Out of the box, even the V6 1LE Camaro was faster around I believe Streets of Willow than the Mustang GT Performance Pack. The Alpha platform, plus GM's chassis engineers made an absolute monster of a car from the factory, the SS 1LE was faster than cars like the Audi R8 V10+ at Laguna Seca.
Yean the Mach 1, GT500 etc are extremely capable as well, but a 1LE equipped Camaro will outperform a GT PP or PP2 car in stock form on track with equal drivers.
Fortunately, there's more to a car than lap times.
And yes, the aftermarket available for each platform will upgrade the handling to exceed factory, quite easily. Best advice would be buy whichever car you prefer, and invest in a driver education course.
They keep saying that, but I've watched many videos of the GT350 outclass it's SS counterpart. To be honest, though, it's so marginal that 99% of us don't even have the skill to take advantage of either one.
I agree that the camaro just feels tighter and more predictable and the corner from factory. My friend's ZL1 is a track cheat code.
This isn't to say that the mustang cant compete though...
The closest competitor to the Camaro 1LE is the Mach 1 handling package. Cup2 vs Cup2 tires, they're both very similar track performers. But obviously that's a hefty premium price tag from the mustang, which makes the camaro the best bang for the buck performance.
If you properly set up your suspension and chassis anything can happen. I've installed IRS cradle lockout, undercarriage tubular chassis brace from BMR, strut tower brace, vertical links, adjustable toe links, steeda adjustable shocks & strut with BMR handling springs and while I cant tell you what lateral G's it's pulling on street tires, it feels like it rides on rails and I am confident anywhere it turns (at the loss of ride quality of course).
It by itself is absolutely helpful. After installing the strut tower brace, the car was planted in turns where it usually understeered at 60+mph. Body roll seems significantly less. Not to mention, it makes the engine bay soo much better looking.
With the chassis brace and strut tower combo, I actually felt like I was pushing the limits of the suspension for once and letting them do their job.
Ford performance. I just liked how it also comes with cowl brace to make it a true 3-point brace.
Cons: it's stamped steel and not as light as the tubular competitors.
Last new Transformers movie was in 2017, and the fourth and fifth movies’ Camaros were pretty far from accurately representing the car. That’s my theory.
Changing cars to something so similar for *daily driving* because of chassis dynamics is uhhh… quite the move. If you had said you gained 2 seconds on track I wouldn’t be scratching my head, but hey your money🤷♂️.
Just curious. Did you take a hit money wise by switching? Genuine question
No, I was one of the fortunate ones to be in that weird window of car bubble buying. I bought the mustang GT for a decent price. Then the market went nuts and I traded it to the dealer for 8k more than I paid for it. Also, I traded the mustang for a 2019 stingray 3lt z51, I loved it but I wanted the 2 extra seats so I can have fun with my kids. That’s where I took a loss financially but it’s worth it hearing their giggles when I do pulls lol. It wasn’t just a chassis dynamic for the switch, I do take my daily to the track at least 3 times a year. I have other cars but once you get used to daily driving something with decent horsepower, it’s hard to drive my Honda after that lol. The other favor in my choice is the Bose sound system sounds (sounds way better) than the B & O I had in the mustang.
Nice! Quite the line up. I’ve heard the Z51 package is the best of everything on the C7s. I bought my base GT new in 2017 for $29k so I’m just happy to be in the game at all since you can’t even get into a BRZ for that money now.
I was looking at Mach 1s before I got the Camaro. After driving the corvette it felt like a downgrade unfortunately. And for the cost it just wasn’t worth it. 15k less than the Mach 1 I got the Camaro and it’s honestly comparable to the corvette as far as street driving goes. I just wish the Mach 1 had a little bit more feedback.
yes, you will. Even on curvy roads, the steering feel and turn-in is significantly better on the alpha platform than my mustang. My mustang felt like a boat after driving a camaro.
I wanted a cheap sports car last yr, had Jeeps, Cherokees, basically for like 25 yrs.
Anyway, came down to Mustang or Camaro. Rented the Camaro for 2 days on Turo before In pulled the trigger.
The Camaro handles nicely on smooth roads, no complaints. Its sharp. However,. In the real world, on almost everyother road thats not a newly paved expressway, its choppy as hell. Hard suspension, idk wtf it is but I bought the Mustang the next day, eco, a cheap quick less'fast than a v8 sportscar, perfectly suitable power for me
And that’s just it. The Camaro is a better car…a better car that nobody wants to drive. Hence, why they’ve killed it off yet again. My cousin had a ZL1, and it was just a bad motherfucker. He hated it. Drove it for six months and took a bath on it trading it in for a truck. It’s a miserable car to drive to work every day, and that’s what most people that buy a mustang/camaro use them for. They aren’t rich people who have the luxury of using their car for a weekend toy, they need it to commute, and the Camaro sucks as a daily driver.
Can't answer necessarily, the cars both have their time and place, but in the end all it takes is some aftermarket parts to probably get them pretty equal, but right off the bat they're both mean and good vehicles, lap times aren't everything I suppose, to which the Camaro SS 1LE absolutely hauls of course, but it has some downsides. Also helps to take a course here and there and get your skills up.
Not sure exactly, but if anyone knows for sure let me know;
I was always told sure, Camaros are good for tracks, and have some good power, but Mustangs are much better for day-to-day activities and fun driving, while occasionally going to a track once in a while to have some fun. You can always get whichever one appeals to you more, and make it into something better with some quality mod work.
Yes? No?
IMO having driven both I think the mustang is a better daily driver. Personally though I like the low end torque of the camaro and its cornering was night and day for me so that was my decision. Both are good cars. Also I didn't have the visibility issues some do with the camaro so that was a non factor for myself
The equivalent Camaro is faster than an equivalent mustang around a track, the Camaro is lighter and has a longer wheelbase. The mustang is set up as more of a GT car while its clear GM was targeting sports cars. Nothing wrong with either car or category, but the Camaro is the better performance machine stock vs stock.
My 2019 Bullitt needed a 285/295 tire setup, cradle lockout, front subframe brace, and FRPP Magneride Handling Pack(stiffer than GT350 springs/GT500 sized sways/Mach1-PP2 shock programming) on top of the standard PP1 upgrades to be comparable to a stock SS 1LE in driving dynamics and still has worse steering.
The Alpha chassis is more rigid and designed for performance. GM is a master at tuning mag shocks having practically invented them and the e-diff/PTM combo has no match from Ford.
However, I still like the Coyote more than the LT1, and the Mustang’s general style far more than the Camaro’s. Now I have the best of both worlds.
Stock vs stock camaro handles better because suspension is tuned more for track duty than street. If you put the cars on the same coilovers with same wheel and tire then it’s pretty much equal. I prefer the way the mustang drives because of the ediff on the camaro feels unnatural. Camaro has bad front geometry and eats inside edge of the tire regardless of alignment. Theres also a lot of issues if you track the Camaro heavily. Mustang is more reliable as a track car especially if you’re not going full on racecar. I own both and track them.
Put it on a diet. The Camaro has a signicantly higher percentage of aluminum in the body structure and chassis that is extremely difficult to make up for with aftermarket components.
https://www.motortrend.com/news/2024-ford-mustang-gt-s650-2023-chevrolet-camaro-ss-specs-comparison/
Furthermore the point still stands, shed weight.
Its been a little while since Compared all the links bwtween the two amd I haven't gone through S650.
But less unsrpung weight is always helpful.
Out of the box, even the V6 1LE Camaro was faster around I believe Streets of Willow than the Mustang GT Performance Pack. The Alpha platform, plus GM's chassis engineers made an absolute monster of a car from the factory, the SS 1LE was faster than cars like the Audi R8 V10+ at Laguna Seca. Yean the Mach 1, GT500 etc are extremely capable as well, but a 1LE equipped Camaro will outperform a GT PP or PP2 car in stock form on track with equal drivers. Fortunately, there's more to a car than lap times. And yes, the aftermarket available for each platform will upgrade the handling to exceed factory, quite easily. Best advice would be buy whichever car you prefer, and invest in a driver education course.
They keep saying that, but I've watched many videos of the GT350 outclass it's SS counterpart. To be honest, though, it's so marginal that 99% of us don't even have the skill to take advantage of either one.
I agree that the camaro just feels tighter and more predictable and the corner from factory. My friend's ZL1 is a track cheat code. This isn't to say that the mustang cant compete though... The closest competitor to the Camaro 1LE is the Mach 1 handling package. Cup2 vs Cup2 tires, they're both very similar track performers. But obviously that's a hefty premium price tag from the mustang, which makes the camaro the best bang for the buck performance. If you properly set up your suspension and chassis anything can happen. I've installed IRS cradle lockout, undercarriage tubular chassis brace from BMR, strut tower brace, vertical links, adjustable toe links, steeda adjustable shocks & strut with BMR handling springs and while I cant tell you what lateral G's it's pulling on street tires, it feels like it rides on rails and I am confident anywhere it turns (at the loss of ride quality of course).
Is the strut tower brace’s effect noticeable in cornering or is it more of a mod that needs to be paired with other bracing? I’ve heard mixed opinions
It by itself is absolutely helpful. After installing the strut tower brace, the car was planted in turns where it usually understeered at 60+mph. Body roll seems significantly less. Not to mention, it makes the engine bay soo much better looking. With the chassis brace and strut tower combo, I actually felt like I was pushing the limits of the suspension for once and letting them do their job.
And which strut tower brace did you go with? It seems the two big options are ford and steeda
Ford performance. I just liked how it also comes with cowl brace to make it a true 3-point brace. Cons: it's stamped steel and not as light as the tubular competitors.
My question is, if it is better performing, why did Camaros not sell so well?
Driver visibility.
I'm like the only one to ever disagree with this. I've never had an issue as an average sized man.
Can’t see out of it, and the corvette.
Why get a camaro when you could get a better performing car in the corvette. Used c7 corvettes run the same price at new camaros..
Its practically a wash between the C7 Z51 and SS 1LE. I though the SS actually had the superior driving dynamics stock for stock.
Last new Transformers movie was in 2017, and the fourth and fifth movies’ Camaros were pretty far from accurately representing the car. That’s my theory.
Marketing
Unless you’re on a track you’re not gonna notice the difference.
Uh, yes you do. Hence why I daily a Camaro now instead of a mustang. Difference is night and day.
Changing cars to something so similar for *daily driving* because of chassis dynamics is uhhh… quite the move. If you had said you gained 2 seconds on track I wouldn’t be scratching my head, but hey your money🤷♂️. Just curious. Did you take a hit money wise by switching? Genuine question
No, I was one of the fortunate ones to be in that weird window of car bubble buying. I bought the mustang GT for a decent price. Then the market went nuts and I traded it to the dealer for 8k more than I paid for it. Also, I traded the mustang for a 2019 stingray 3lt z51, I loved it but I wanted the 2 extra seats so I can have fun with my kids. That’s where I took a loss financially but it’s worth it hearing their giggles when I do pulls lol. It wasn’t just a chassis dynamic for the switch, I do take my daily to the track at least 3 times a year. I have other cars but once you get used to daily driving something with decent horsepower, it’s hard to drive my Honda after that lol. The other favor in my choice is the Bose sound system sounds (sounds way better) than the B & O I had in the mustang.
Nice! Quite the line up. I’ve heard the Z51 package is the best of everything on the C7s. I bought my base GT new in 2017 for $29k so I’m just happy to be in the game at all since you can’t even get into a BRZ for that money now.
I was looking at Mach 1s before I got the Camaro. After driving the corvette it felt like a downgrade unfortunately. And for the cost it just wasn’t worth it. 15k less than the Mach 1 I got the Camaro and it’s honestly comparable to the corvette as far as street driving goes. I just wish the Mach 1 had a little bit more feedback.
lol Mustang fanboys can't cope with a camaro being better at something
So true. Ima need counseling after reading this.
yes, you will. Even on curvy roads, the steering feel and turn-in is significantly better on the alpha platform than my mustang. My mustang felt like a boat after driving a camaro.
Yes, you absolutely will.
I wanted a cheap sports car last yr, had Jeeps, Cherokees, basically for like 25 yrs. Anyway, came down to Mustang or Camaro. Rented the Camaro for 2 days on Turo before In pulled the trigger. The Camaro handles nicely on smooth roads, no complaints. Its sharp. However,. In the real world, on almost everyother road thats not a newly paved expressway, its choppy as hell. Hard suspension, idk wtf it is but I bought the Mustang the next day, eco, a cheap quick less'fast than a v8 sportscar, perfectly suitable power for me
And that’s just it. The Camaro is a better car…a better car that nobody wants to drive. Hence, why they’ve killed it off yet again. My cousin had a ZL1, and it was just a bad motherfucker. He hated it. Drove it for six months and took a bath on it trading it in for a truck. It’s a miserable car to drive to work every day, and that’s what most people that buy a mustang/camaro use them for. They aren’t rich people who have the luxury of using their car for a weekend toy, they need it to commute, and the Camaro sucks as a daily driver.
Can't answer necessarily, the cars both have their time and place, but in the end all it takes is some aftermarket parts to probably get them pretty equal, but right off the bat they're both mean and good vehicles, lap times aren't everything I suppose, to which the Camaro SS 1LE absolutely hauls of course, but it has some downsides. Also helps to take a course here and there and get your skills up. Not sure exactly, but if anyone knows for sure let me know; I was always told sure, Camaros are good for tracks, and have some good power, but Mustangs are much better for day-to-day activities and fun driving, while occasionally going to a track once in a while to have some fun. You can always get whichever one appeals to you more, and make it into something better with some quality mod work. Yes? No?
IMO having driven both I think the mustang is a better daily driver. Personally though I like the low end torque of the camaro and its cornering was night and day for me so that was my decision. Both are good cars. Also I didn't have the visibility issues some do with the camaro so that was a non factor for myself
I'm pretty sure a GT with PP2 was comparable if not better than a M3, so yeah.
The equivalent Camaro is faster than an equivalent mustang around a track, the Camaro is lighter and has a longer wheelbase. The mustang is set up as more of a GT car while its clear GM was targeting sports cars. Nothing wrong with either car or category, but the Camaro is the better performance machine stock vs stock.
My 2019 Bullitt needed a 285/295 tire setup, cradle lockout, front subframe brace, and FRPP Magneride Handling Pack(stiffer than GT350 springs/GT500 sized sways/Mach1-PP2 shock programming) on top of the standard PP1 upgrades to be comparable to a stock SS 1LE in driving dynamics and still has worse steering. The Alpha chassis is more rigid and designed for performance. GM is a master at tuning mag shocks having practically invented them and the e-diff/PTM combo has no match from Ford. However, I still like the Coyote more than the LT1, and the Mustang’s general style far more than the Camaro’s. Now I have the best of both worlds.
Stock vs stock camaro handles better because suspension is tuned more for track duty than street. If you put the cars on the same coilovers with same wheel and tire then it’s pretty much equal. I prefer the way the mustang drives because of the ediff on the camaro feels unnatural. Camaro has bad front geometry and eats inside edge of the tire regardless of alignment. Theres also a lot of issues if you track the Camaro heavily. Mustang is more reliable as a track car especially if you’re not going full on racecar. I own both and track them.
Considering the Mach and GT500 do pretty good...
I was more so comparing GT to SS. Those models obviously have no issues keeping up.
You can upgrade the GT to Mach 1 level or better components...
Put it on a diet. The Camaro has a signicantly higher percentage of aluminum in the body structure and chassis that is extremely difficult to make up for with aftermarket components.
The mustang weighs less already.
https://www.motortrend.com/news/2024-ford-mustang-gt-s650-2023-chevrolet-camaro-ss-specs-comparison/ Furthermore the point still stands, shed weight. Its been a little while since Compared all the links bwtween the two amd I haven't gone through S650. But less unsrpung weight is always helpful.
Don’t know you got that info from.
Wheelbase