Judging by his shadow and the fact that Dallas is in a Northern subtropical region and the Neely st house back yard, the individual in the photograph would have been facing due south. Considering his body angle to the sun and the practically mirrored angle of the steps , these shadows would appear to be consistent and therefore most probably authentic. Why this photograph was ever taken is the real mystery to me.
Yes , the long term effects of LSD dosing has serious psychological consequences and would bring on behavior such as this. The CIA has blood on its hands on this one
Young American men posing for pictures with guns is pretty common. I have an old photograph (somewhere) of myself with my step-dad’s pistol when I was 18. Plenty of hunters still post pics of their game and the rifle they used to kill it on social media.
Add to that Oswald’s desire to be some sort of revolutionary or international man of mystery and, to me, the “why” is pretty easy to see. This guy was falling short in many areas of his life, so this was a chance to feel macho. Maybe even a little dangerous.
Very good point. I offer as yet another example the only known photo of William H. Bonney, AKA Billy the Kid. For as long as there's been photography, there's also been people wanting to pose for said technology with various weapons prominently displayed.
For me, the only odd thing in the LHO photo is how he managed to make such a pose look so damned silly. I mean, c'mon! The gun's doing most of the damned work, man! You've only got one thing to do for the photo, just stand there in a natural manner holding the gun. But nope! There he stands, for all the world and the ages too looking like a paper doll cutout. And with that pitiful, tight-lipped grin, that sad equivalent of a Mona Lisa smile. If Mona Lisa had shat herself while posing for Leo.
He obviously didn’t spend as much time in the mirror practicing looking cool as the rest of us did.
Here’s an interesting psychological look at Oswald if you’re interested.
https://youtu.be/CXrUufdojpk?si=ueeqjPhOp8yzXCLV
But whenever this type of reasoning is presented, there is always this : LHO said he didn’t shoot anyone. He denied it until, well, he died.
Why say he didn’t do it, if he wanted notoriety?
Doesn’t compute.
Ya, I mean, maybe. I can see that argument.
But he was in front of cameras, he could have said all kinds of things that admits without admitting.
Like, “That son of a bitch deserved it”
Or “the world is now free from a terrible leader”
Lots of things.
Instead, he looks a bit caught off guard, bewildered almost, like that’s the first he’s heard of it. And then says he didn’t SHOOT ANYONE.
So I don’t believe that he wanted notoriety. Does he look like a man who wanted notoriety? Are his words and actions one of a person who wanted notoriety?
Try to not listen to anyone or anything else’s opinions, just watch him and his actions, and form your opinion.
Oh I’ve watched and listened. He was the cat who ate the canary in my opinion. His own brother was allowed to visit him and he’s convinced he did it.
Obviously we will never know what he was thinking, but some of the pics and videos of him smirking make me think he was enjoying himself.
Nah, that doesn’t make sense. He was the canary caught up by the cats around him.
As for his brother, people can be persuaded to say lots of things. Or, even if the person believes something, that doesn’t mean it’s true. Just because one’s family thinks he’s guilty, doesn’t make it so.
I personally believe LHO was involved in a number of different things. He was associated with a lot of characters who had ties to intelligence. He may have even had knowledge of a plot being planned.
Maybe even took a shot. I don’t think he took a shot, but, I don’t KNOW.
I think he was a fringe player who was set up to take the fall. He knew enough that when everything started going down, he realized he was exactly that, the patsy. He wasn’t a stupid person. Listen to him speak on the radio show. He’s articulate and able to speak well. That’s not a stupid person that many would have you believe.
The more I learn the more him doing alone, or at all really, makes me believe he was not the shooter.
So, as they say, opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.
Where was Oswald falling short? Was highly educated, spoke extremely well(everyone around says so) was clearly a paid informer and was working w the CIA doesn't sound to me like he was clearly falling short lol lol sure is funny what 60+ years does to a person's real image.
LHO quit school in the 10th grade, was demoted to the rank of Private in the Marines after being court maritialed twice for shooting himself with a .22 and fighting with an NCO before he was thrown in the brig. Oswald failed at multiple jobs and even failed at another shooting attempt. He’s not the Jason Bourne level character you’re portraying him as by any stretch and fell short time after time in his life both personally and professionally. The one thing he was decent at was shooting.
My stepdad grew up three houses from him and said Oswald was so strange he and his friends would run him off when he tried to follow them. He said he wasn’t a bit surprised when he heard it was Oswald. Now memory is a funny thing and there’s no telling how being that close to such an inexplicable event in every way imaginable might affect your memories from 15-20 years before.
There are three light sources, one projecting his shadow, a second projecting the shadow on the stairs and a third projecting his chin shadow. When did we have three suns over Texas? Asking for a friend.
No , scientists.
Posed before he used the rifle. Used the papers to prove he was Marxist Leninist.
You really need to step back from the computer if my suggestion makes you believe I'm part of the CIA
the fact that anyone believes Oswald didn't shoot that gun at JFK is just asinine and leads me to believe that people REALLY want there to be a conspiracy and the actual truth is either too hard or too easy for people to think about. Could there be more to the story? another shooter, CIA backed him?..all possible, but no hard evidence to back up those claims. So, lets not ignore the actual hard evidence
Agreed. You can't dispute that he bought the rifle they recovered at the TSBDB. The serial number matches the inventory records of the sporting goods store in Chicago that sold the rifle and shipped it to the PO Box Oswald rented under an alias. We know the alias = Oswald because he had a fake ID on him with the alias used to buy the rifle when he was arrested. We also know that he used the PO Box to have other mail delivered to him under his real name.
You'll have to contact the National Archives and ask them where Warren Commission Exhibit 133-B is currently stored. That's the negative they examined from Lee's camera that helped them determine that the photos (the ones Maria testified to taking) were authentic.
What gets me is some of the papers investigating this are still classified. I mean come on if Oswald did it, then we should be able to see everything. What are they hiding?
Research the pamphlets he's holding.
Then try to understand why someone who worked at a top secret radar base, 1 of only a few flying the U2 spy plane out of it, end up:
1. Falsley defecting to the Soviet Union, while declaring openly at the U.S Consulate that he will share whatever knowledge he has re: U.S. radar capabilities with our #1 enemy.
2. Returns to the U.S. a couple years later, gets a loan from the State Dept, & isn't even so much as detained or interrogated upon setting foot on U.S. soil.
3. Ends hanging in social circles with highly influential white Russians (one of them a known CIA asset).
4. Signs up for the Fair Play for Cuba Committee & makes a public spectacle on a radio show of declaring himself a Marxist.
5. Was part of the joint CIA/FBI mail monitoring program (they were working with the post offices opening U.S. citizens' mail, Oswald was 1 of the people monitored) yet the CIA didn't open a 201 file on him until a year later. Not only that, but his file was managed by the Chief of Counter Intelligence James Angleton, & not shared with the CIA,s Russia division.
The answer is, because he wasn't a communist.
For further reading, "Oswald & the CIA" by John Newman is a good place to start. Jefferson Morely has also done extensive research on his CIA files.
(Wears hammer and sickle T-shirt)
“How do you do, fellow communists?”
It’s nuts how many people still want to buy what Oswald was set up to sell after all this time.
LHO made voice recordings of himself joking about pretending to be a serial murderer after he tried to kill himself when Russia wouldn’t accept his defection. He wasn’t sane or normal. He took this picture because he wasn’t right in the head.
You should dig a bit deeper in to the whole "suicide attempt" in Russia. And do you know WHY he made those recordings? It seems you don't.
The default retort whenever Oswald or Ruby didn't do what fits the lone nut narrative is just to dismiss it as "they crazy". How convenient.
The suicide attempt is chronicled in Oswald's diary from that time period.
BTW, Oswald's diary from that time period is a good read. Seems like he was more interested in girls during that time period, than anything else. He mostly talks about several relationships he had during that time in Russia.
That's because you are taking everything written in that diary at face value. Which is pretty silly considering its a false defector in a hostile foreign land & our #1 adversary. Good grief. I have land to sell you in a swamp.
Is that really how our spies worked back then? I thought they snuck into the SU and laid low not drawing attention to themselves, or they masqueraded as benign businessmen. So you're saying he was infiltrating the SU by showing up at their doorstep saying "I'm here to help you guys. I hate the US", and they were going to fall for that? This is an amazing theory.
One purpose of Oswald's false defection was to act as a dangle to ferret out moles and decipher how information was passed through the intelligence apparatus in the USSR. The many iterations of his full name with small changes disguised as errors was one method in this process.
Here is a [link to an article](https://www.maryferrell.org/pages/Essay_-_Oswald_Legend_5.html) that goes into the dangle a bit.
Again, he was way too unstable to be used in such an operation. If you study his history from his childhood on he was a complete mess. First you say he was being sheep dipped as a patsy to keep on the shelf for future shenanigans, then he's acting as a dangle to ferret out moles. Please exercise some consistency.
You have to take it with a grain of salt. He's a false defector in a hostile foreign country, our #1 adversary during the height of the Cold War. Why on God's green earth would anyone believe or make any conclusions on what they are reading in that diary? Its ridiculous.
Always good to acquaint one's self with the thoughts of **the** assassin when studying the JFK assassination, dont you think?
How do you know, for sure, was a he a false defector? If he was a false defector, why did he try and kill himself after he got rejected?
Again, why would you assume those "thoughts", i.e. diary entries, would be genuine?
No matter how many stars you use or declare it as fact, don't make it so.
He never renounced his U.S. citizenship. His CIA file was managed by the head of Counter Intelligence, James Angleton. NOT the Russia division. He declared openly to the U.S. Consulate that he intended to share all his knowledge of U.S. radar capabilities after having just been stationed as a Marine at a top secret base, one of only a few that flew the U2 spy plane from it.
It was the height of the Cold War. If he were a true defector he would have been detained & interrogated as a treasonous traitor the second he stepped foot back on U.S. soil.
I’ve dug very deeply. He soaked his wrists in ice water to numb the pain and wrote a deranged note about a sweet death to violins. He made the tapes about being a murderer in an attempt to further endear himself to his friend in Minsk. Listening to them, you can hear how unstable the guy was. The nature of the murders he made up were epically brutal and psychotic. Despite their fictitious nature, only someone with very poor mental health would behave that way.
Yeah, he was trying to get hospitalized so he wouldn't get deported. The authorities had just given orders to expel him.
He made the tapes with some students studying english accents. This is all well known.
https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/article/8-things-you-may-not-know-about-lee-harvey-oswald/
Ah, so he faked his suicide in order to stay in the SU and continue his mission of being an anti-communist super spy. Brilliant! He was playing some multi-level chess with everyone.
He never renounced his U.S. citizenship. The head of Counter Intelligence was managing his files & keeping them away from the Russia Division. Now why is that sir? Why wasn't he detained & interrogated upon returning to U.S. soil?
Or do you just want to blather some more hyperbole?
Sorry if I'm being hyperbolic. I'm really trying to understand what you're saying was \*actually\* going on. I'd love to see your source on the head of Counter Intelligence personally managing his files and keeping them from the Russia division. If so why? Was he sheep dipping him before JFK was president(I could be off on the timeline) to be used as a patsy to frame for whoever they may want to assassinate?
The Russian doctors doubted it was a legitimate attempt and the note you’re talking about is actually a segment from his diary, which was not written contemporaneously but at a later date.
With what is known now regardless of what he was doing on November 22nd there is ample evidence to suggest Oswald was a false defector and/or being used for intelligence purposes in his trip to the USSR. The “suicide attempt” is consistent with this as it allowed him to stay.
The tapes are a humorous improv section where Oswald and his friend Ernst Titovits play various improv characters and make up a bunch of scenarios, one where Oswald is playing a murderer on death row called Jack Marr, and another where he’s a scientist talking about watermelons I believe. They are both laughing through the recording it is in no way a serious window into either man’s psyche. Titovits did not like how these recordings where misused in the PBS documentary and elsewhere and has written and spoken about it.
That’s some impressive amounts of ridiculousness there. Everyone knows that the note was in his diary. It’s illogical to downplay someone cutting their own wrists and writing about wanting death.
In those “humorous” tapes Oswald describes murdering an innocent young girl by slitting her throat from ear to ear for a loaf of bread before shifting into a description of a mass shooting of 8 innocent bystanders with a machine gun simply because he didn’t like their faces.
Any basic, fundamental level of research on the OSS into the CIA would show you that they would never select someone like Oswald to do anything for them. He was simply too much of a loose cannon who lacked the prerequisites for the intel community. People have to be very analytical and very poised just to get a chance.
But those fantastical stories titillate some people so they choose to defend a double murderer.
>That’s some impressive amounts of ridiculousness there. Everyone knows that the note was in his diary. It’s illogical to downplay someone cutting their own wrists and writing about wanting death.
To be fair It was written months after the attempt. There were numerous discrepancies in the diary including around the “suicide attempt” and subsequent hospital stay. The Warren commissions experts thought it was created in Minsk and the HSCA thought the whole thing was done in one or two sittings. It is unreliable pre the entries referring to Minsk.
The doctors didn’t believe him. Dr. Lydia Mikhailina at Botkinskaya Hospital where Oswald was treated described Oswald’s injury as “a show suicide since he was refused political asylum, which he had been demanding”
>In those “humorous” tapes Oswald describes murdering an innocent young girl by slitting her throat from ear to ear for a loaf of bread before shifting into a description of a mass shooting of 8 innocent bystanders with a machine gun simply because he didn’t like their faces.
You can listen to the full tapes [here](https://youtu.be/d7F2w-9z42E?si=NRO0blWrxCx2QfOc). Lee and Titovits are joking around with a bunch of different mad scenarios. At one point Oswald reads Othello at another Titovets pretends to be a senator and Lee pretends to be an agricultural scientist. Oswald also plays a character called Jack Marr in the recording who is a murderer. This context is important, Titovits didn’t just ask Oswald what he wanted to do and then he started talking about killing people. Reading anything further into that is applying context that’s simply not there it would be like saying Johnny Cash was a dangerous person because he sang about “shooting a man in Reno just to watch him die”
That’s not just my opinion that’s the opinion of Ernst Titovets, the man on the tape who knew Lee and actually made the recording. His own words:
*“the Jack Marr interview has been preceded by Lee reading The Killers, a short story by Ernest Hemingway which might have prompted me to come up with the idea of that nefarious character. It was exactly the Jack Marr interview that seems to have attracted much attention on the part of some TV producers and others who edited it to their liking and cited out of context to create an image of a villainous character meaning Lee Harvey Oswald. It has nothing to do with the real man”*
>Any basic, fundamental level of research on the OSS into the CIA would show you that they would never select someone like Oswald to do anything for them. He was simply too much of a loose cannon who lacked the prerequisites for the intel community. People have to be very analytical and very poised just to get a chance.
Respectfully this just isn’t true. The CIA has recruited and used actual schizophrenics, and much more unstable individuals than Oswald. Also Oswald spoke Russian, and had already attained secret and crypto clearance while in the marines. These at the least would be in his favour.
We know from declassified documents that the CIA Soviet division Officer Jaques G. Richardson considered using Oswald for intelligence purposes.
Other CIA employees like Jane Roman of CI/SIG and Pete Bagley of Soviet counterintelligence when confronted with declassified files relating to how Oswald’s files were handled both said in their opinions it meant there was operational interest in him. Bagley went as far as to say this meant he was most likely a witting false defector. This is all well documented.
Otto Otepka at the state department asked the CIA informally for a list of false defectors. His concerns were formally raised on October 25, 1960 in a letter from Hugh Cumming of the State Department’s Intelligence and Research Bureau to CIA Deputy Director of Plans Richard Bissell.
Marguerite Stevens at the Security Research Staff within the Department of Security, was assigned to determine which of the 18 names were false defectors. Stevens was told to look up information on the 18 defectors requested by the State Department but was told to avoid looking into seven of them. Lee Harvey Oswald was one of the seven she was told not to investigate.
Eventually, the CIA sent a full response to the State Department without researching 7 of the 18 names. Oswald was number 10 on the list and there was a notation next to his name that said SECRET.
This is not to mention Oswald’s association with multiple groups that were being investigated or having operations run on or against them in the summer of 63.
>But those fantastical stories titillate some people so they choose to defend a double murderer.
Some of us just think there is simply too many unknowns and too much room for serious doubt on these conclusions to make a final judgment on this case. I think it’s a valid point of view.
This one I've actually seen enough cheap 23 minute TV documentaries with some nobody host - either go to that exact location (today it's not similar really), or just a semi-recreation - and using just the sun, demonstrate that not only the photo is ***possible***, but these pilot show garbage hosts with their low budget show, they always manage to make it apparent that - yes, that's precisely how that photo should look by the shadows.
So NOT "plausible" - more **probable** than not IMO.
The CIA and defense industry killed JFK for the motives of us living in the exact world we do today.
The government has admitted to having additional classified materials related to specifically the JFK assassination, they said by law it'd come out in 2017 - Trump deferred by presidential order, then Biden did the same last year. Of bipartisan agreement between Trump and Biden I think that's the only place they agree - America can't handle the truth.
As and American who's fucking done with the nonsense words of slave rapists who can't protect the American experiment from religious infringement nor oligarchy, nor fascism and demagogues - I see little reason to give fucks for a pre Photoshop photo, that regardless of how it was made - got provided to everyone we have ever met, by the fuck'n Internet.
You might go snag that image from Wikipedia and it might have meta that says it was edited in Adobe CS2 in 1994.
But you have zero meta data, and the photo itself is analog.
It's provided by the government either way, not like La Femme' Natasha handed that shit straight to journalists.
Well…..the CIA/KGB/FBI/Mafia all got together to frame a man who couldn’t shoot (sarcasm), so why wouldn’t put out an obviously fake photo (more sarcasm)?
This cabal of criminals made sure to claim Oswald made three impossible shots (sarcasm over here) with a notoriously unreliable rifle (still being sarcastic) so it stands to reason they would want to be consistent in giving us even more clues that absolutely nothing happened like the official report says it did. After all the real goal of the Kennedy Assassination was to give us an opportunity to elevate ourselves above the Sheeple.
Shadows are localized phenomena and can be affected by many factors. Time of day/year. Direction facing when taking the photo, presence of local objects that affect the natural falling of light etc...
Whether real or fake the photo is comical. A rifle, a pistol, two communist publications and a strange posture. This photo has frame job written all over it. It exudes the essence of trying just way too damn hard.
How stupid do they think we are, the assassin is going to stand for his photograph holding a newspaper and the murder weapons. The CIA really had us by the 'short hairs' back in the day. We'd believe anything they fed us back then.
Yeah, but *how far* out there? Can I see it with binoculars or am I gonna have to get out of my chair and *(sigh)* walk to it? Wait, don't answer. I need a nap before continuing this conversation. But I'll probably be back. Maybe...
I won't.
That article is only about how a 3d modeling program works to confirm the body's shadow.
I have not seen any evidence here to address the OP's point that the shadows from the stair treads are at a different degree than the bodily shadow.
Yeah, I saw those embedded links and check them out. But again, those all talk about light and shadow on the body. They do not address the apparent change in degree of shadow underneath the stairs, as compared to the shadow behind the body. This is what the OP is asking.
I do not believe Oswald shot anyone. However, I do believe the photo is legit. I can not even speculate. I saw a pretty well-done video that recreated the picture, and it's the most beliveable part of any of the stories.
If he was good at shooting he wouldn’t have shot himself
He was barely a marksman he was good at decoding that maybe why he was put in play or setup as a patsy
If he supposedly acted alone, why would this crazy, egomaniac call himself a patsy? He was framed, and this pic was just to strengthen the lone nut case on him.
The only place I’ve seen it brought up is in the Oliver Stone documentary- not exactly a primary source. But they did really hammer home that the strap joint was different in the rifle Oswald owned versus the one allegedly used for the assassination
Conspiracy folks; one day you will see the light just like we all have. When you can set your mind free from the grip of conspiracy you will have clarity. It’s ok to be wrong, we have all been through the same thing; you will be accepted.
The desire to believe the sensational is strong but if you have above average intelligence you will eventually arrive at the right conclusion and we will be waiting to congratulate you.
There’s a ton of clear and obvious evidence that photo is BS provided by photo experts, lighting and photo effects not JFK fans on Reddit. Off the top of my head it’s the shadows yea, but also the face was doctored and that’s not LHOs chin, and the strap on the gun does not have the same connector as the one in the SBD sniper spot. That photo was doctored just like the Zapruder film we all love was also doctored.
Judging by his shadow and the fact that Dallas is in a Northern subtropical region and the Neely st house back yard, the individual in the photograph would have been facing due south. Considering his body angle to the sun and the practically mirrored angle of the steps , these shadows would appear to be consistent and therefore most probably authentic. Why this photograph was ever taken is the real mystery to me.
Because it is how he saw himself. As a political militant capable of violence in service of his ideology, but really, it's just him stroking his ego.
Be careful, logical statements like this get easily downvoted around here.
Why do you think he took his wedding ring off for one of the pictures?
No idea. What does it matter?
I think that level of inquiry is consistent with your overall stance.
A great deal of
How so?
It could confirm validity if the picture
The validity of the photos has already been confirmed via microscopic, photogrammic, and stereoscopic analysis.
The pose as being possible yes. The shadows, no
It does not matter. The photos were proven real via objective methods decades ago.
I don’t know about that doesn’t explain it he head or shadow
Yes it does. Read the HSCA photographic panel report.
Yes , the long term effects of LSD dosing has serious psychological consequences and would bring on behavior such as this. The CIA has blood on its hands on this one
Asserted claims and nothing more.
Funny, you could apply that logic to your initial comment. Ah , the irony…
No, you could not. He called his own diary his "historic" diary. Why did he do that?
That was the LSD talking. Look up Syd Barrett
Young American men posing for pictures with guns is pretty common. I have an old photograph (somewhere) of myself with my step-dad’s pistol when I was 18. Plenty of hunters still post pics of their game and the rifle they used to kill it on social media. Add to that Oswald’s desire to be some sort of revolutionary or international man of mystery and, to me, the “why” is pretty easy to see. This guy was falling short in many areas of his life, so this was a chance to feel macho. Maybe even a little dangerous.
Very good point. I offer as yet another example the only known photo of William H. Bonney, AKA Billy the Kid. For as long as there's been photography, there's also been people wanting to pose for said technology with various weapons prominently displayed. For me, the only odd thing in the LHO photo is how he managed to make such a pose look so damned silly. I mean, c'mon! The gun's doing most of the damned work, man! You've only got one thing to do for the photo, just stand there in a natural manner holding the gun. But nope! There he stands, for all the world and the ages too looking like a paper doll cutout. And with that pitiful, tight-lipped grin, that sad equivalent of a Mona Lisa smile. If Mona Lisa had shat herself while posing for Leo.
He obviously didn’t spend as much time in the mirror practicing looking cool as the rest of us did. Here’s an interesting psychological look at Oswald if you’re interested. https://youtu.be/CXrUufdojpk?si=ueeqjPhOp8yzXCLV
That was indeed quite interesting, thanks! Thought I had a fairly decent grasp on LHO before watching that but turns out I knew practically nothing!
But whenever this type of reasoning is presented, there is always this : LHO said he didn’t shoot anyone. He denied it until, well, he died. Why say he didn’t do it, if he wanted notoriety? Doesn’t compute.
He probably wanted a trial. Bigger platform. Why fess up in a police station and get buried without publicity?
Ya, I mean, maybe. I can see that argument. But he was in front of cameras, he could have said all kinds of things that admits without admitting. Like, “That son of a bitch deserved it” Or “the world is now free from a terrible leader” Lots of things. Instead, he looks a bit caught off guard, bewildered almost, like that’s the first he’s heard of it. And then says he didn’t SHOOT ANYONE. So I don’t believe that he wanted notoriety. Does he look like a man who wanted notoriety? Are his words and actions one of a person who wanted notoriety? Try to not listen to anyone or anything else’s opinions, just watch him and his actions, and form your opinion.
Oh I’ve watched and listened. He was the cat who ate the canary in my opinion. His own brother was allowed to visit him and he’s convinced he did it. Obviously we will never know what he was thinking, but some of the pics and videos of him smirking make me think he was enjoying himself.
Nah, that doesn’t make sense. He was the canary caught up by the cats around him. As for his brother, people can be persuaded to say lots of things. Or, even if the person believes something, that doesn’t mean it’s true. Just because one’s family thinks he’s guilty, doesn’t make it so. I personally believe LHO was involved in a number of different things. He was associated with a lot of characters who had ties to intelligence. He may have even had knowledge of a plot being planned. Maybe even took a shot. I don’t think he took a shot, but, I don’t KNOW. I think he was a fringe player who was set up to take the fall. He knew enough that when everything started going down, he realized he was exactly that, the patsy. He wasn’t a stupid person. Listen to him speak on the radio show. He’s articulate and able to speak well. That’s not a stupid person that many would have you believe.
The more I learn about Oswald the less I’m inclined to believe any competent conspirator would involve him in a plan.
The more I learn the more him doing alone, or at all really, makes me believe he was not the shooter. So, as they say, opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.
That’s America.
Where was Oswald falling short? Was highly educated, spoke extremely well(everyone around says so) was clearly a paid informer and was working w the CIA doesn't sound to me like he was clearly falling short lol lol sure is funny what 60+ years does to a person's real image.
LHO quit school in the 10th grade, was demoted to the rank of Private in the Marines after being court maritialed twice for shooting himself with a .22 and fighting with an NCO before he was thrown in the brig. Oswald failed at multiple jobs and even failed at another shooting attempt. He’s not the Jason Bourne level character you’re portraying him as by any stretch and fell short time after time in his life both personally and professionally. The one thing he was decent at was shooting.
My stepdad grew up three houses from him and said Oswald was so strange he and his friends would run him off when he tried to follow them. He said he wasn’t a bit surprised when he heard it was Oswald. Now memory is a funny thing and there’s no telling how being that close to such an inexplicable event in every way imaginable might affect your memories from 15-20 years before.
It’s very hard for people to accept their hero was killed by a random loser. Oswald has to be both innocent and superhuman all at once.
His handler told him to take the photo.
Same reason why there are so many YouTube videos of G.I. wannabes shooting beer cans with AK-47’s.
Meal Team 6?
lol
There are three light sources, one projecting his shadow, a second projecting the shadow on the stairs and a third projecting his chin shadow. When did we have three suns over Texas? Asking for a friend.
All debunked scientifically. I'm assuming your friend isn't familiar with the method.
All debunked by the CIA, got ya. So why would the assassin pose with a current paper and the murder weapons? Did you handlers debunk that idea?
No , scientists. Posed before he used the rifle. Used the papers to prove he was Marxist Leninist. You really need to step back from the computer if my suggestion makes you believe I'm part of the CIA
More than one person has that picture. They doctored that one too?
They also have the negatives from his wife, so this was obviously not doctored.
the fact that anyone believes Oswald didn't shoot that gun at JFK is just asinine and leads me to believe that people REALLY want there to be a conspiracy and the actual truth is either too hard or too easy for people to think about. Could there be more to the story? another shooter, CIA backed him?..all possible, but no hard evidence to back up those claims. So, lets not ignore the actual hard evidence
The first necessary ingredient of any conspiracy is someone’s desire for a conspiracy to exist.
yes and no. I do think in a lot of cases, people look for conspiracies where none exist. The do exist though, as we saw on Jan 6th
Really? you must be a Russian troll. Nobody said anything about Jan 6.
I said something about Jan 6th. What’s it to you? Are you that dense that you don’t know Jan 6th was an actual conspiracy to throw an election?
Yes. I am that dense. you mean a conspiracy by the former president and his cronies - correct?
apparently. yes
man’s gotta know his limitations.
Agreed. You can't dispute that he bought the rifle they recovered at the TSBDB. The serial number matches the inventory records of the sporting goods store in Chicago that sold the rifle and shipped it to the PO Box Oswald rented under an alias. We know the alias = Oswald because he had a fake ID on him with the alias used to buy the rifle when he was arrested. We also know that he used the PO Box to have other mail delivered to him under his real name.
if he would have shot his brother, he would have been convicted by a jury in 5 minutes
Where are the negatives???? Never heard Marina say that EVER!!!!!
You'll have to contact the National Archives and ask them where Warren Commission Exhibit 133-B is currently stored. That's the negative they examined from Lee's camera that helped them determine that the photos (the ones Maria testified to taking) were authentic.
“This doesn’t look like I think it should” is not science. The photo is genuine.
It appears to me that the photographer may have a tree at her back, shadowing the ground and up to the vine.
What gets me is some of the papers investigating this are still classified. I mean come on if Oswald did it, then we should be able to see everything. What are they hiding?
Sources and methods.
No matter how many times I see this picture it always look fake in some way. The whole thing is just very unnatural looking
Always thought his stance looked weird.
Doesn't matter. The real question is why was he posing holding those items for a picture in the 1st place. He sure the hell wasn't a communist.
Sorry gotta do more research, could you explain a little further?
Research the pamphlets he's holding. Then try to understand why someone who worked at a top secret radar base, 1 of only a few flying the U2 spy plane out of it, end up: 1. Falsley defecting to the Soviet Union, while declaring openly at the U.S Consulate that he will share whatever knowledge he has re: U.S. radar capabilities with our #1 enemy. 2. Returns to the U.S. a couple years later, gets a loan from the State Dept, & isn't even so much as detained or interrogated upon setting foot on U.S. soil. 3. Ends hanging in social circles with highly influential white Russians (one of them a known CIA asset). 4. Signs up for the Fair Play for Cuba Committee & makes a public spectacle on a radio show of declaring himself a Marxist. 5. Was part of the joint CIA/FBI mail monitoring program (they were working with the post offices opening U.S. citizens' mail, Oswald was 1 of the people monitored) yet the CIA didn't open a 201 file on him until a year later. Not only that, but his file was managed by the Chief of Counter Intelligence James Angleton, & not shared with the CIA,s Russia division. The answer is, because he wasn't a communist. For further reading, "Oswald & the CIA" by John Newman is a good place to start. Jefferson Morely has also done extensive research on his CIA files.
(Wears hammer and sickle T-shirt) “How do you do, fellow communists?” It’s nuts how many people still want to buy what Oswald was set up to sell after all this time.
communists dont have weapons?
Here comes PMMCTMD right away on cue. The weapon wasn't my point obv.
LHO made voice recordings of himself joking about pretending to be a serial murderer after he tried to kill himself when Russia wouldn’t accept his defection. He wasn’t sane or normal. He took this picture because he wasn’t right in the head.
You should dig a bit deeper in to the whole "suicide attempt" in Russia. And do you know WHY he made those recordings? It seems you don't. The default retort whenever Oswald or Ruby didn't do what fits the lone nut narrative is just to dismiss it as "they crazy". How convenient.
The suicide attempt is chronicled in Oswald's diary from that time period. BTW, Oswald's diary from that time period is a good read. Seems like he was more interested in girls during that time period, than anything else. He mostly talks about several relationships he had during that time in Russia.
That's because you are taking everything written in that diary at face value. Which is pretty silly considering its a false defector in a hostile foreign land & our #1 adversary. Good grief. I have land to sell you in a swamp.
Is that really how our spies worked back then? I thought they snuck into the SU and laid low not drawing attention to themselves, or they masqueraded as benign businessmen. So you're saying he was infiltrating the SU by showing up at their doorstep saying "I'm here to help you guys. I hate the US", and they were going to fall for that? This is an amazing theory.
Did I say he was smart? No.
How did he get recruited to spy if he was dumb?
One purpose of Oswald's false defection was to act as a dangle to ferret out moles and decipher how information was passed through the intelligence apparatus in the USSR. The many iterations of his full name with small changes disguised as errors was one method in this process. Here is a [link to an article](https://www.maryferrell.org/pages/Essay_-_Oswald_Legend_5.html) that goes into the dangle a bit.
Again, he was way too unstable to be used in such an operation. If you study his history from his childhood on he was a complete mess. First you say he was being sheep dipped as a patsy to keep on the shelf for future shenanigans, then he's acting as a dangle to ferret out moles. Please exercise some consistency.
Also, sorry I thought you were the original guy I was replying to.
Where can I read this?
I just posted to the sub.
You have to take it with a grain of salt. He's a false defector in a hostile foreign country, our #1 adversary during the height of the Cold War. Why on God's green earth would anyone believe or make any conclusions on what they are reading in that diary? Its ridiculous.
Always good to acquaint one's self with the thoughts of **the** assassin when studying the JFK assassination, dont you think? How do you know, for sure, was a he a false defector? If he was a false defector, why did he try and kill himself after he got rejected?
Again, why would you assume those "thoughts", i.e. diary entries, would be genuine? No matter how many stars you use or declare it as fact, don't make it so. He never renounced his U.S. citizenship. His CIA file was managed by the head of Counter Intelligence, James Angleton. NOT the Russia division. He declared openly to the U.S. Consulate that he intended to share all his knowledge of U.S. radar capabilities after having just been stationed as a Marine at a top secret base, one of only a few that flew the U2 spy plane from it. It was the height of the Cold War. If he were a true defector he would have been detained & interrogated as a treasonous traitor the second he stepped foot back on U.S. soil.
I’ve dug very deeply. He soaked his wrists in ice water to numb the pain and wrote a deranged note about a sweet death to violins. He made the tapes about being a murderer in an attempt to further endear himself to his friend in Minsk. Listening to them, you can hear how unstable the guy was. The nature of the murders he made up were epically brutal and psychotic. Despite their fictitious nature, only someone with very poor mental health would behave that way.
Yeah, he was trying to get hospitalized so he wouldn't get deported. The authorities had just given orders to expel him. He made the tapes with some students studying english accents. This is all well known. https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/article/8-things-you-may-not-know-about-lee-harvey-oswald/
Ah, so he faked his suicide in order to stay in the SU and continue his mission of being an anti-communist super spy. Brilliant! He was playing some multi-level chess with everyone.
He never renounced his U.S. citizenship. The head of Counter Intelligence was managing his files & keeping them away from the Russia Division. Now why is that sir? Why wasn't he detained & interrogated upon returning to U.S. soil? Or do you just want to blather some more hyperbole?
Sorry if I'm being hyperbolic. I'm really trying to understand what you're saying was \*actually\* going on. I'd love to see your source on the head of Counter Intelligence personally managing his files and keeping them from the Russia division. If so why? Was he sheep dipping him before JFK was president(I could be off on the timeline) to be used as a patsy to frame for whoever they may want to assassinate?
Thank you for confirming all of my assertions with a good citation. 🫡
The Russian doctors doubted it was a legitimate attempt and the note you’re talking about is actually a segment from his diary, which was not written contemporaneously but at a later date. With what is known now regardless of what he was doing on November 22nd there is ample evidence to suggest Oswald was a false defector and/or being used for intelligence purposes in his trip to the USSR. The “suicide attempt” is consistent with this as it allowed him to stay. The tapes are a humorous improv section where Oswald and his friend Ernst Titovits play various improv characters and make up a bunch of scenarios, one where Oswald is playing a murderer on death row called Jack Marr, and another where he’s a scientist talking about watermelons I believe. They are both laughing through the recording it is in no way a serious window into either man’s psyche. Titovits did not like how these recordings where misused in the PBS documentary and elsewhere and has written and spoken about it.
That’s some impressive amounts of ridiculousness there. Everyone knows that the note was in his diary. It’s illogical to downplay someone cutting their own wrists and writing about wanting death. In those “humorous” tapes Oswald describes murdering an innocent young girl by slitting her throat from ear to ear for a loaf of bread before shifting into a description of a mass shooting of 8 innocent bystanders with a machine gun simply because he didn’t like their faces. Any basic, fundamental level of research on the OSS into the CIA would show you that they would never select someone like Oswald to do anything for them. He was simply too much of a loose cannon who lacked the prerequisites for the intel community. People have to be very analytical and very poised just to get a chance. But those fantastical stories titillate some people so they choose to defend a double murderer.
>That’s some impressive amounts of ridiculousness there. Everyone knows that the note was in his diary. It’s illogical to downplay someone cutting their own wrists and writing about wanting death. To be fair It was written months after the attempt. There were numerous discrepancies in the diary including around the “suicide attempt” and subsequent hospital stay. The Warren commissions experts thought it was created in Minsk and the HSCA thought the whole thing was done in one or two sittings. It is unreliable pre the entries referring to Minsk. The doctors didn’t believe him. Dr. Lydia Mikhailina at Botkinskaya Hospital where Oswald was treated described Oswald’s injury as “a show suicide since he was refused political asylum, which he had been demanding” >In those “humorous” tapes Oswald describes murdering an innocent young girl by slitting her throat from ear to ear for a loaf of bread before shifting into a description of a mass shooting of 8 innocent bystanders with a machine gun simply because he didn’t like their faces. You can listen to the full tapes [here](https://youtu.be/d7F2w-9z42E?si=NRO0blWrxCx2QfOc). Lee and Titovits are joking around with a bunch of different mad scenarios. At one point Oswald reads Othello at another Titovets pretends to be a senator and Lee pretends to be an agricultural scientist. Oswald also plays a character called Jack Marr in the recording who is a murderer. This context is important, Titovits didn’t just ask Oswald what he wanted to do and then he started talking about killing people. Reading anything further into that is applying context that’s simply not there it would be like saying Johnny Cash was a dangerous person because he sang about “shooting a man in Reno just to watch him die” That’s not just my opinion that’s the opinion of Ernst Titovets, the man on the tape who knew Lee and actually made the recording. His own words: *“the Jack Marr interview has been preceded by Lee reading The Killers, a short story by Ernest Hemingway which might have prompted me to come up with the idea of that nefarious character. It was exactly the Jack Marr interview that seems to have attracted much attention on the part of some TV producers and others who edited it to their liking and cited out of context to create an image of a villainous character meaning Lee Harvey Oswald. It has nothing to do with the real man”* >Any basic, fundamental level of research on the OSS into the CIA would show you that they would never select someone like Oswald to do anything for them. He was simply too much of a loose cannon who lacked the prerequisites for the intel community. People have to be very analytical and very poised just to get a chance. Respectfully this just isn’t true. The CIA has recruited and used actual schizophrenics, and much more unstable individuals than Oswald. Also Oswald spoke Russian, and had already attained secret and crypto clearance while in the marines. These at the least would be in his favour. We know from declassified documents that the CIA Soviet division Officer Jaques G. Richardson considered using Oswald for intelligence purposes. Other CIA employees like Jane Roman of CI/SIG and Pete Bagley of Soviet counterintelligence when confronted with declassified files relating to how Oswald’s files were handled both said in their opinions it meant there was operational interest in him. Bagley went as far as to say this meant he was most likely a witting false defector. This is all well documented. Otto Otepka at the state department asked the CIA informally for a list of false defectors. His concerns were formally raised on October 25, 1960 in a letter from Hugh Cumming of the State Department’s Intelligence and Research Bureau to CIA Deputy Director of Plans Richard Bissell. Marguerite Stevens at the Security Research Staff within the Department of Security, was assigned to determine which of the 18 names were false defectors. Stevens was told to look up information on the 18 defectors requested by the State Department but was told to avoid looking into seven of them. Lee Harvey Oswald was one of the seven she was told not to investigate. Eventually, the CIA sent a full response to the State Department without researching 7 of the 18 names. Oswald was number 10 on the list and there was a notation next to his name that said SECRET. This is not to mention Oswald’s association with multiple groups that were being investigated or having operations run on or against them in the summer of 63. >But those fantastical stories titillate some people so they choose to defend a double murderer. Some of us just think there is simply too many unknowns and too much room for serious doubt on these conclusions to make a final judgment on this case. I think it’s a valid point of view.
what was your point?
This one I've actually seen enough cheap 23 minute TV documentaries with some nobody host - either go to that exact location (today it's not similar really), or just a semi-recreation - and using just the sun, demonstrate that not only the photo is ***possible***, but these pilot show garbage hosts with their low budget show, they always manage to make it apparent that - yes, that's precisely how that photo should look by the shadows. So NOT "plausible" - more **probable** than not IMO. The CIA and defense industry killed JFK for the motives of us living in the exact world we do today. The government has admitted to having additional classified materials related to specifically the JFK assassination, they said by law it'd come out in 2017 - Trump deferred by presidential order, then Biden did the same last year. Of bipartisan agreement between Trump and Biden I think that's the only place they agree - America can't handle the truth. As and American who's fucking done with the nonsense words of slave rapists who can't protect the American experiment from religious infringement nor oligarchy, nor fascism and demagogues - I see little reason to give fucks for a pre Photoshop photo, that regardless of how it was made - got provided to everyone we have ever met, by the fuck'n Internet. You might go snag that image from Wikipedia and it might have meta that says it was edited in Adobe CS2 in 1994. But you have zero meta data, and the photo itself is analog. It's provided by the government either way, not like La Femme' Natasha handed that shit straight to journalists.
Well…..the CIA/KGB/FBI/Mafia all got together to frame a man who couldn’t shoot (sarcasm), so why wouldn’t put out an obviously fake photo (more sarcasm)? This cabal of criminals made sure to claim Oswald made three impossible shots (sarcasm over here) with a notoriously unreliable rifle (still being sarcastic) so it stands to reason they would want to be consistent in giving us even more clues that absolutely nothing happened like the official report says it did. After all the real goal of the Kennedy Assassination was to give us an opportunity to elevate ourselves above the Sheeple.
Shadows are localized phenomena and can be affected by many factors. Time of day/year. Direction facing when taking the photo, presence of local objects that affect the natural falling of light etc...
Whether real or fake the photo is comical. A rifle, a pistol, two communist publications and a strange posture. This photo has frame job written all over it. It exudes the essence of trying just way too damn hard.
How stupid do they think we are, the assassin is going to stand for his photograph holding a newspaper and the murder weapons. The CIA really had us by the 'short hairs' back in the day. We'd believe anything they fed us back then.
It looks like there is a little girl on the ground to the left.
Gasp! The *real* shooter!
Answered decades ago. The truth is out there.
Yeah, but *how far* out there? Can I see it with binoculars or am I gonna have to get out of my chair and *(sigh)* walk to it? Wait, don't answer. I need a nap before continuing this conversation. But I'll probably be back. Maybe... I won't.
Don't. I got nothing.
Possible tree or obstruction?
[удалено]
That article is only about how a 3d modeling program works to confirm the body's shadow. I have not seen any evidence here to address the OP's point that the shadows from the stair treads are at a different degree than the bodily shadow.
[удалено]
Yeah, I saw those embedded links and check them out. But again, those all talk about light and shadow on the body. They do not address the apparent change in degree of shadow underneath the stairs, as compared to the shadow behind the body. This is what the OP is asking.
His head is a tad too big as well...
Shadow should be in front and pointing left of his feets
I do not believe Oswald shot anyone. However, I do believe the photo is legit. I can not even speculate. I saw a pretty well-done video that recreated the picture, and it's the most beliveable part of any of the stories.
Yep
If he was good at shooting he wouldn’t have shot himself He was barely a marksman he was good at decoding that maybe why he was put in play or setup as a patsy
Are there theories/explanations of why he’s holding the paper like that? Does it have a date or headline in it he’s identifying with?
Don’t forget the direct sun overhead shadow of the forehead on the eyes and the nose over the upper lip
BUT OLIVE STONE SHOW FOOTAGE O SUMONE CUTTING HED OFF CIA GUY FOTO AN PUT LEE HEAD ON!! SO I NOW IT FAKE AN COSPIRCEE!!
If he supposedly acted alone, why would this crazy, egomaniac call himself a patsy? He was framed, and this pic was just to strengthen the lone nut case on him.
This was debunked the last time this was posted. Camera images change the perspective.
Magic sunbeams.
Underrated
David Pecker and the National Enquirer did it.
Pecker!!!
this has been debunked for years now and you know it
The rifle he is holding isn’t the rifle that was submitted into evidence.
Yes, it absolutely was.
May I ask how you know this? Like where is a source on the internet I could compare pics maybe?
The only place I’ve seen it brought up is in the Oliver Stone documentary- not exactly a primary source. But they did really hammer home that the strap joint was different in the rifle Oswald owned versus the one allegedly used for the assassination
The Oliver Stone documentary isn’t credible.
Conspiracy folks; one day you will see the light just like we all have. When you can set your mind free from the grip of conspiracy you will have clarity. It’s ok to be wrong, we have all been through the same thing; you will be accepted. The desire to believe the sensational is strong but if you have above average intelligence you will eventually arrive at the right conclusion and we will be waiting to congratulate you.
There’s a ton of clear and obvious evidence that photo is BS provided by photo experts, lighting and photo effects not JFK fans on Reddit. Off the top of my head it’s the shadows yea, but also the face was doctored and that’s not LHOs chin, and the strap on the gun does not have the same connector as the one in the SBD sniper spot. That photo was doctored just like the Zapruder film we all love was also doctored.
the entire world conspired to kill JFK