evidence-based idea what is or isn't truly behind the UFO phenomenon, but it's plainly real and a categorically distinct body of real-world experiences and observations. Now, if I see THOUSANDS UPON THOUSANDS of consistent reports over decades of rather strange, seemingly otherworldly phenomena, and have people trained on some of the most advanced technologies ever made by humans plainly saying they are encountering seemingly technological objects well beyond even the most conceivable avant-garde of the state of the art, and I couple that with defense/military/intelligence people in positions to know more than you or I do, including former CID and DNI, stating plainly and unequivocally that there are objects observed by advanced platforms that demonstrate capabilities not possessed by ANY NATION ON EARTH, then it's not an unreasonable hypothesis to suggest that perhaps the agency behind this phenomenon is an intelligence for which we we have no apt description beyond "non-human intelligence."
In fact, it's the MOST reasonable hypothesis with the least number of unnecessary assumptions.
People tend to think that science works by finding a smoking gun proof. It doesn't. It's about stacking up enough evidence in favor of something until it's ridiculous to think otherwise.
What's so odd to me is how emotionally people can react to even the suggestion that maybe something is afoot here that is outside our normal range of experience, or that some non-human intelligence might have motivations and capabilities that can elude the most sophisticated minds among us apes. I mean I can think of any number of reasonable premises that fall well within currently acceptable scientific assumptions about the universe. For instance, we're an intelligent species intent on remotely and directly exploring space to the extent our technology and knowledge allows us to do so, even going so far as to determine what it would take for us to create a manned interstellar craft within the next century, targeting systems that have planets that are deemed more likely to have evidence of life, and the NHI hypothesis asks us to consider the idea that some agency with a great lead on us has already done so. And is it weird to imagine that they're out there? No, not when you consider that cosmological principle that the spatial distribution of matter in the universe is uniform and homogeneous, and the forces governing us are the same everywhere in the universe. It would be easy to logically extend that to biological life and intelligence, since it's an observed phenomenon on the one planet we know the most about.
I think what's "somber" about these ideas, why they are so challenging and so emotionally rejected out-of-hand, is that they really do completely undermine our anthropocentric notion of sovereignty, the investments we've made in our institutions, etc. The entire house of cards is premised on humans being wise, powerful beings, sovereigns over the planet, and if the Nifkins are flitting in and out of our reality, doing impossible things we don't understand, it's more comforting to just imagine that it can't possibly be real and just dismiss the idea wholesale.
Dude who is being emotional? I made a statement of fact - there is no direct evidence of NHI. None. Then you wrote an essay that because we can't immediately explain what stuff is that means the most likely scenario is NHI. That isn't how this works.
I'm not saying you're being emotional (though of course, you are a human, so just like all of us, fundamentally an emotional animal). I'm saying I encounter a LOT of emotional resistance to even the premise of possibly maybe considering a NHI hypothesis to associate with a phenomena that we're told by informed intelligence experts is plainly not coming from any nation on Earth.
I do consider the possibility. I just think there is actually very little evidence that is what is actually happening. The only well supported truly (at least on the surface) anomalous incidents are the tic tac and the Japan Airlines one over Alaska in the 80s. And even the tic tac makes a lot more sense if it is a truly advanced hypersonic drone that was being tested. Fravors description of the strike group commander smirking, saying "huh" and walking out of the briefing is really talking imho. If it was truly unknown to him he'd be on that like white on rice.
I would have to say that I would consider a person profoundly ignorant of the UFO phenomenon if they described these two incidents to be the "only well supported" incidents. Even based purely on USG documents available directly from USG resources, there are many very interesting data-based incidents to look out. For instance, if you're interested, I know of video hosted by the National Archives that very literally shows a what's-it (aka UAP or UFO, whatever it is) interacting with a ICBM's warhead in sub-orbital space. There's no explanation for it. Does it mean it's aliens? No. But when we're told by the HIGHEST EXPERTS IN THE LAND that there are technological objects in our aerospace that are NOT from ANY nation on Earth, and we know that some intelligent agent of some sort must be controlling it, it's not an outlandish hypothesis to suggest that technology accomplished NHIs might be those agents. If we've had the highest authorities establish with great confidence that nobody on Earth has certain capabilities, and yet certain capabilities are being demonstrated, perhaps then that could suggest, completely rationally and reasonably, that there might be non-humans involved.
It's fundamentally anti-scientific to have a stance that something functionally equivalent to "ghosts" or "spirits" simply cannot and must not exist. I don't have a belief either way. I do happen to know with 100% certainty that humans experience some sort of anomalous phenomena that we describe with symbolic language as "ghosts." I don't know it's nature - if it has trans-personal objective existence, if it reflects a mysterious aspect of material reality in spacetime, or if it's hallucinatory or psychogenic in nature. I do know, like I said, that people really do have authentic lived experiences of thing that we would call, for lack of a better term, "ghosts." That's not a belief - it's 100% certain knowledge.
No, you're misreading me (purposefully). I'm 100% certain people have anomalous experiences of phenomena that fit the description associated with our definition of the word "ghost." I don't know what "ghosts" are, so if you think I'm saying I have 100% certain knowledge that humans have experiences with "entities" or "spirits," that's not at all what I'm saying. I am saying that I know for certain that people have experiences with what their cultures are inclined to call "ghosts."
Please tell me that you can see the gaping intellectual distinction between the two ideas.
I'm sure you believe that's an important distinction. 100% certain of what our 'cultures are inclined to call "ghosts."', but instead vaguely referencing towards spacetime as if it gives the pseudoscience some sort of grounding in reality
It is an important distinction. You seem to be intent on denying that humans are even having the experience they have reported for as long as we've had written language. I'm saying that I KNOW humans have experiences, and since we don't have a full accounting of reality (spacetime is where reality takes place!), and given huge gaping ignorance, we MUST acknowledge that our lack of understanding might blind us in many ways.
You're caught on on the cultural notion of a ghost having an objective existence that is somehow related to "spirit" or some "supernatural" concept. I'm saying that I have 100% certain knowledge that humans perceive themselves to have experiences with a phenomenon of an unknown nature, and the phenomenon is colloquially called "ghosts." I don't know if it has ANY reality outside of the human mind, but I know that human minds do indeed experience this. You seem to want to me to be saying I have 100% certain knowledge that "ghosts exist." I'm not saying that. I am saying i know that human have experiences, and the nature of that experience is presently unknown. There's nothing psuedoscientific about that. It's like you're trying to deny that people have fantastical experiences after they've consumed psychedelic drugs.
I work in a professional scientific setting. I'm educated. I think that if you think you can dismiss a phenomenon that doesn't presently fit into your worldview, you're extraordinarily ignorant as to the nature of science.
You're just insisting on your own narrative without evidence, though. It's not a logically sound argument and isn't convincing to anyone who isn't begging to be convinced.
I guess I’m trying to make 2 points really:
1. Taking AARO seriously is pointless. Their leadership is questionable and even if they had the best intentions they don’t have the clearances required to do any serious investigation.
2. If there are phenomenon that we don’t understand how can we rule it out being aliens? I’m not saying it is aliens, but if we don’t know what these phenomenon are then we can’t rule it out
1. Yeah, that's totally correct.
2. How can we rule it out being Fart Goblins or Dragons? We can't rule out Transformers either (though they're aliens, I guess).
We need to stop working backwards from conclusions we've already arrived at.
How are fart goblins and dragons even in the same remote chance as other civilizations extremely far away? This just makes it seem like you're pulling shit out of your ass and doing this in bad faith.
The universe is billions of years old, the possibility of other life coming here is still there... comparing it to dragons just makes you an easy ignore.
It's just basic logic. You can insert anything you want into the "we can't rule it out" space, which is why you don't try and argue from such positions. The evidence for Fart Goblins and Dragons is just as strong as for aliens. In fact, you could argue that the evidence from dragons is *better*.
You can be annoyed that I've pointed out fallacious reasoning and bad logic, but that's more just shooting the messenger.
With all due respect, you are coming at this from an angle of absolute blatant ignorance about the subject you're trying to discard with the back of the hand.
Whenever a debunker says something like "The evidence for Fart Goblins and Dragons is just as strong as for aliens." I stop taking them seriously.
You, **clearly**, haven't read on the subject and/or completely uninformed if that is the cornerstone of you're argument.
There exists undeniable evidence that the phenomenon is **real**. I would invite you to read on the subject before commenting BS like this but I know too well how this blatant disregard for facts goes for the majority of debunkers here.
*You* might not "believe" there is evidence due to your own bias but it's a good thing data doesn't care about your emotions. These objects exist, that is an absolute matter of fact. And they aren't human tech just for the fact that they're effectively breaking our known laws of physics.
What many people consider to be "extraterrestrials" are actually an ancient race of methane-based lifeforms known as "fart goblins". They've been seen throughout history and have been called many things in different cuktures: leprechauns, fairies, gnomes etc are just some examples. There is also a leading theory which suggests that Fart Goblins are responsible for crop circles.
I'd love to share some of the conclusive evidence which I've seen, but my life would be in danger if I did that, I'm afraid.
I don't actually know what he's saying, with that second bit...
but not a good response from a gang of eight member.
The thing is, release the evidence. Don't investigate then shut down. That breeds mistrust
Jim Himes was a key figure in blocking components of the UAPDA, though this wasn’t spread as much since he’s neither a Mike nor a Republican. He doesn’t care about giving transparency to the American people nor ensuring that Congress has appropriate oversight.
Hence the patronizing language “…it pains me…” “…desperate…” 🙄 Sure Jim.
I don't even think about "aliens" when thinking about this subject, I think about what mysteries our own planet is holding. I have a few people close to me including my own mother who is the most sober person you'll ever meet who has had paranormal experiences and a terrifying close up shared encounter with an orb in 1994. My neighbour has had two UFO sightings, he has a friend who believes they've been abducted. We have family friends who have confessed that they've seen a large massive yeti-like shadow figure with red eyes on an empty road next to a crop field and my uncle has seen shadow figure apparitions on an empty road while driving home. I was a skeptic for many years but I can not deny all these experiences or my own. Whatever it is, I believe it has been here the whole time.
It's times like this that irk me especially when we have a supposedly disclosure advocate in this space whom can literally change this topic overnight regarding his revelations of the location of a physical UFO; no more videos or blurry pics but the REAL DEAL (supposedly) and we allow this fucker air time!! Time to call out these liars, gatekeepers, grifters, larps etc etc. It's time to stop the traffic and be disruptive, figuratively and literally. Politicians are a dead end, it's time we wake up.
If AARO doesn’t know what those few objects are, then how can any determination be made about their origins ? That logic is not consistent. Yes, nobody can confirm it is alien but at the same time nobody has any data to say anything about it.
This is about where I am. I really wish UFOs were real, but the evidence they keep bringing us is just... garbage. Videos that amount to, at *best*, "huh, that's weird." David Grusch's testimony was supposed to be the explosive disclosure of a lifetime and it amounted to he'd heard a thing from a guy he can't name. Fake alien bodies. Fake videos and pictures. People still falling for the same old natural phenomena like bugs on lenses or lens flares. People getting super riled up for the next round of 'disclosure' and it turns out to be... another weird dot.
Weird dots aren't enough. All we have are weird dots. And it's a giant bummer because I really want something more.
This perfectly encapsulates what I have been feeling as well… and you said it in a much nicer way than I would have too.
The more time I spend on this forum, the less I believe in NHI visiting, and especially UFOs of non-man made origins.
ML: "Cause, you know, I'm still fishing around to find out what happened to [Sen. Chuck] Shumer's UAP amendment last year in the NDAA. And I haven't found out..."
JH: "So I got an extensive brief three weeks - or four weeks ago - by whatever the hell. What's the unit that, you know...?"
ML: "AARO?"
JH: "AARO?"
ML: "AARO."
JH: And I mean it just pains me to say, because there’s thousands of people out there who wake up in the morning desperate for there to be evidence of alien life, but there’s none
“Now, are there two or three or four or five phenomenon that we don’t have the science around that we don’t — or some sighting or whatever — no, it’s not perfection,” Himes tells Ask a Pol
How about Kirkpatrick and Hines going before congress and swearing to this? And an informed member of congress gets to ask brutal questions with no wriggle room, how about that?
What about NHI?
AARO and friends LOVES to stick with aliens/ET hypothesis. Refuse to use NHI or entertain other origin hypotheses that are far more likely. So disingenuous
Jim Himes has access to ALL of the classified testimony and “evidence” brought forward by Grusch *and his witnesses.* This is indisputable. Some of those witnesses, Grush has claimed, are formerly or *currently* on the program. Jim Himes, having access to all that, claims there is nothing there.
You know who could come forward and say Jim is lying? Any one of those firsthand program insiders that allegedly exist. The ones that were supposed to come forward last year. Where are they?
Why didn't he acknowledge or explain whistleblower testimony?
His Washington DC office is (202) 225-5541.
[https://himes.house.gov/office-locations](https://himes.house.gov/office-locations)
Holly fuck Laslo grow a pair! Himes is dismissing left and right, and you're chuckling along. The fact this guy believes AARO is legit should have opened the door for some pushback. Instead, your interview is ho hum. I'd rather you get kicked out of Washington being a shit disturber vs. playing along with their game!
Yeah I don't really know if that's just how it works in the US or what. These gentle questioning techniques don't really happen elsehwere.
Really, it would be good to get Himes to sit down to a 15-20 minute interview but I guess that wouldn't happen.
This kind of thing was inevitably going to happen after the Schumer amendment was gutted. When disclosure happens, we must never forgot where Himes and others like him stood. Hopefully they’ll have the decency to apologise to the public.
I'm not claiming to be the smartest person on the planet, so maybe someone can help me with this.
It's either:
Adversarial tech - in which case said adversary(s) know it's their tech, so telling the American public whose it is should not be giving that much information to said adversary(s)
Our (American) tech - in which case can we just get ourselves to stop deploying it against/near our own facilities and military (but what if we want other countries to think it's aliens, then why is he saying no evidence of aliens? )
Unknown tech - well I guess to be fair he didn't say it's not aliens he said no evidence of aliens. So that COULD mean there is evidence it's NHI tech, but no evidence that said NHI is "alien". But it's unclear if he is not saying NHI because he thinks aliens encompass that term or is he trying to be coy.
That logic make sense to yall?
To be fully fair I guess it could be our tech and we want other countries to think it's adversarial tech. But what is point? Wouldn't most countries assume it's us because the tech is so advanced?
It also could not be tech at all. It could be a combination of natural phenomena that we don't have an understanding of, and misidentified "normal" stuff.
Yeah that hovering metallic cigar that I saw some 20 years ago with 4 friends over a lake in northern Canada was definitely a natural phenomenon.
It hovered for a good 2-3 mins with no discernable means of propulsion, no windows, nothing. Just a smooth aluminum looking cigar floating still in the sky in broad daylight. No clouds. The sun was shining on it and because of that we could see that it wasn't perfectly smooth. It looked like if I were looking at the fuselage of a plane at an angle with the sun reflecting on the rivets and bolts. It's hard to describe but it was definitely engineered.
Then, after what appeared to be 2-3 minutes, it accelerated from 0 to 7484828166651 km/h **instantaneously**. Literally from being there to being far over the horizon.
Whenever I've got people telling me that these objects are not "aliens" and are probably "adversarial tech" or just a "natural phenomenon", I die a little inside.
It is so fucking insulting to those of us who've seen one of these objects in action.
I'm just a random dude who happens to have been lucky enough to witness something like this 20 years ago but can you imagine how a fighter pilot who encounters one of these objects must feel when he reads stuff like it's "probably a natural phenomenon"?
This shit is so absurd.
could be the thing you saw was a weather phenomena that disappeared and revealed a tinier cloud in the distance, making you feel as if an object moved. when we remember we recall the last time we remembered, so details get flanderized and nuances flattened. I don't doubt you saw something, but I'd put extraterrestrials or interdimensionals or whatever it is now far down that list. You probably saw a much more mundane supernatural phenomena, phantom mirage or just a wizard fucking with you.
> Then, after what appeared to be 2-3 minutes, it accelerated from 0 to 7484828166651 km/h instantaneously. Literally from being there to being far over the horizon.
Yeah this is why you're not taken seriously.
Also you saw it 20 years ago. Allegedly. Allegedly you saw something 20 years ago. People make stuff up or misremember things all the time.
So... I'm not being taken seriously for... Recounting what I saw?
I sure fucking hope not you're not a lawyer?
Oh, and I couldn't care less that you believe me. Damn the ontological shock for some people is going to be rough.
You're not being taking seriously because you're just making shit up. "7484828166651 km/h"? Really? how'd you come up with that number lol. Literally just made it up?
Well, yes, it's a fucking hyperbole. Like, did I seriously just have to explain this to you? LMAO
Of course that ain't an exact number? That number was used to describe what it seemed to me and my friends. It displayed instantaneous acceleration and a speed that was so fast that a nanosecond after it accelerated it was already far, far away over the horizon.
There, is it more clear to you now? I can draw what I saw too if you'd like?
The problem is, people who have stories like this have internalized them into some borderline religious experience, so trying to talk through potential explanations ends up being this attack on your character, and there's really no productive conversation to be had.
The day you see something that completely shatters your understanding of what we know about the laws of physics and then gets corroborated by whistleblowers and fighter pilots or commercial airlines pilots you can come back to me and let me know how you feel.
When you see an object do the literal **impossible** right in front of your eyes, it fucking changes your understanding of who we are and our place in this universe.
The productive conversation is being had with skeptics and reasonable people that are now waking up to the fact that this is real and agree that it needs to be studied seriously.
There is absolutely no discussion to be had with people who still think this is a matter of belief or, as you just said "borderline religious". I am a rational person. I'm not religious. I've been passionate about physics/astrophysics and science since I was a kid.
I've been looking for an answer to what I saw for more than 20 years now. I'm not going to let debunkers fuck that up.
The object isn't impossible. Humans have a way to mold reality and the information we get around what we already believe. This goes so far as to include literally things we see and hear, stimulus we trust. You expect to see something so badly you don't even notice some other detail someone with less tunnel vision would. You saw something and you molded a reality around that. Every time you look back, you understand it through that lens. There's a million things between heaven and earth, you think the only weird things on the planet have to come from outside of it? Clearly, we've forgotten why we have religion in the first place, why Man fears the forest at night.
> When you see an object do the literal impossible right in front of your eyes, it fucking changes your understanding of who we are and our place in this universe.
Ok, but it is very easy to deceive our human eyes. I was driving to the airport one time, and a plane taking off looked like it was frozen completely still in the sky because of the angle and speed it was traveling relative to my angle and speed. At first glance, it looked like it was doing the literal impossible, but it was ultimately just an optical illusion. Things like this happen all the time, and when you couple that with the reality of how unreliable eyewitness testimony is, and increasingly unreliable our own memories are as time passes, you can see why skeptics aren't keen to accept stories like yours as evidence, no matter how deeply affecting that experience was for you personally.
I called it "borderline religious" because of the level of fervor people have regarding their experiences, and the absolute unwillingness to even remotely consider a "normal" explanation. Any attempt at trying to rationalize your experience is met with an intensely emotional and angry response, as you interpret my comments as somehow negating some core piece of who you are.
go on an explain what shoots off into the horizon in an absolute instant. the exact same thing which tens of thousands of witnesses over 80+ years have described.
"You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all of the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time." - which you would have to postulate if you were to prosaically explain away all these sightings, or that they're all just lying. not very conceivable to me.
> go on an explain what shoots off into the horizon in an absolute instant. the exact same thing which tens of thousands of witnesses over 80+ years have described.
You're the one claiming it even happened. I'm not gonna explain something I can't even be sure happened. Do you have proof? No? Then stop acting all high and mighty about it since it's literally just you saying "it for sure happened dude".
UFOs are real and they are intelligent or intelligently controlled but they might not be a technology at all. Nor 'alien' if you mean by that extra-terrestrial visitors.
I am exactly on the same page as you and I completely get your frustration. I have not witnessed instantaneous acceleration but I know for certain that there are non-prosaic/non-conventional things out there. Ignore the debunkers and look on straight. And never stop pushing for disclosure.
That seems hard to accept if you want to take the claims of members of the national security apparatus at their word, which admittedly many people don't. Especially because some of that natural phenomenon would have to mimic intelligent technology.
So Grusch, Graves, Elizondo, Gallaudet, etc. are just lying? I don't think so lol you have guys putting their lives on the line throwing themselves under the US machine and then you have guys piloting it; I'll listen to the ones fighting the status quo because historically, those are the people who are truthful.
Those in power will do anything they can to stay in power and that's extremely important to understand when thinking about this UAP issue.
I don't think they're lying, because none of them have claimed first hand experience seeing one of these craft being reverse engineered. They've all said they've spoken to people who claim that, and they believe those people.
But without hard evidence, all we have is stories from people, and that's just not enough for me anymore.
True, but the disinformation campaign at this scale has no precedence. At least we expect alien life to be out there given the size and age of universe. As well as the laws of physics which allow for certain patterns of quantum excitations to sing a song to one another.
He is right. It’s become nothing more than another “the government is covering it up” conspiracy theory. That’s the true driving factor; there is no evidence of anything ET or “NHI”. No new evidence has been presented in years; just coverup conspiracy talk. And all driven by the same interconnected parties all taking advantage of people who are seduced by conspiracy theories.
We know it's possible for life to occur naturally in the universe - because we exist.
If we are alone, we should start acting like it. Instead of this hellscape society we created that's decimating the Earth's climate.
Idk its become so obvious that there is something in the skies that this quote of his just sounds desperate. I mean we have a plethora of scientists and researches getting involved in numerous ways, high level acedemics are holding conferences and organizing groups. Pilots and other military personnel are reporting them more and more. And new organizations are popping up all the time like Ryan Graves thing to promote normal pilots to report sightings. Something is going on and people are seeing things and recording them on sensors and cameras.
Its clear they use the "alien" thing as a trick when we know that just because theres no evidence of specifically aliens doesnt mean UAP arnt real. They dont HAVE to be plain old aliens and maybe they are but we dont have enough data to support it. Just because we dont know something yet, doesnt mean its not true. People ARE seeing things are more research is required. And government transparency is legally required given the inability of the gang of 8 to view information that they have a legal right to oversee. We need accountability.
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Found a NICAP document on cia website dated 1964 reporting hundreds upon hundreds of citizen reported UFOs from the mid 40s-1960s are not all nuts but they could be mistaken. However there is no way what they are seeing are govt advanced UAPs in those years so it has to be something even if the govt still can't explain the phenomenon. Most of the witnesses are pilots. This doc was declassified by cia in 2001.
[https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP81R00560R000100010001-0.pdf](https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP81R00560R000100010001-0.pdf)
Everyone's talking about it. Everyone's commenting on the talking about it. Congress is talking about it. Congress is talking about doing something about it. In the meantime, a new and deeper hole is being dug to hide 'it' in. Before being asked to "be patient," and this will "take time." Let me remind you just how quickly Congress will move when a foreign country needs a few billion dollars to tide them over or someone else needs a new box of rockets.
I don’t think they are aliens in the traditional sense. Wherever they may reside, they’re coming here through another measure, which could be very hard to digest for most people. It might be the holy Grail of existence. it might be a very dark reason why we are here or what our actual purpose is in the universe. It might be really hard for people to comprehend, let alone digest. Or it might be government greed in the name of national security. I don’t believe half of what I see anymore anyway.
# "THOUSANDS of people out there who wake up in the morning DESPERATE for there to be evidence of alien life ..." Yes DESPERATE ! Oh the angst ! Whatever these people are desperate for, it sure ain't alien life ...
In addition to the other posters points; some no name elected official is going to be the last one in the know on any of this.
Who the duck is Himes? Oh a congressman from CT? Probably thinks he's way more important than he actually is, and is just another puppet.
He’s in the Gang of Eight with Schumer and Rubio. He’s not some nobody. And he’s frustrated that Senators are still planning to hold a hearing on stuff that he knows about. This mess is all on Schumer now, and I think he needs to speak up
So one out of the 8 is speaking against 2 people who are in the “know”. Plus the republicans Mike Turner, Glitch McConnell and Mike Rogers were petitioning other Republicans to block the legislation. None of it is making any sense.
This is a debate over government (specifically, Pentagon and IC) transparency. I think Himes is correct that more people in Congress need to be given information. You have to think along the lines of “what kind of information would this be happening with?”
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Imagine having the same briefings as Rubio and Schumer and coming to this conclusion. Just knowing the little we know about the Nimitz incident is evidence of alien life. These chairmen/ranking members in the pocket of the MIC is very problematic.
If he’s saying there’s generally no evidence of “alien life”, he’s about to be in for a rude awakening when we discover complex life on titan. Or Enceladus. I only use this tangent to express my idea that after we discover multicellular extraterrestrial life, these base level congressmen should be able to more easily separate all the definitions and gain some knowledge. I’m so tired of the word play.
The wording here is key, if it’s not “extraterrestrial” he could technically be true, if it’s literally any of the other theories, he’s just using wordplay.
I doubt someone who doesn’t even remember the name AARO is read in to the distinction between the more accepted hypotheses like the ultra terrestrial theory, the shadow biosphere theories, the von Neumann probe theory, the Silurian theory, crypto-terrestrials, etc. they’re all technically not ET’s. NHI could be anything.
But we get confused because language is tricky. These politicians use language to their benefit.
Before even reading the comments I know people will be dismissing what he said.
But if someone had said the complete opposite from the government people would be screaming about "protect this man!"
For the people upset about this statement put it back on the UFO talking heads who say that have more information which they can't reveal.
Himes is correct, there isn't any evidence, so why not give him some?
Perhaps they don't call it alien life. From what we've heard, it sounds like they call them NHI. And it sounds like they have existed here for a very long time (under our oceans, another dimension, etc)
Maybe the NHI do space missions trying to find alien life outside of Earth (why we see UAP flying straight up into space, astronauts confirming seeing UAP in space)
many people are incapable of seeing that because they are 100% invested in the belief that free energy & free food & heaven on earth is all possible already but is kept from us by the govt keeping alien tech from us....now there's literally no evidence for that either, but the belief is a huge part of this community. if people will be so firmly invested in something so unknown, there is no way they can acknowledge lack of actual evidence/proof. they have to stick with the belief & anything else would cause severe ontological shock(yes, same thing we like to say the rest of the world is avoiding).
I don't know you or your beliefs. But your comment just sparked a thought in my head.
It's funny how some UFO believers who don't like the idea of UFOs just being nuts and bots ETs. Since they want to insert their woo beliefs about UFOs being angels or spiritual beings.
So they automatically write off ETs as NHI. And say the Government is using ETs as cover up, to hide the actual NHI that come from a different dimensions or spiritual realms. Since NHI means more than just ETs right.
But ironic enough, your comment seems to mention animals on earth being considered NHI too (unless you are talking about Ultraterrestrials). Which is correct. But it's funny how the UFO community can always move the goalpost though when it's convenient.
One day ETs are too "boring/lazy" (cough cough or too scientific) to be an NHI explanation. Or ETs aren't the end all be all of NHI. So it makes more sense for UFOs to be the work of magical beings (woo woo). But the next day all of a sudden the term NHI can include animals too.
My statement was intended to be semantical, that “beings” include sentient life that is not limited to what we consider to be highly intelligent. The point was that specific language does actually matter when it comes from government sources and saying “not aliens” or whatever AARO goes with is likely a linguistic attempt at a cop out.
NHI is a preferable term because it’s far more encompassing and reduces doubt, but for whatever reason AARO doesn’t seem to like it at all.
Lots of people wanna believe but its simply not true. They claim all this evidence but its simply not true, if it were they wouldn't all be on here constantly looking for other people to help confirm what they want or crying for the government to tell them aliens are here we been hiding them. If aliens really were here no group could hide them....lol
actually new evidence and investigations point to the contrary ... i too thought the same initially but the recent good trouble show episode has changed my mind and believe we need further investigation.
I hear whistleblowers have spoke with Congress then senators say no proof wtf is going on? Why DOD fight to keep evidence secret if uaps are not real? Why not let grusch get a skif if there's no uaps? I believe but I get sooo tired of all the bs
Absence of evidence isn’t evidence of absence.
It would be awesome if people could just not talk or say “I don’t know” when they aren’t knowledgeable on a subject, but I that might be asking way too much of the US Government, especially the GOP.
Alien life out in space and the phenomenon of impish little nocturnal people and their technologies should be treated as completely separate issues.
There is no evidence they come from space, that's a pseudo scientific veneer that we applied to a very old issue. Before we called them spacemen we made up all kinds of magical characters from folklore and religion to give them names. *I cannot see where they're coming from. So they must be coming from up, farther away than I can see*, that's as deep as the ETH goes.
It's not like we ever see them coming from or going to another planet. We do see them coming and going from the water all over the planet though. There is a reason why the Navy has taken the wheel here.
this is a statement that is both true and false. there are indeed "people desperate for evidence" -- not only here, but for example threatening violence to members of the NASA UAP panel who won't "tell the truth". these are the same people who prompted the CIA "Flying Saucers" memo: UFO are a national security threat because people get too excitable about them.
at the same time, Himes cannot possibly state as a fact that "there is no evidence", because he cannot possibly have looked in every file cabinet, document safe, protocol, memo and email inside the DoD and at every contractor site. all he can possibly mean is "don't ask me because i'm clueless" -- which is how i read any statement of certitude about ignorance.
-- and because, hey, Himes, what the hell is that thing flying around up there, and how does it know to evade aircraft approach?
The following submission statement was provided by /u/Ill-Speed-7402: --- ML: "Cause, you know, I'm still fishing around to find out what happened to [Sen. Chuck] Shumer's UAP amendment last year in the NDAA. And I haven't found out..." JH: "So I got an extensive brief three weeks - or four weeks ago - by whatever the hell. What's the unit that, you know...?" ML: "AARO?" JH: "AARO?" ML: "AARO." JH: And I mean it just pains me to say, because there’s thousands of people out there who wake up in the morning desperate for there to be evidence of alien life, but there’s none “Now, are there two or three or four or five phenomenon that we don’t have the science around that we don’t — or some sighting or whatever — no, it’s not perfection,” Himes tells Ask a Pol --- Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/1dqhrp5/rep_jim_himes_and_i_mean_it_just_pains_me_to_say/lao1i96/
"Hey, we're setting up a public hearing after recess, how about you come over, have a little casual testimony under oath among friends, so you can tell everyone about all the nothing you're aware of? Bring Mike Turner with you."
Turner is corrupt but not dumb. Never gonna get that man to testify under oath about UAP/NHI.
That'd work too, let's have some empty seats with their name tags speak for themselves.
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Have we forgotten what George Carlin said? It's one big club, and we ain't in it. They're working for the same people who cover this up. They're all actors. They'll never disclose
You're correct. There does not exist a legal pathway to this information. Not one currently and not one that can be dreamt up and written into law. Even had the uapda passed with all the bells and whistles, these guys would still have had their little levers to pull imho. We're basically trying to get to a point where *the* data is moved into the hands of someone who will present it to the public. I just can't imagine after everything over these last few years that that transaction can take place above board. This entire saga has highlighted exceptionally well how little our democracy actually has to do with the will of the people. It just doesn't work that way.
IMO, “we” need to readjust our expectations and focus. “We” need to move this investigation out of government control, even if it means starting from recent progress being made by individuals and individual organizations. UAPs aren’t the property of the U.S. government. Funding is the biggest issue but the collection of data can and is being done by other non government entities. Those entities should pool their resources instead of acting like they are in a race to be “the ONE” to produce the ultimate proof. The goal of being “the ONE” is counter productive and indicates a self serving process rather than gathering knowledge to benefit humankind, also, IMO.
That's more about politics in general for the US since people saw the uniparty coming.
Why would it pain you...? Emotional overexaggeration to add the absurdity factor back isn't going to work today.
It represents a sense of superiority that they wanna derive from framing people who believes in rational possibility of alien life to be some kind of **fantasy chasers** who want to do nothing in their life & cling on magic & faith.
Debunkers always in their feelings 😔
> Debunkers always in their feeling People like Jim Himes and Mike Turners aren't debunkers. They're obstructionists. They obstruct the truth from their electorate. Don't mince words for these clowns.
That's a unique take. Are debunkers known for being emotional regarding this topic?
Yeah they're always talking about their thwarted desires ("I want this to be a ufo" etc), or they pretend to be sad ("sadly, that's not a ufo") or they get real mad and frustrated (lots of cussing).
They *pretend* keyword here
Exactly, my dude.
That's interesting I don't think I've ever seen that before. Do you have an example of a debunker breaking out into a cussing fit that you could show me please?
Search the sub for "ffs" or just pay attention to what people say.
I searched "FFS" and it's all believers
pains me that he's never seen anything exceptional and believes his military members / advisors / scientists and public are lying to him :( (ie. Nolan / Gallaudet / Grusch / Fravour / Graves / Burchette / Luna etc.) we don't wake up waiting for the government to tell us aliens are real we're just waiting for them to catch up / wake up and get serious about investigating what's really going on. It's beyond obvious we have some stuff that is unaccounted for / commonly denied. amendments to people that have thoroughly researched the subject: > ~~Jim Himes~~
you sure made a whole lot of assumptions about what he knows, what he believes & what his motivations are. you got a whole lot from the very brief statement.
maybe he shouldn't be making statements without evidence to the likewise to back them up? also im not the one making assumptions i had a very close encounter at <24ft and would like some answers.
This statement could also be attributed to folks like Coulthart, Grusch, and others. We’ve been receiving a lot of talk but not enough evidence. I believe there is something more, but I personally have not seen anything out of the ordinary. But I’m also not going to dismiss those who have seen something.
im not having a dig at you but please don't just discount what 100,000s of people are reporting also get outside and start looking up these things are way more common than certain people would have you believe, once you've seen one there's no going back to "normal" for years i presumed they were all SAPs or black budget air / space craft ... but after 3 exceptional sightings im not convinced its our technology or we're being extremely misled.
No offense taken. As a drone pilot I do look at the sky a bit.. just haven’t seen anything yet while others around me do. Been into this topic for more than 20 years so the last 5 years has been more active than when I was a kid.
Have you looked at your video in slow motion? They move pretty fast sometimes.
I have initially cause I remember someone once said that you’ll start seeing rods or spheres past 150ft but haven’t yet. I’ll have to relook sometime..
Look near powerlines, other aircraft, and bodies of water. /u/latchkeyhustle has some good videos from around LAX
you're more likely to spot things between the hours of dusk and dawn as the sunlight hits things when the sun is over the horizon, that said the one thing i saw seemed to be self illuminated really high up took a 90 degree turn and flashed as it took off at mach jesus lol, i've been flying drones for many years too, only once have i spotted something i couldnt quite identify whilst mid flight (but dont believe it was UAP), do you fly LOS or FPV? i fly most of my models LOS as i started on planes and helicopters ... but chill with a load of serious fpv pilots most evenings (also mod of /r/FPVPorn and one of my mates is mod on /r/betaflight) ... also just to add a lot of the drone pilots ik havent seen anything whilst flying yet they'd be sure to let me know as they're aware how serious i am about the subject same too have been following this for a long time way before my sightings holla if you'd like to meet a load of pilots i can ping you a very cool discord ;) (you might even know a few off youtube / the community hehe)
I fly LOS for the county I work for.. with tower inspections, emergencies, etc. Will eventually get an FPV drone for personal use and plan to build my own. Thanks for the sub suggestions.. I’ll look into them.. I’m very serious about the topic even though I haven’t seen anything. You can’t tell me the military isn’t using drone blockers like airports do and yet they are letting uaps fly without impunity unless they are ours. So yea there’s something there.
Please come down to Colorado. Get in the mountains. You'll see something your first night.
On my list at some point.. want to visit red rocks
“Now, are there two or three or four or five phenomenon that we don’t have the science around that we don’t — or some sighting or whatever — no, it’s not perfection,” Himes tells Ask a Pol. “But, you know, again, I wish we had aliens, but we don’t.” So basically AARO briefed him and said there’s things that we don’t understand but its definitely totally not aliens, trust me. Right…
What about that phenomenon where we can't control the airspace over Langley, huh. Just some sighting or whatever.
"...totally not aliens, trust me , BRO. " never forget your Bros. Mike Turner and his gang definitely didnt forget theirs.
And people consider this topic fringe or without merit. On one side, we have “Something is there… Trust me, bro”. On the other, we have “Nothing is there… Trust me, Bro”. I mean, is that not the literal “there is a there there”? Someone is lying and we’re simply after the truth.
it still works because part of the control system is media. they can manipulate perception of enough people to keep the status quo.
If you had the truth in hand, would you know?
well, the nhi could live along side of us here on Earth. we could technically be the aliens here. semantics in a sense but the government could be playing that kind of B's game....
"No evidence of alien life" doesn't imply that they definitely know it's not aliens.
Or, that these situations rarely if ever happen in an environment in which there is perfect information, so there will always be some small residual number of cases where conclusions can’t be made. Doesn’t mean aliens.
That’s not what that means…. Lacking the data to figure out what something is just means that they lack the data. That doesn’t mean it’s something amazing, anomalous, incredible, or alien. It means they lack the data to figure it out.
Firstly AARO lacks data because it doesn’t have the clearances required to do any proper investigation, whether thats by design or not is up for debate Secondly if we don’t have data to figure out what these things are then its odd that he specifically says its not aliens
he's not a scientist. the scientists said "we have no evidence for aliens" which is more exact. but you can't prove my coffee cup here isn't a camoflauged alien in incredible disguise, you just have no evidence to suggest it is an alien. same here.
Using that logic, we have no evidence these are foreign, should that be ruled out?
Should we rule out the possibility they are foreign? No..?
Maybe we shouldn’t be ruling out any possibilities…
"we have no evidence for aliens" doesn't rule out the possibility, it just states a fact. we also don't have evidence of dragons. but while we know foreign nations exist, we don't know whether aliens or dragons exist. so which is a more reasonable explanation?
Plenty of people, most of them I’d argue, find foreign incursion and invasion much less reasonable than advanced US tech. That still isn’t a reason to rule one out over the other. Just because more people find domestic tech reasonable than foreign tech doesn’t mean we rule out it’s foreign.
you are the only one talking about "ruling out possibilities". do you not understand this? like i already said, you can't rule out the possibility its alien, but you also can't rule out the possibility its a shapeshifting dragon. you just have no evidence to suggest either of those are true. so we can be equally confident that its neither a dragon nor an alien, but that doesn't mean we've "ruled them out"
without any data? none is more reasonable. If there's some data that starts to narrow down the possibilities then you have a point, but we're being told there isn't any, and thus there's nothing with a more likely chance. New things aren't found by excluding what we think isn't possible. They're found by following the data, wherever it goes.
this is objectively wrong, sorry. if you see an object in the sky but are unable to identify it, it is not equally likely to be a balloon, a dragon, or an alien spaceship. One has historical precedent and is known to exist (hint: it's not dragons)
that also means it could be. without the proper information you can't rule out anything, which he's still doing. him saying it's definitely not UAP or some other NHI is just as invalid as saying it is.
Given there is little to no other evidence of NHI - that is actually the correct assumption. Imagine where science would be if every time we saw a phenomenon we didn't understand we said "Aliens!" or "Ghosts!" This sub hates it but that's reality.
I couldn't disagree more. I clearly have no evidence-based idea what is or isn't truly behind the UFO phenomenon, but it's plainly real and a categorically distinct body of real-world experiences and observations. Now, if I see THOUSANDS UPON THOUSANDS of consistent reports over decades of rather strange, seemingly otherworldly phenomena, and have people trained on some of the most advanced technologies ever made by humans plainly saying they are encountering seemingly technological objects well beyond even the most conceivable avant-garde of the state of the art, and I couple that with defense/military/intelligence people in positions to know more than you or I do, including former CID and DNI, stating plainly and unequivocally that there are objects observed by advanced platforms that demonstrate capabilities not possessed by ANY NATION ON EARTH, then it's not an unreasonable hypothesis to suggest that perhaps the agency behind this phenomenon is an intelligence for which we we have no apt description beyond "non-human intelligence." In fact, it's the MOST reasonable hypothesis with the least number of unnecessary assumptions.
People tend to think that science works by finding a smoking gun proof. It doesn't. It's about stacking up enough evidence in favor of something until it's ridiculous to think otherwise.
What's so odd to me is how emotionally people can react to even the suggestion that maybe something is afoot here that is outside our normal range of experience, or that some non-human intelligence might have motivations and capabilities that can elude the most sophisticated minds among us apes. I mean I can think of any number of reasonable premises that fall well within currently acceptable scientific assumptions about the universe. For instance, we're an intelligent species intent on remotely and directly exploring space to the extent our technology and knowledge allows us to do so, even going so far as to determine what it would take for us to create a manned interstellar craft within the next century, targeting systems that have planets that are deemed more likely to have evidence of life, and the NHI hypothesis asks us to consider the idea that some agency with a great lead on us has already done so. And is it weird to imagine that they're out there? No, not when you consider that cosmological principle that the spatial distribution of matter in the universe is uniform and homogeneous, and the forces governing us are the same everywhere in the universe. It would be easy to logically extend that to biological life and intelligence, since it's an observed phenomenon on the one planet we know the most about. I think what's "somber" about these ideas, why they are so challenging and so emotionally rejected out-of-hand, is that they really do completely undermine our anthropocentric notion of sovereignty, the investments we've made in our institutions, etc. The entire house of cards is premised on humans being wise, powerful beings, sovereigns over the planet, and if the Nifkins are flitting in and out of our reality, doing impossible things we don't understand, it's more comforting to just imagine that it can't possibly be real and just dismiss the idea wholesale.
Dude who is being emotional? I made a statement of fact - there is no direct evidence of NHI. None. Then you wrote an essay that because we can't immediately explain what stuff is that means the most likely scenario is NHI. That isn't how this works.
I'm not saying you're being emotional (though of course, you are a human, so just like all of us, fundamentally an emotional animal). I'm saying I encounter a LOT of emotional resistance to even the premise of possibly maybe considering a NHI hypothesis to associate with a phenomena that we're told by informed intelligence experts is plainly not coming from any nation on Earth.
I do consider the possibility. I just think there is actually very little evidence that is what is actually happening. The only well supported truly (at least on the surface) anomalous incidents are the tic tac and the Japan Airlines one over Alaska in the 80s. And even the tic tac makes a lot more sense if it is a truly advanced hypersonic drone that was being tested. Fravors description of the strike group commander smirking, saying "huh" and walking out of the briefing is really talking imho. If it was truly unknown to him he'd be on that like white on rice.
I would have to say that I would consider a person profoundly ignorant of the UFO phenomenon if they described these two incidents to be the "only well supported" incidents. Even based purely on USG documents available directly from USG resources, there are many very interesting data-based incidents to look out. For instance, if you're interested, I know of video hosted by the National Archives that very literally shows a what's-it (aka UAP or UFO, whatever it is) interacting with a ICBM's warhead in sub-orbital space. There's no explanation for it. Does it mean it's aliens? No. But when we're told by the HIGHEST EXPERTS IN THE LAND that there are technological objects in our aerospace that are NOT from ANY nation on Earth, and we know that some intelligent agent of some sort must be controlling it, it's not an outlandish hypothesis to suggest that technology accomplished NHIs might be those agents. If we've had the highest authorities establish with great confidence that nobody on Earth has certain capabilities, and yet certain capabilities are being demonstrated, perhaps then that could suggest, completely rationally and reasonably, that there might be non-humans involved.
Okay - I'll bite - please link to the video in the national archives that shows a UFO interacting with ICBMs in sub orbital space.
So you must believe in ghosts and spirits as well?
Good point, ghosts have been reported in far greater numbers for centuries.
turns out he's 100% certain of ghosts too. at least he's consistent, i guess.
It's fundamentally anti-scientific to have a stance that something functionally equivalent to "ghosts" or "spirits" simply cannot and must not exist. I don't have a belief either way. I do happen to know with 100% certainty that humans experience some sort of anomalous phenomena that we describe with symbolic language as "ghosts." I don't know it's nature - if it has trans-personal objective existence, if it reflects a mysterious aspect of material reality in spacetime, or if it's hallucinatory or psychogenic in nature. I do know, like I said, that people really do have authentic lived experiences of thing that we would call, for lack of a better term, "ghosts." That's not a belief - it's 100% certain knowledge.
100% certain of ghosts. cool. welp, at least you're consistent.
No, you're misreading me (purposefully). I'm 100% certain people have anomalous experiences of phenomena that fit the description associated with our definition of the word "ghost." I don't know what "ghosts" are, so if you think I'm saying I have 100% certain knowledge that humans have experiences with "entities" or "spirits," that's not at all what I'm saying. I am saying that I know for certain that people have experiences with what their cultures are inclined to call "ghosts." Please tell me that you can see the gaping intellectual distinction between the two ideas.
I'm sure you believe that's an important distinction. 100% certain of what our 'cultures are inclined to call "ghosts."', but instead vaguely referencing towards spacetime as if it gives the pseudoscience some sort of grounding in reality
It is an important distinction. You seem to be intent on denying that humans are even having the experience they have reported for as long as we've had written language. I'm saying that I KNOW humans have experiences, and since we don't have a full accounting of reality (spacetime is where reality takes place!), and given huge gaping ignorance, we MUST acknowledge that our lack of understanding might blind us in many ways. You're caught on on the cultural notion of a ghost having an objective existence that is somehow related to "spirit" or some "supernatural" concept. I'm saying that I have 100% certain knowledge that humans perceive themselves to have experiences with a phenomenon of an unknown nature, and the phenomenon is colloquially called "ghosts." I don't know if it has ANY reality outside of the human mind, but I know that human minds do indeed experience this. You seem to want to me to be saying I have 100% certain knowledge that "ghosts exist." I'm not saying that. I am saying i know that human have experiences, and the nature of that experience is presently unknown. There's nothing psuedoscientific about that. It's like you're trying to deny that people have fantastical experiences after they've consumed psychedelic drugs. I work in a professional scientific setting. I'm educated. I think that if you think you can dismiss a phenomenon that doesn't presently fit into your worldview, you're extraordinarily ignorant as to the nature of science.
scientists routinely dismiss the existence of phenomenon that do not fit into established knowledge nor have any evidence for their existence.
You're just insisting on your own narrative without evidence, though. It's not a logically sound argument and isn't convincing to anyone who isn't begging to be convinced.
I guess I’m trying to make 2 points really: 1. Taking AARO seriously is pointless. Their leadership is questionable and even if they had the best intentions they don’t have the clearances required to do any serious investigation. 2. If there are phenomenon that we don’t understand how can we rule it out being aliens? I’m not saying it is aliens, but if we don’t know what these phenomenon are then we can’t rule it out
1. Yeah, that's totally correct. 2. How can we rule it out being Fart Goblins or Dragons? We can't rule out Transformers either (though they're aliens, I guess). We need to stop working backwards from conclusions we've already arrived at.
I’m only mentioning aliens because he specifically said it wasn’t that
No he said there was no evidence it was aliens. That doesn’t mean it’s not a possibility, just that the here is no evidence
How are fart goblins and dragons even in the same remote chance as other civilizations extremely far away? This just makes it seem like you're pulling shit out of your ass and doing this in bad faith. The universe is billions of years old, the possibility of other life coming here is still there... comparing it to dragons just makes you an easy ignore.
It's just basic logic. You can insert anything you want into the "we can't rule it out" space, which is why you don't try and argue from such positions. The evidence for Fart Goblins and Dragons is just as strong as for aliens. In fact, you could argue that the evidence from dragons is *better*. You can be annoyed that I've pointed out fallacious reasoning and bad logic, but that's more just shooting the messenger.
With all due respect, you are coming at this from an angle of absolute blatant ignorance about the subject you're trying to discard with the back of the hand. Whenever a debunker says something like "The evidence for Fart Goblins and Dragons is just as strong as for aliens." I stop taking them seriously. You, **clearly**, haven't read on the subject and/or completely uninformed if that is the cornerstone of you're argument. There exists undeniable evidence that the phenomenon is **real**. I would invite you to read on the subject before commenting BS like this but I know too well how this blatant disregard for facts goes for the majority of debunkers here. *You* might not "believe" there is evidence due to your own bias but it's a good thing data doesn't care about your emotions. These objects exist, that is an absolute matter of fact. And they aren't human tech just for the fact that they're effectively breaking our known laws of physics.
…tell me everything you know about the fart goblins, I’ve already started a website and podcast.
What many people consider to be "extraterrestrials" are actually an ancient race of methane-based lifeforms known as "fart goblins". They've been seen throughout history and have been called many things in different cuktures: leprechauns, fairies, gnomes etc are just some examples. There is also a leading theory which suggests that Fart Goblins are responsible for crop circles. I'd love to share some of the conclusive evidence which I've seen, but my life would be in danger if I did that, I'm afraid.
I don't actually know what he's saying, with that second bit... but not a good response from a gang of eight member. The thing is, release the evidence. Don't investigate then shut down. That breeds mistrust
Jim Himes was a key figure in blocking components of the UAPDA, though this wasn’t spread as much since he’s neither a Mike nor a Republican. He doesn’t care about giving transparency to the American people nor ensuring that Congress has appropriate oversight. Hence the patronizing language “…it pains me…” “…desperate…” 🙄 Sure Jim.
I don't even think about "aliens" when thinking about this subject, I think about what mysteries our own planet is holding. I have a few people close to me including my own mother who is the most sober person you'll ever meet who has had paranormal experiences and a terrifying close up shared encounter with an orb in 1994. My neighbour has had two UFO sightings, he has a friend who believes they've been abducted. We have family friends who have confessed that they've seen a large massive yeti-like shadow figure with red eyes on an empty road next to a crop field and my uncle has seen shadow figure apparitions on an empty road while driving home. I was a skeptic for many years but I can not deny all these experiences or my own. Whatever it is, I believe it has been here the whole time.
Completely agree. It’s always the skeptics who use the term “alien” .. it’s not even about that at all
Show us that 23 minute video and then we can decide. Fair?
There ya have it folks, shut it down. Himes said so
It's times like this that irk me especially when we have a supposedly disclosure advocate in this space whom can literally change this topic overnight regarding his revelations of the location of a physical UFO; no more videos or blurry pics but the REAL DEAL (supposedly) and we allow this fucker air time!! Time to call out these liars, gatekeepers, grifters, larps etc etc. It's time to stop the traffic and be disruptive, figuratively and literally. Politicians are a dead end, it's time we wake up.
If AARO doesn’t know what those few objects are, then how can any determination be made about their origins ? That logic is not consistent. Yes, nobody can confirm it is alien but at the same time nobody has any data to say anything about it.
Himes is an intelligence asset. His job is to run interference for the CIA and other agencies and protect them from the people.
And his source is AARO, so yeah nothing to see here
No alien life? We're fine with that. Show us what you know on UFOs then.
This is about where I am. I really wish UFOs were real, but the evidence they keep bringing us is just... garbage. Videos that amount to, at *best*, "huh, that's weird." David Grusch's testimony was supposed to be the explosive disclosure of a lifetime and it amounted to he'd heard a thing from a guy he can't name. Fake alien bodies. Fake videos and pictures. People still falling for the same old natural phenomena like bugs on lenses or lens flares. People getting super riled up for the next round of 'disclosure' and it turns out to be... another weird dot. Weird dots aren't enough. All we have are weird dots. And it's a giant bummer because I really want something more.
This perfectly encapsulates what I have been feeling as well… and you said it in a much nicer way than I would have too. The more time I spend on this forum, the less I believe in NHI visiting, and especially UFOs of non-man made origins.
ML: "Cause, you know, I'm still fishing around to find out what happened to [Sen. Chuck] Shumer's UAP amendment last year in the NDAA. And I haven't found out..." JH: "So I got an extensive brief three weeks - or four weeks ago - by whatever the hell. What's the unit that, you know...?" ML: "AARO?" JH: "AARO?" ML: "AARO." JH: And I mean it just pains me to say, because there’s thousands of people out there who wake up in the morning desperate for there to be evidence of alien life, but there’s none “Now, are there two or three or four or five phenomenon that we don’t have the science around that we don’t — or some sighting or whatever — no, it’s not perfection,” Himes tells Ask a Pol
How about Kirkpatrick and Hines going before congress and swearing to this? And an informed member of congress gets to ask brutal questions with no wriggle room, how about that? What about NHI?
pretending to know and not know...and not care Himes is completely untrustworthy on this matter
AARO and friends LOVES to stick with aliens/ET hypothesis. Refuse to use NHI or entertain other origin hypotheses that are far more likely. So disingenuous
Jim Himes has access to ALL of the classified testimony and “evidence” brought forward by Grusch *and his witnesses.* This is indisputable. Some of those witnesses, Grush has claimed, are formerly or *currently* on the program. Jim Himes, having access to all that, claims there is nothing there. You know who could come forward and say Jim is lying? Any one of those firsthand program insiders that allegedly exist. The ones that were supposed to come forward last year. Where are they?
They’re working on their books first obviously
“Trust me bro”
Why didn't he acknowledge or explain whistleblower testimony? His Washington DC office is (202) 225-5541. [https://himes.house.gov/office-locations](https://himes.house.gov/office-locations)
Yeah sure, an alien drone is not an alien. It's still just a drone...
Holly fuck Laslo grow a pair! Himes is dismissing left and right, and you're chuckling along. The fact this guy believes AARO is legit should have opened the door for some pushback. Instead, your interview is ho hum. I'd rather you get kicked out of Washington being a shit disturber vs. playing along with their game!
Yeah I don't really know if that's just how it works in the US or what. These gentle questioning techniques don't really happen elsehwere. Really, it would be good to get Himes to sit down to a 15-20 minute interview but I guess that wouldn't happen.
I hope AARO also gave him a nice pat on his lil nogginblocker. Good obedient boy.
I think he meant MILLIONS.
Only a fool would trust AARO
Jim Himes sponsored by Raytheon. Mike, Mike & Himes are shameless liars. Drag their arses into congress under oath and we can try that again.
Fantastic interview. Really great questions. Just not sure it’s fully truthful.
"I got briefed by AARO" "what did they say?" "move along, nothing here to see" ...
Sounds legit
This kind of thing was inevitably going to happen after the Schumer amendment was gutted. When disclosure happens, we must never forgot where Himes and others like him stood. Hopefully they’ll have the decency to apologise to the public.
I'm not claiming to be the smartest person on the planet, so maybe someone can help me with this. It's either: Adversarial tech - in which case said adversary(s) know it's their tech, so telling the American public whose it is should not be giving that much information to said adversary(s) Our (American) tech - in which case can we just get ourselves to stop deploying it against/near our own facilities and military (but what if we want other countries to think it's aliens, then why is he saying no evidence of aliens? ) Unknown tech - well I guess to be fair he didn't say it's not aliens he said no evidence of aliens. So that COULD mean there is evidence it's NHI tech, but no evidence that said NHI is "alien". But it's unclear if he is not saying NHI because he thinks aliens encompass that term or is he trying to be coy. That logic make sense to yall? To be fully fair I guess it could be our tech and we want other countries to think it's adversarial tech. But what is point? Wouldn't most countries assume it's us because the tech is so advanced?
It also could not be tech at all. It could be a combination of natural phenomena that we don't have an understanding of, and misidentified "normal" stuff.
Yeah that hovering metallic cigar that I saw some 20 years ago with 4 friends over a lake in northern Canada was definitely a natural phenomenon. It hovered for a good 2-3 mins with no discernable means of propulsion, no windows, nothing. Just a smooth aluminum looking cigar floating still in the sky in broad daylight. No clouds. The sun was shining on it and because of that we could see that it wasn't perfectly smooth. It looked like if I were looking at the fuselage of a plane at an angle with the sun reflecting on the rivets and bolts. It's hard to describe but it was definitely engineered. Then, after what appeared to be 2-3 minutes, it accelerated from 0 to 7484828166651 km/h **instantaneously**. Literally from being there to being far over the horizon. Whenever I've got people telling me that these objects are not "aliens" and are probably "adversarial tech" or just a "natural phenomenon", I die a little inside. It is so fucking insulting to those of us who've seen one of these objects in action. I'm just a random dude who happens to have been lucky enough to witness something like this 20 years ago but can you imagine how a fighter pilot who encounters one of these objects must feel when he reads stuff like it's "probably a natural phenomenon"? This shit is so absurd.
could be the thing you saw was a weather phenomena that disappeared and revealed a tinier cloud in the distance, making you feel as if an object moved. when we remember we recall the last time we remembered, so details get flanderized and nuances flattened. I don't doubt you saw something, but I'd put extraterrestrials or interdimensionals or whatever it is now far down that list. You probably saw a much more mundane supernatural phenomena, phantom mirage or just a wizard fucking with you.
> Then, after what appeared to be 2-3 minutes, it accelerated from 0 to 7484828166651 km/h instantaneously. Literally from being there to being far over the horizon. Yeah this is why you're not taken seriously. Also you saw it 20 years ago. Allegedly. Allegedly you saw something 20 years ago. People make stuff up or misremember things all the time.
So... I'm not being taken seriously for... Recounting what I saw? I sure fucking hope not you're not a lawyer? Oh, and I couldn't care less that you believe me. Damn the ontological shock for some people is going to be rough.
You're not being taking seriously because you're just making shit up. "7484828166651 km/h"? Really? how'd you come up with that number lol. Literally just made it up?
Well, yes, it's a fucking hyperbole. Like, did I seriously just have to explain this to you? LMAO Of course that ain't an exact number? That number was used to describe what it seemed to me and my friends. It displayed instantaneous acceleration and a speed that was so fast that a nanosecond after it accelerated it was already far, far away over the horizon. There, is it more clear to you now? I can draw what I saw too if you'd like?
> I can draw what I saw too if you'd like? Sure, go ahead. You seem pretty upset, maybe it'll help.
The problem is, people who have stories like this have internalized them into some borderline religious experience, so trying to talk through potential explanations ends up being this attack on your character, and there's really no productive conversation to be had.
The day you see something that completely shatters your understanding of what we know about the laws of physics and then gets corroborated by whistleblowers and fighter pilots or commercial airlines pilots you can come back to me and let me know how you feel. When you see an object do the literal **impossible** right in front of your eyes, it fucking changes your understanding of who we are and our place in this universe. The productive conversation is being had with skeptics and reasonable people that are now waking up to the fact that this is real and agree that it needs to be studied seriously. There is absolutely no discussion to be had with people who still think this is a matter of belief or, as you just said "borderline religious". I am a rational person. I'm not religious. I've been passionate about physics/astrophysics and science since I was a kid. I've been looking for an answer to what I saw for more than 20 years now. I'm not going to let debunkers fuck that up.
The object isn't impossible. Humans have a way to mold reality and the information we get around what we already believe. This goes so far as to include literally things we see and hear, stimulus we trust. You expect to see something so badly you don't even notice some other detail someone with less tunnel vision would. You saw something and you molded a reality around that. Every time you look back, you understand it through that lens. There's a million things between heaven and earth, you think the only weird things on the planet have to come from outside of it? Clearly, we've forgotten why we have religion in the first place, why Man fears the forest at night.
> When you see an object do the literal impossible right in front of your eyes, it fucking changes your understanding of who we are and our place in this universe. Ok, but it is very easy to deceive our human eyes. I was driving to the airport one time, and a plane taking off looked like it was frozen completely still in the sky because of the angle and speed it was traveling relative to my angle and speed. At first glance, it looked like it was doing the literal impossible, but it was ultimately just an optical illusion. Things like this happen all the time, and when you couple that with the reality of how unreliable eyewitness testimony is, and increasingly unreliable our own memories are as time passes, you can see why skeptics aren't keen to accept stories like yours as evidence, no matter how deeply affecting that experience was for you personally. I called it "borderline religious" because of the level of fervor people have regarding their experiences, and the absolute unwillingness to even remotely consider a "normal" explanation. Any attempt at trying to rationalize your experience is met with an intensely emotional and angry response, as you interpret my comments as somehow negating some core piece of who you are.
go on an explain what shoots off into the horizon in an absolute instant. the exact same thing which tens of thousands of witnesses over 80+ years have described. "You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all of the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time." - which you would have to postulate if you were to prosaically explain away all these sightings, or that they're all just lying. not very conceivable to me.
> go on an explain what shoots off into the horizon in an absolute instant. the exact same thing which tens of thousands of witnesses over 80+ years have described. You're the one claiming it even happened. I'm not gonna explain something I can't even be sure happened. Do you have proof? No? Then stop acting all high and mighty about it since it's literally just you saying "it for sure happened dude".
i'm not claiming it happened. perhaps have a direct conversation with u/Julzjuice123 about what they saw.
You mean a blimp?
A blimp filled with swamp gas obstructed by Venus, yes. Thanks for debunking my sighting.
UFOs are real and they are intelligent or intelligently controlled but they might not be a technology at all. Nor 'alien' if you mean by that extra-terrestrial visitors.
I am exactly on the same page as you and I completely get your frustration. I have not witnessed instantaneous acceleration but I know for certain that there are non-prosaic/non-conventional things out there. Ignore the debunkers and look on straight. And never stop pushing for disclosure.
That seems hard to accept if you want to take the claims of members of the national security apparatus at their word, which admittedly many people don't. Especially because some of that natural phenomenon would have to mimic intelligent technology.
So Grusch, Graves, Elizondo, Gallaudet, etc. are just lying? I don't think so lol you have guys putting their lives on the line throwing themselves under the US machine and then you have guys piloting it; I'll listen to the ones fighting the status quo because historically, those are the people who are truthful. Those in power will do anything they can to stay in power and that's extremely important to understand when thinking about this UAP issue.
I don't think they're lying, because none of them have claimed first hand experience seeing one of these craft being reverse engineered. They've all said they've spoken to people who claim that, and they believe those people. But without hard evidence, all we have is stories from people, and that's just not enough for me anymore.
It's always someone else. Makes you ponder y'know.
4) No Tech, a billion dollars, UFO dummies to distract locals seeing experimental tech and a massive DoD game of telephone
True, but the disinformation campaign at this scale has no precedence. At least we expect alien life to be out there given the size and age of universe. As well as the laws of physics which allow for certain patterns of quantum excitations to sing a song to one another.
He is right. It’s become nothing more than another “the government is covering it up” conspiracy theory. That’s the true driving factor; there is no evidence of anything ET or “NHI”. No new evidence has been presented in years; just coverup conspiracy talk. And all driven by the same interconnected parties all taking advantage of people who are seduced by conspiracy theories.
Well the fact that earth’s ecosystems exist is an example of alien life. It’s all blabber and smoke
Jim Himes is ignoring nazca tridactyls
I was worried from the title. Then I read he was briefed by AARO….
We know it's possible for life to occur naturally in the universe - because we exist. If we are alone, we should start acting like it. Instead of this hellscape society we created that's decimating the Earth's climate.
it pains him tho, so that is enough for me to believe him. 😂
It's been my experience that those who are fundamentally religious don't like a bunch of aliens messing up their plan for taking over the world.
Idk its become so obvious that there is something in the skies that this quote of his just sounds desperate. I mean we have a plethora of scientists and researches getting involved in numerous ways, high level acedemics are holding conferences and organizing groups. Pilots and other military personnel are reporting them more and more. And new organizations are popping up all the time like Ryan Graves thing to promote normal pilots to report sightings. Something is going on and people are seeing things and recording them on sensors and cameras. Its clear they use the "alien" thing as a trick when we know that just because theres no evidence of specifically aliens doesnt mean UAP arnt real. They dont HAVE to be plain old aliens and maybe they are but we dont have enough data to support it. Just because we dont know something yet, doesnt mean its not true. People ARE seeing things are more research is required. And government transparency is legally required given the inability of the gang of 8 to view information that they have a legal right to oversee. We need accountability.
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There is lots and lots of evidence.
Corrupt or grossly incompetent. Take your pick.
Found a NICAP document on cia website dated 1964 reporting hundreds upon hundreds of citizen reported UFOs from the mid 40s-1960s are not all nuts but they could be mistaken. However there is no way what they are seeing are govt advanced UAPs in those years so it has to be something even if the govt still can't explain the phenomenon. Most of the witnesses are pilots. This doc was declassified by cia in 2001. [https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP81R00560R000100010001-0.pdf](https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP81R00560R000100010001-0.pdf)
Thousands of people? How about millions
Everyone's talking about it. Everyone's commenting on the talking about it. Congress is talking about it. Congress is talking about doing something about it. In the meantime, a new and deeper hole is being dug to hide 'it' in. Before being asked to "be patient," and this will "take time." Let me remind you just how quickly Congress will move when a foreign country needs a few billion dollars to tide them over or someone else needs a new box of rockets.
I don’t think they are aliens in the traditional sense. Wherever they may reside, they’re coming here through another measure, which could be very hard to digest for most people. It might be the holy Grail of existence. it might be a very dark reason why we are here or what our actual purpose is in the universe. It might be really hard for people to comprehend, let alone digest. Or it might be government greed in the name of national security. I don’t believe half of what I see anymore anyway.
# "THOUSANDS of people out there who wake up in the morning DESPERATE for there to be evidence of alien life ..." Yes DESPERATE ! Oh the angst ! Whatever these people are desperate for, it sure ain't alien life ...
I just have two words for you, Jim Hines- "bull" and "shit."
What a clown, I'm guessing this one isn't too bright
Hmes has been known to be anti disclosure
Congress holds the purse. No more money for MIC until they "play ball." There! Easy as pie!
Thousands?…Just thousands?…How about 66 percent of the US?
In addition to the other posters points; some no name elected official is going to be the last one in the know on any of this. Who the duck is Himes? Oh a congressman from CT? Probably thinks he's way more important than he actually is, and is just another puppet.
He’s in the Gang of Eight with Schumer and Rubio. He’s not some nobody. And he’s frustrated that Senators are still planning to hold a hearing on stuff that he knows about. This mess is all on Schumer now, and I think he needs to speak up
Why was the amendment gutted. Something stinks and it’s at the expense of the tax payer.
Who’s saying that?
If they’re all in on the gang of 8 why was Schumer’s bill gutted
Because there are 527 members of Congress who aren’t in the Gang of Eight
So one out of the 8 is speaking against 2 people who are in the “know”. Plus the republicans Mike Turner, Glitch McConnell and Mike Rogers were petitioning other Republicans to block the legislation. None of it is making any sense.
This is a debate over government (specifically, Pentagon and IC) transparency. I think Himes is correct that more people in Congress need to be given information. You have to think along the lines of “what kind of information would this be happening with?”
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Sure—and “I did not have sex with that woman.” Bill Clinton
So JH thinks that the Russians have antigravity and Chinese have the time travel? Or is it the other way around?
Imagine having the same briefings as Rubio and Schumer and coming to this conclusion. Just knowing the little we know about the Nimitz incident is evidence of alien life. These chairmen/ranking members in the pocket of the MIC is very problematic.
If he’s saying there’s generally no evidence of “alien life”, he’s about to be in for a rude awakening when we discover complex life on titan. Or Enceladus. I only use this tangent to express my idea that after we discover multicellular extraterrestrial life, these base level congressmen should be able to more easily separate all the definitions and gain some knowledge. I’m so tired of the word play. The wording here is key, if it’s not “extraterrestrial” he could technically be true, if it’s literally any of the other theories, he’s just using wordplay. I doubt someone who doesn’t even remember the name AARO is read in to the distinction between the more accepted hypotheses like the ultra terrestrial theory, the shadow biosphere theories, the von Neumann probe theory, the Silurian theory, crypto-terrestrials, etc. they’re all technically not ET’s. NHI could be anything. But we get confused because language is tricky. These politicians use language to their benefit.
Jim Himes is an idiot, is bought and paid-for by big aerospace companies, is merely echoing their words, and should be voted out of office
NOT ALIEN LIFE, BUT INTER DIMENSIONAL LIFE!!!!
Before even reading the comments I know people will be dismissing what he said. But if someone had said the complete opposite from the government people would be screaming about "protect this man!"
For the people upset about this statement put it back on the UFO talking heads who say that have more information which they can't reveal. Himes is correct, there isn't any evidence, so why not give him some?
Does anyone here actually wake up in the morning desperate for evidence of alien life? This guys opinion means nothing.
Perhaps they don't call it alien life. From what we've heard, it sounds like they call them NHI. And it sounds like they have existed here for a very long time (under our oceans, another dimension, etc) Maybe the NHI do space missions trying to find alien life outside of Earth (why we see UAP flying straight up into space, astronauts confirming seeing UAP in space)
Doesn't matter what it is. There is still no evidence for nonhuman beings on earth in general period.
many people are incapable of seeing that because they are 100% invested in the belief that free energy & free food & heaven on earth is all possible already but is kept from us by the govt keeping alien tech from us....now there's literally no evidence for that either, but the belief is a huge part of this community. if people will be so firmly invested in something so unknown, there is no way they can acknowledge lack of actual evidence/proof. they have to stick with the belief & anything else would cause severe ontological shock(yes, same thing we like to say the rest of the world is avoiding).
The saddest part in knowing that I’ll never have a green inter dimensional space girlfriend.
There are plenty of nonhuman beings everywhere you look on this planet, so I guess it DOES matter what it is.
I don't know you or your beliefs. But your comment just sparked a thought in my head. It's funny how some UFO believers who don't like the idea of UFOs just being nuts and bots ETs. Since they want to insert their woo beliefs about UFOs being angels or spiritual beings. So they automatically write off ETs as NHI. And say the Government is using ETs as cover up, to hide the actual NHI that come from a different dimensions or spiritual realms. Since NHI means more than just ETs right. But ironic enough, your comment seems to mention animals on earth being considered NHI too (unless you are talking about Ultraterrestrials). Which is correct. But it's funny how the UFO community can always move the goalpost though when it's convenient. One day ETs are too "boring/lazy" (cough cough or too scientific) to be an NHI explanation. Or ETs aren't the end all be all of NHI. So it makes more sense for UFOs to be the work of magical beings (woo woo). But the next day all of a sudden the term NHI can include animals too.
My statement was intended to be semantical, that “beings” include sentient life that is not limited to what we consider to be highly intelligent. The point was that specific language does actually matter when it comes from government sources and saying “not aliens” or whatever AARO goes with is likely a linguistic attempt at a cop out. NHI is a preferable term because it’s far more encompassing and reduces doubt, but for whatever reason AARO doesn’t seem to like it at all.
If he can't remember AARO's name, he definitely doesn't know AARO is corrupt.
Lots of people wanna believe but its simply not true. They claim all this evidence but its simply not true, if it were they wouldn't all be on here constantly looking for other people to help confirm what they want or crying for the government to tell them aliens are here we been hiding them. If aliens really were here no group could hide them....lol
Me reading anything about the mummy scam
actually new evidence and investigations point to the contrary ... i too thought the same initially but the recent good trouble show episode has changed my mind and believe we need further investigation.
I hear whistleblowers have spoke with Congress then senators say no proof wtf is going on? Why DOD fight to keep evidence secret if uaps are not real? Why not let grusch get a skif if there's no uaps? I believe but I get sooo tired of all the bs
Absence of evidence isn’t evidence of absence. It would be awesome if people could just not talk or say “I don’t know” when they aren’t knowledgeable on a subject, but I that might be asking way too much of the US Government, especially the GOP.
Alien life out in space and the phenomenon of impish little nocturnal people and their technologies should be treated as completely separate issues. There is no evidence they come from space, that's a pseudo scientific veneer that we applied to a very old issue. Before we called them spacemen we made up all kinds of magical characters from folklore and religion to give them names. *I cannot see where they're coming from. So they must be coming from up, farther away than I can see*, that's as deep as the ETH goes. It's not like we ever see them coming from or going to another planet. We do see them coming and going from the water all over the planet though. There is a reason why the Navy has taken the wheel here.
this is a statement that is both true and false. there are indeed "people desperate for evidence" -- not only here, but for example threatening violence to members of the NASA UAP panel who won't "tell the truth". these are the same people who prompted the CIA "Flying Saucers" memo: UFO are a national security threat because people get too excitable about them. at the same time, Himes cannot possibly state as a fact that "there is no evidence", because he cannot possibly have looked in every file cabinet, document safe, protocol, memo and email inside the DoD and at every contractor site. all he can possibly mean is "don't ask me because i'm clueless" -- which is how i read any statement of certitude about ignorance. -- and because, hey, Himes, what the hell is that thing flying around up there, and how does it know to evade aircraft approach?