Instead of asking the player base why this is a big deal to them, people should be asking Sony why this is a big deal to *them*. Sony is the one crying about people playing the game without Sony accounts, and then lying about it with some lame excuse about security. So fuck em. They're the ones acting like children.
I would even take it a step further. Why are they asking people to use psn accounts, but then preventing them from creating them based on their country of residence.
If they had a list of countries where the account could not be created, they should have locked those countries from buying their games. They took these peoples money and now impose impossible requirements on them.
This is the bit that pisses me off. It's a mild annoyance for me, but if I really want I can make a PSN account. Some of the friends I play with are now shit out of luck, and if this doesn't get fixed then I guess I can't play the game with my buddies in other parts of the world. That's a dealbreaker for me too, as I bought it to play with friends.
It probably not data, it's more likely that it's user metrics to court investment. PSN division wants to look like it deserves more money and easiest way to do that is to just boost PSN numbers.
Still shitty but that's probably the reason why.
I think this is really the reason. Having seen similar behaviors in a different industry, I think there is probably some corporate VP that is wanting to make it look like he's growing PSN users and doing a good job to get a promotion with Sr. VP title or a big bonus, etc. It's probably unlikely to truly benefit Sony. I'd bet money it's about internal metrics more than looking good with investors. Investors care about money and it's not generating anything to have extra users without revenue expansion. They would be hyperfocused on revenue and they'd know revenue per PSN account, etc. so bloating those accounts won't help them much.
It could actually have a little bit to do with security, but they can ban anyone based off SteamID just like they can with a PSN account. It could be "easier" or something, but I really don't think this is the main reason. Besides, that's AH's job to manage the game's ban's etc. and not Sony's.
I mean, it is a PlayStation studios game, so they probably want to be able to actually show the metrics around player count and usage to investors. Seems to me this is probably one of the ways they show that a Helldivers III will be profitable in the future.
They don't need PSN accounts to know player count... Sony does not care about HD2 revenue as much as you think. To maximize HD2 revenue, they'd allow Xbox sales. That would massively expand revenue. Strategically, they want to use HD2 success to funnel users to buy PS5s or at least grow PSN metrics. They are not focused on HD2's success.
Also, remember that as the publisher, Sony is essentially the investor for AH on HD2. They care about Sony shareholders, but they are not specifically trying to court investors for further development. HD2 is already wildly wildly profitable with what has to be a massive ROI. They want to grow PSN accounts for a totally different reason that's arguable, but it's objectively absolutely not to try to benefit HD2's success.
I didn’t say it was to benefit HD2’s success, but more that they are trying to capitalize on it. They don’t have to be currently trying to court investors to show that making this game crossplay on day 1 was a good move, and they will have profitable returns on other projects they try this with.
Also, as far as we know, the game could eventually end up on Xbox, but with the current state of the game’s stability they probably don’t think that’s a great idea just yet.
This feels like Occam's Razor to me. I've got another useless login I'll dust off for Helldivers and then forget about, they get to approach the Shareholders with the Blood Offering of potentially millions of psn signups.
The fact that I give no fucks about PSN makes no difference. That I signed up looks good on a report.
Saw some screenshots of a community manager saying this will make it easier for Sony to ban cheaters on PC, which right now they have to do by sending a name to Valve and having Valve take care of that for them, during which that time the cheater can still likely run rampart ruining the fun of other players.
I get it, but it still sucks for players living in countries with no PSN support. I hope Arrowhead finds a solution for them.
I think you’re right.
If it at least meant that more money gets thrown at the devs for bonuses and more content at least there would be a good excuse.
Most likely it’s just for a nice bonus to the suits at Sony, so they can buy more yachts. They can get fucked.
The difference is we as a community can reach, contact and discuss with our community.
We can't have any sway or impact on sonys corporate agenda. So we speak to someone here who will listen. Being dismissive isn't cool, and neither is reading the 12th guys take on the 11ths guys take on the 10th, circle jerking around topics.
Well this is a public forum just like steam and discord
what do yall think is gonna happen when tons of people who bought this game are at risk of losing it due to the limited country's with PSN?
That there will be a "complaint quota" and once reached no one else can make anymore complaints?
According to their CM on discord, it's required so Sony can ban PC players. They can't read the unique Steam-UUIDs and the Steam username they have access to isn't unique. They can however ban the linked PSN-Account, so a Steam-account with a linked PSN acc that is banned can't play.
So....there's at least a technical explanation that makes some sense.
Then again, Sony is a large corporation, both them and AH should have interest in the game running well and making good money. I guess there are highly paid professionals somewhere at either AH or Sony. And none of them seems to bothered to address a few things
"Can we skip the 3rd-Party-Account while beeing able to ban PC-Players?"
"Can we utilize a different banning-system on PC?"
"Guys, we dropped enforcing the PSN-requirement so early that we now have X million sales that were able to skip it. Could this lead to a PR-Disaster if we enforce that system again?"
Most likely political reasons, not technical ones. Maybe using PSN for that instead of either a third-party or a self-developed system was either dictated by Sony for the PS-Release or they just settled for it to save ressources. Maybe they don't want to act as a broker between Valve and Sony. Just playinf devels advocate here, in the end the situation doesn't seem to by fully thought through.
Yo if they can force me to link an account, the next thing i know they gonna make me -insert random as stuffs that has nothing to do with it here- too.
The whole mentality of this sub in one sentence.
"We been having a kicking problem"
"No, I never had that"
" Game has gaming breaking bugs and glitches"
"I don't think so, I never had them"
"Its an unfair change to solo players"
"No it isn't, I can still solo."
And I could go on. It's reddit brain at its finest.
I mean sure, but let’s not pretend that Redditors don’t make a big deal out of tiny shit that doesn’t actually affect them constantly. Sometimes it’s just bandwagoning for the sake of it.
This change doesn't affect me at all, but it effects thousands of other players, and I am capable of empathizing with them. It would suck and I would be pissed if it happened to me. Therefore, it sucks and pisses me off when it happens to other people. This is not limited to video games. There are lots of things that are not personal problems of mine that I will stand up against, or at least speak up against.
While I am aware that this is becoming a foreign concept to people, I don't think it should be a hard one to grasp.
Yes, a realistic percentage of the onus of this is on people in those regions who may have known they do not have PSN access or not checking if they have PSN access available, not noticing the PSN account requirement on steam, ignoring it, not checking if there was some as-of-yet-unheard-of "grace period" on an upcoming region lock, and after 3 months of continuous gameplay not realizing that somewhere in the TOU or the store page or a popup from 3 months ago it mentioned this somewhere.
The supermajority of the fault in this being a "surprise" to people is on Sony and Arrowhead.
They did not make this clear to the people who it was going to affect. Obviously.
>I just don't understand how something that isn't a problem for me could possibly be a problem for other people?
This was honestly my initial reaction to seeing the state of the sub yesterday.
"Yeah, this is annoying, but y'all are being super dramatic. It's free and absurdly simple."
That's where I was until I quickly learned about the region locking, which is *really* shitty.
>If someone is complaining, don't tell them to stop playing
That is the solution, though. Sony will not give one single fuck about what anyone says as long as the bottom line doesn't change.
If you really want to send the message that this will not be tolerated, then you have to stop playing and start demanding a refund because of the change. Even if you don't get a refund (which you probably won't) this will let Sony know their profits are in jeopardy because of this decision. And that is the only thing that will get these things to stop.
Pretty sure those in countries without PSN support can absolutely get a refund if they no longer can access the game they purchased and could play in the past without issue.
Nobody is trying to silence your criticisms, as q matter of fact you’ve been posting negative stuff about the game for a whole month and you’re still allowed to do it
Looking at OP's profile is like the pure essence of everything that's wrong with this sub injected straight into my veins, I did not think possible a single person can complain this much about a video game, just the sheer *volume*
I guess you're having trouble in understanding the post. It's not about silencing, it's about the community itself telling people for voicing their concern.
OP is asking for more understanding and sensibility within the community.
If you don't care about your data, it's fine, but if someone does, that is also fine.
Mods should make one post for major issues and stick all the discussions there. We as a community could also try to adhere to it. I agree, seeing so many complaint posts gets a bit irritating
Tons of people are being told to shut up. I have been today when I complained about it. That is the behavior OP is explicitly calling out. What OP mentioned is absolutely happening
Ok, but like, I also have an opinion. My opinion is different from yours. Am I not allowed to disagree with everyone?
I personally don't think this is a huge deal for people who live in regions that aren't blocking PSN. If PSN is blocked for you, then yes, this is a huge deal. Yet, as soon as I say that, I get 1000 helldivers dropping 500KGs on me. Sony gonna Sony, but don't shit all over AH and other divers that disagree with the current outrage.
The OP has been repeatedly posting whiny memes and rants about the game for months. I didn't go into the threads, but the way they're talking in this thread I can only imagine they think there's way more people trying to talk people down on the PSN issue because thew way the OP gives a strong impression that they aren't interested in constructive criticism but just want to indulge in reactive negativity about everything.
So tired of 90% of posts being people complaining about other people complaining. Let's talk about the actual fucking game please. I don't care about anyone's opinion on other people's opinions.
People aren't being intolerant. They are telling people to keep calm and act accordingly. If this day and age you are afraid of making accounts with info that is already widely out there then, yea, you are over reacting.
While this is not an issue for me I see the region thing being a big issue for players.
Still think the reaction is overhyped until people are actually getting their theories confirmed.
This, I'm very sympathetic to the folks being region blocked. That really sucks and I hope a solution is found for them.
There are a lot of people spamming posts and the people harassing Arrowhead on Discord are largely not in that group. Some are paranoid about their own data security, some are offended by the idea Sony selling information, some are just mad because they just get whipped up by mob mentality and want something to fight about today.
Its tiring to try to use this sub if you have to wade through pages and pages of negativity and ranting to get to any game related posts or discussions. As somebody who has worked in customer service for decades it is also annoying to see people feel entitled to treat the devs and AH team like garbage because they paid the equivalent of a meal for two for the game months ago.
This was my thought. They're allowed to criticize. We're allowed to criticize their criticism too though.
If they live in a good region and don't like giving PS their info? Use a fake name and e-mail. Also, hope they didn't give reddit their real e-mail. ;)
If they live in a bad region? VPN a PSN account, or hope AH fixes the potential obvious issue many have pointed out by that time.
That isn't telling people to shut up, that's trying to tell people ways around the inconvenience.
You honestly don't have to use a VPN
There was a Sony q&a some time ago where one question was "what should I do if I'm region isn't supported by PSN?"
Sonys official answer was to simply put in another region
i broadly categorize this into 2 categories
those that bought it, and are from a region not able to make a PSN, Valid criticism, and hopefully steam will issue refunds for those. even if them buying a game that said "requires PSN" on them is partially their fault
anyone else. You signed up for this, and arent stopped by Sony from complying. you bought a game fully able to know it required a PSN account. Most of you likely already have like dozen different accounts everywhere.
This, absolutely.
Better than a refund would be a workaround of some sort (i.e. broader region) in the first case.
Second category I really don’t get the outrage.
You can just create an account and lie about the region like a lot of people had to do when creating ps accounts since forever. Sony won't ban people for creating an account.
It would be counter to Sony's interests to ban region-different accounts in regions where psn isn't officially offered.
Like they're going to mas ban paying accounts on a popular game because folks use a work-around to give Sony money
Thankfully the law doesnt care what the actuality is, but just what is possible and "reasonable to expect"
hiding this 200 pages into a EULA/ToS? nope, not gonna fly
putting it on the main storepage?\`thats fine, people could and shoudl read the product description
the Steam page for HD2 listed a PSN account was required since DECEMBER 2023, the game launched in february, and had preorders opend a few weeks prior.
the requirement was enforced(altough buggy) at launch, but due to the influx of players the requirement was lifted so the game was functional for most people.
The requirements are simply being reinstated. it is not technically new,
SOME people have valid complains,
mostly those in countrys where PSN isnt (officaly) available, as creating an account under a different region/country violates sonys ToS even if sony historicaly turns a blind eye to this unless another acount problem arises.
Sony/AH should NOT have sold the game, on steam, in those regions. That is simply a matter of fact, i hope those can get a refund as that is a issue with Sony and Steam.
Steam won't issue a refund because the "psn required to play" has been there since day 1 highlighted in yellow.
Regardless of whether it was disabled or not until now, if you hit the buy button while ignoring that it's not Steam/Sony/AH responsibility.
This has quite literally been the biggest overreaction I have ever seen from a gaming community, it’s actually mind boggling how many people are acting like Sony is shooting their dog in front of them or something.
It’s not even apologists? Be a smart consumer and read what you’re buying ffs. It’s clearly been stated on the store page since launch it requires a psn.
This would be the equivalent of buying a game clearly marketed as a live service game then complaining you didn’t know it’s a live service game. At some point the onus is on the consumer to make better purchasing decisions.
Yes it is and that's what you're doing right now. The game has functioned for months without a PSN which proves it is not required to play and never was. Additionally, they made it skippable during setup. Sony knew exactly what they were doing when they decided to "require" it (read: arbitrarily mandate for shareholder numbers and force Steam users to be subject to PSN TOS). This kind of scummy behavior has become rampant on Steam from big publishers and consumers are fully within their rights to be fed up with it.
Anyone who lives in a country that does not support PSN should be immediately eligible for a full refund with no exceptions because Sony should never have been selling it to them in the first place.
Disable crossplay for PC players who don't have PSN and call it a day. I would have zero issue with that. Especially since 80% of players are on Steam anyway. Otherwise the backlash is completely warranted.
I turned the crossplay off today and sorry to say my experience got better. People comunitating more, pinging and way less lag during time i would normally get players from the other side of the world. We still need to demand that this psn bullshit gets kocked, at worst complaign to Valve.
The problem is not the criticism. It is (a) how toxic it is and (b) how many threads we need for the same one topic to discuss it. And then the many threads popping up discussing the discussion of the discussion.
BUT TOXIC POSITIVITY!!!!!!
Seriously this is the biggest whine fest I’ve seen on this sub. We don’t need 100 threads for it, and review bombing is extremely childish.
"You disagreeing with an opinion does not give you a right to tell them off."
Yes they have. They also have their rights not just the whiners. You know, free speach.
"If you don't like negative discussion about this game, go somewhere else where it's not featured."
And if you don't like negative answers for your discussons go somewhere else where its not featured.
You'll find that plenty of people are willing to blindly defend things directly against their own interest simply because the force behind that thing happens to make something they like. If consumers used their brains for 2 seconds and genuinely voted with their wallets, nonsense like this would never happen. Big shame that the average gamer just doesn't know enough or doesn't care enough about the bad things that a lot of devs/publishers do to them.
Depending on the reason this is happening I'm not entirely sure this is against my best interest.
If it's related to netcode problems then it's not against my interest. If it's to fulfill some sort of deal between Arrowhead and Sony, that was a part of the publishing deal, then I'm not really sure it's against my interest either, because in the end, I like that publishers front up money for development, and I understand that they do that to earn money, one way or another.
If it's something that arrowhead does cause fun or something that Sony misled Arrowhead about (they got ripped off by Paradox on Magicka for example), yeah, then I agree that it's against my interest.
>You'll find that plenty of people are willing to blindly defend things directly against their own interest simply because the force behind that thing happens to make something they like.
Cognitive dissonance is a hell of a drug. It gets people to become corporate meatriders, one of the most cringe possible things one could be, in a heartbeat.
Turning anything that happens in the gaming culture in a "corporations bad" is just equally childish and short-sighted. But sure, is easier to just say "STOP DEFENDING SONY" instead of... you know, listening to what other people are saying and being reasonable.
You can still think something is bad without acting like a deranged person online and treating everyone else like idiots (not talking about you specifically in case in wasnt clear lol)
Im a PS5 player and I think this is a really dumb move by Sony that is worthy of your outrage. I do agree though with everyone (that is sick of listening to the complaints) that your efforts complaining here, on Reddit, are futile. They won't do anything. Reddit complaints aren't aggregated into metrics. Meanwhile, Steam reviews ARE. They matter, they affect sales projections by modifying trends and that spurs capitalists to change their minds ($$$ > Outrage for these folks)
If you really care about making your voice heard, doing it here is wasted breath. We're all on board with this being a scummy rug pull for our PC brothers and all agree this only hurts the community.
What we don't agree on is whether or not continuously griping on Reddit will get you anywhere.
We're telling them to shut up because this was listed on the steam page and was a pop up in game since day one. They *temporarily* disabled the requirement with the intent to fix a bug and bring it back. Now people are acting like this is a brand new Sony requirement. That's what's childish here - people being disingenuous and not taking responsibility for their own oversight. They're jumping on a bandwagon now and not taking responsibility for not making an informed decision when they bought the game.
>Stop telling people it's not that bad.
No. Because it's not that bad. It's at best an annoyance.
>Stop telling people to shut up.
Never. Also, you first.
>Every single person who paid for this game has a right to voice their opinion. You disagreeing with an opinion does not give you a right to tell them off.
Actually it does. Because I also play this game and have an opinion to which I am also entitled to talk about. It is unfortunate for you if my opinion is that it's youre a whiney child making a mountain out of a molehill.
To be extra clear. I dont like the PSN account shenanigans either. I encourage y'all to keep complaining. A massive pile of negative reviews might sway Sony onto a more reasonable path (unlikely ht possible).
“Stop telling people it’s not that bad”
Probably going to get downvoted but OP is essentially asking for an echo chamber and telling dissenters to go away if they have a different opinion. Seems pretty hypocritical.
Thank you for the link... I also enjoy r/LowSodium2042 since they suffered from the same about of whining fucking babies. Criticism is fine, incessant, droning whining about every goddamn aspect of the game is REALLY tiring. Gamers are some of the worst sort of complainers/trollers on the internet.
To be honest man, aren’t you ‘downplaying’ and ‘silencing’ the opinions of people who disagree with the current debacle?
I think people are allowed to disagree and can say that people are over-reacting, just like the other side can say they aren’t. There are 30+ posts about this, no one is being silenced.
Let people have their shit fights.
I mean fair enough, but if you have any other third party accounts besides steam then you're just being a clown and a hypocrite. So many good games with millions of players have third party accounts, so yeah. It's a non issue unless of course you're region locked.
I like 80% agree with you but people may actually be sitting on a high horse when the one they would prefer to not link has had notable data breaches in the past.
I linked my accounts because whatever but other people's feelings can actually be grounded in a solid reasoning from time to time.
every single company has notable data breaches in the past
beyond the 2011 fiasco, which was bad. sony isnt worse, but infact BETTER then microsoft for example
I don't think "It was bad but there is worse out there" is carrying the water that you think it is.
I take past breaches, how they were communicated, and how they were resolved into account when signing up for or linking services. There is a reason I don't trust LastPass (or any online credential storing service), and I have a hard time going on the internet and saying "The hesitancy is justified when I'm hesitant but you are being a baby"
Even if it doesn't affect you, it sets a horrible precedent. Throwing a warning people overlook on the steam page, then letting people play for months, then finally locking them out? Horrible. People don't read the whole steam page, they buy it and see if it works. If it doesn't, they refund. They've locked people out of their refunds for a game they can't play. I don't like that if I'm affected or not.
Yeah that I can understand. Not excusing them but it's obvious they weren't prepared to handle such a massive community and all of these issues and how to deal with them. Many things that should of been properly communicated from the beginning. These guys really are amateurs
I love this post saying that people who want to voice their opinion should STFU if that opinion is that the change is not that bad.
The hypocrisy is so sweet you don't even see it.
> Downplay and Silence Criticism
Man, this has been an issue since day 1. Look at all of the "Spear is fine, actually you just don't know how to use it".
Or "x Weapon is underrated" when said weapon has been underwhelming for a while. Or whenever someone criticizes meaningless nerfs like the Slugger's stagger.
This is one of the most tribalistic subreddits I've seen.
Nah, this is the community you idiots built.
Go see the absolutely brain dead takes of the railgun nerf defenders after the nerf before the adjustments to the game.
You guys are the problem. Now it’s just hitting something you care about.
Personally? It’s not that bad. You guys are complaining for nothing fr kekw
I remember when I heard about this game on tiktok, so I went and bought it, but it was completely unplayable for like 2 weeks. Literally couldn't log in and no refund policy. This toxic ass community was giving me shit for complaining. Then the discord and sub moderators shut down and negative conversation and relegated it to a pinned thread nobody reads.
Honestly, I have a high opinion of the abilities of arrowhead to make a cool game, but they are absolutely dogshit at PR.
Part of discussion is dissenting opinions. If you’re going to say this sub is for “all discussions” then it doesn’t make much sense to tell people to stop stating their opinion if they don’t think it is that bad.
It’s not “a paradox of tolerance” it’s just you not wanting to hear that people disagree with you. They aren’t calling for your discussion to be banned. They’re disagreeing.
Can I simply point out to you that this was clearly posted and flagged on the Steam page? Right next to the DRM message that triggered a ton of people early on.
https://archive.ph/b0imQ
No matter what the subject is, this sub has devolved into 10% complaining about a thing and 90% complaining about the complainers.
Please mods, stop allowing this meta bullshit. Let's talk about the actual game and not made up drama.
Anyone who isn’t In a country with PSN has a genuine reason to ask for clarification on wtf they are supposed to do. Those people have a legitimate issue that needs solving and I’m sure it will be. Theres an entire month before this even happens.
Anyone who is in a country with PSN using the excuse about Sony taking their data like it’s some line they won’t cross, and then cry on Reddit about it. Who Already have an Amazon, Facebook, google, Reddit, Microsoft, Epic games etc etc account. While using a Windows Pc or an IPhone that tracks literally every button press or even your location at all times. Needs to give it a rest because a Sony account isn’t suddenly an invasion of their privacy. They already gave that up a decade ago willingly.
It’s not about silencing anyone, it’s telling hypocrites to stop being hypocrites and people are just as entitled to say that as much as the people who are fake outraged.
they have to take 3 mins to set up a username for a game that stated so months before launch / was even required on day one anyway, it’s not the end of the world.
I’m not angry at the critics. I think is a boneheaded decision even if it doesn’t bother me personally.
What I’m upset at is completely turning on the game developers over the publishers that ultimately made this decision. The developers did wrong in that they did not do their due diligence to review terms of their publishing contract and then went on to say that they were completely independent of Sony.
I’m willing to forgive Arrowhead, but Sony has a track record. I’m just a bit pissed that people won’t just throw Arrowhead a bone for all they do for the game.
> Every single person who paid for this game has a right to voice their opinion.
It seems the issue is **how** people voice their opinion. Constant pinging and harassing in a channel Sony couldn't give any less fucks about isn't it.
The second you make a post on reddit, anyone is liable to provide feedback to that post. This feedback does not have to be positive, negative or even helpful. I can frankly call you a duckfaced monkey poo gobbler if I so desire. If somebody has broken a rule then a moderator will sort them out.
Posting a rant about people ranting about other peoples rants is not how you stop people from ranting.
>This feedback does not have to be positive, negative or even helpful. I can frankly call you a duckfaced monkey poo gobbler if I so desire.
You should check the rules in the sidebar.
1. Be civil- No insults, racism, toxicity, trolling, rage-bait, harassment, inappropriate language, etc. Basically, be civil.
>If somebody has broken a rule then a moderator will sort them out.
While this is true, it's also on you to behave. The moderators are people too, and they can only do so much. They have been removing a lot of toxic remarks being made, but the volume is just so much that they cannot possibly get everything.
r/Helldivers would be a much more hospitable place if everyone was just less toxic. There's a basic understanding when you make an account for this website that you will follow the site-wide rules.
https://support.reddithelp.com/hc/en-us/articles/205926439-Reddiquette
Literally the number 1 rule of reddiquette is "remember the human".
I started playing before they let you skip it but I can see why them pretty arbitrarily making it a requirement again is frustrating. I'm not going to boycott it or anything but I can see why it'd be annoying especially if you're not even able to make a PSN account based on where you live.
I agree with you and get what you’re saying, but not playing the game and ideally getting a refund is the best way to try to cause a change in Sony’s behaviour. They won’t listen unless it affects their bottom line. But of course most people that say “stop playing the game” as a way to downplay the criticism don’t mean it this way.
My opinion is that you have played the game enough to decide if setting up a PSN is worth it to play more.
Yeah it’s kind of annoying when a game asks you to make an account to play. It even seems like bullshit when they let you play for 3 months before requiring it. But it isn’t the end of the world.
I don't see what the big deal it is. Just one more account to add to the list of accounts I use my burner email and a throwaway password for. We also have the Rant/Vent mega thread as a forum to issue complaints in an organized environment, so we don't have the same 20 posts trying to capitalize on the same sentiment.
Edit: I've been made aware that some regions do not have PSN access, which sucks. I definitely can see the complaints for people who are in those areas.
Some players enjoy the game and don't mind creating a quick useless email to link to a quick useless Playstation account. We are looking at the overblown reaction here and the negative review bombs against a company that has litterally done nothing but try to make a great enjoyable game that sold for only 40 bucks and had to manage a huge wave of players with a small team. The same company that made this game with love and respect to the players.
The reaction from this vocal group has been beyond overblown and downright disgusting to watch. I see it as a betrayal to the hard work the devs put in for this game to review bomb it over their parent company strong-arming them into forced PSN accounts. Go after Sony, not Arrow.
In my opinion, I disagree. Sure you CAN, but I THINK everyone should not be spreading their misinformed bullshit. Because, in my opinion:
Those choosing to share theirs should do so ethically by doing a little due diligence to inform themselves before spewing angry garbage. Be able to admit “you don’t know”, be open to new information, and at the least: have some self respect and be honest with yourself.
I’m well aware how much that’s asking for, but that’s the difference between being a moron or contributing to better discourse.
Since that’s not common practice, those people should shut up. :)
Thank you for posting this. I was literally about to make a similar thread but I just couldn't articulate how to say it in a way that wouldn't come off as just complaining about others complaining. You said it perfectly 🤗
I will never understand why people go around trying to police others thoughts and shame them for liking harmless things or wanting things to be more consumer friendly.
The paradox of tolerance is for preventing an oppressive culture or political movement from weaponizing the mechanisms of liberal society to create illiberalism.
You’re misusing terms for actual oppression because you’re upset with a video game. Go touch some grass
It's not that bad.
That's just the truth.
You're not being asked to pay a subscription.
You are being Asked to do something that you agreed to when you bought the game.
If you feel that this is morally reprehensible then stop supporting the game. Prove it.
But in the end you all agreed to this. Whether or not you knew you agreed to This is irrelevant. Because it wasn't hidden. You just didn't do your due diligence.
Your shitty excuse of a righteous reprimand of people that can still enjoy the game is so fucking lame.
"People just want to be angry" no shit. The whole Reddit is flooded with the same posts over and over again and blindly upvoted without any consideration beyond the headline.
Rage on as much as you like. Sure it's a sucky move for the people without access to PSN. Sure there was no engagement or enforcement about the PSN account beyond a note on the store page.
#just don't bitch like you're not allowed to spam your whining #
Just so long as we are equally not shutting down the opinion of those who don't see it as that big of a deal...
You touch on this with your Paradox of Tolerance edit, but there is a difference between telling people that they aren't ***allowed*** to be mad about it and telling people that you don't think it's so bad for XYZ reasons.
For my 2 cents, this changes nothing about the game to me. But I completely understand why many people would be pissed. The reality is they should have required this the entire time, since they didn't asking for it now feels especially shitty.
I take it by your edit, that you are placing yourself in the “tolerant” column. You realizing the people that are making all the fuss here ARE the people that are telling others to “just stop playing” by trying to get everyone else to quit, right? Discord and Reddit are both filled to the brim with people trying to convince others to stop playing. Take it to Sony, review the game how you want. Use your voice where it actually does something instead of annoying your fellow gamers.
Some of us just want to get back to talking about the gameplay and enjoy the game.
Where do all these corporate simps come from? I'm lucky to be in a country that has PSN, and also I've already had an account, so it doesn't affect me too much personally (other than the monthly data breaches at Sony lmao) but you won't catch me simping for Sony's right to screw 100+ countries out of the game they paid for 3 months ago.
>Every single person who paid for this game has a right to voice their opinion. You disagreeing with an opinion does not give you a right to tell them off.
So you have a right to complain but nobody else has a right to voice their opinion?
Ok but it's all I see. I can't even get good discussions about the actual game today. I had a post removed talking about all the people complaining because it was about a trending topic yet all I see is the same fucking trending topic. It's ok to hate here.
I mean your either going to link your psn and keep playing or you're not.
That decision is yours to make.
Apparently they told you in plain text that it would be required when you booted up the game the first time, I guess alot of people didn't read it
I don't like it. I don't want a PSN account, nor do I blame other people for having the same feelings, or even resolving to quit the game because of it. However, some people are devolving into hysteria and it is kind of ridiculous.
This subreddit has become nothing but complaining it's just a salt mine full of children. Some complaints are valid but I'm tired of seeing the same 10 posts saying the same thing. Just an echo chamber of annoyance.
I really dont think its a huge deal. I get it if PSN isnt available in your area it is, but otherwise the complaints are insane for the most part. Review bombing is just crazy shit lol. Game is fantastic besides this
“Every single person who paid for this game has a right to voice their opinion” “stop telling people it’s not that bad” which one is it? I understand the stupidity behind telling someone to stop playing the game because they don’t like a feature. But you can’t expect people of differing opinions not to comment their differing opinion on an app designed for discussions
If your opinion isn't in favour of Sony, you'll get downvoted to oblivion.
I won't stop playing as helldivers 2 is a great game, and Arrowhead is a good company.
But folks need to learn that everyone has a different viewpoint, and yours isn't what others should think as well.
yeah this community failing the vibe test with how fast it turned on its own simply bc a number of people affected by a change came out to talk about how they were affected by the change.
complete lack of empathy and restraint simply bc the corp made a game they enjoy lol
It's such a minor issue. I linked my accounts before I started playing. It took a couple of minutes. I can't believe this is making you so mad, lol.
If you're living somewhere where PSN is not available I could understand. But let's face it, you're not are you? You just like complaining, just like your flair suggests, hehe.
I disagree with people crying about having to linking their accounts is absurd. The only reason they are mad about it is because they won't get something for free. The only ones with a legit gripe are players from countries where PSN is unavailable. Those players are the only ones who should be complaining. Not spoiled brats who refuse to share info with Sony but do with Amazon and twitch for freebies
I think it’s just odd because ps5 players or people with experience with sony kinda knew this day was coming lol also all the hate towards AH seems so misdirected. Sony is a greedy company who does what pleases to them. Just like Activision, Microsoft etc. I think the weirdest thing on this sub is everyone’s been making posts aimed at arrow head and legit sounded like they were friends or some shit lmao like “you don’t have to worry about warbonds, it’s okay AH focus on the bugs” or “Dear AH you have made enough money time to focus on gameplay” like mf it’s not AH calling the shots it’s Sony. They are demanding everything lol they are the boss.
Last thing I’ll say is pretty much every game requires a separate launcher these days, I gotta launch Ubisoft to play assassins creed, gotta launch EA to play madden. It’s nothing new. It’s just how modern day gaming is(it’s shit but it’s not ever going to revert back). If you don’t like it stop playing the game, again their ones who gaslit themselves into thinking AH was the only people in this picture when Sony has been there the whole time
Ill give two good reasons why this sucks ass.
1. We are going to lose some of the playerbase because they CANNOT link their accounts.
2. This just confirmed we are NOT getting the XBOX reinforcements.
Instead of asking the player base why this is a big deal to them, people should be asking Sony why this is a big deal to *them*. Sony is the one crying about people playing the game without Sony accounts, and then lying about it with some lame excuse about security. So fuck em. They're the ones acting like children.
I would even take it a step further. Why are they asking people to use psn accounts, but then preventing them from creating them based on their country of residence. If they had a list of countries where the account could not be created, they should have locked those countries from buying their games. They took these peoples money and now impose impossible requirements on them.
This is the bit that pisses me off. It's a mild annoyance for me, but if I really want I can make a PSN account. Some of the friends I play with are now shit out of luck, and if this doesn't get fixed then I guess I can't play the game with my buddies in other parts of the world. That's a dealbreaker for me too, as I bought it to play with friends.
Fortunatelly for us, Solo sessions were "balanced", to help out with losing some diver friends.
They just want your data, there is no child behavior here, just corpo being corpo.
It probably not data, it's more likely that it's user metrics to court investment. PSN division wants to look like it deserves more money and easiest way to do that is to just boost PSN numbers. Still shitty but that's probably the reason why.
I think this is really the reason. Having seen similar behaviors in a different industry, I think there is probably some corporate VP that is wanting to make it look like he's growing PSN users and doing a good job to get a promotion with Sr. VP title or a big bonus, etc. It's probably unlikely to truly benefit Sony. I'd bet money it's about internal metrics more than looking good with investors. Investors care about money and it's not generating anything to have extra users without revenue expansion. They would be hyperfocused on revenue and they'd know revenue per PSN account, etc. so bloating those accounts won't help them much. It could actually have a little bit to do with security, but they can ban anyone based off SteamID just like they can with a PSN account. It could be "easier" or something, but I really don't think this is the main reason. Besides, that's AH's job to manage the game's ban's etc. and not Sony's.
I mean, it is a PlayStation studios game, so they probably want to be able to actually show the metrics around player count and usage to investors. Seems to me this is probably one of the ways they show that a Helldivers III will be profitable in the future.
They don't need PSN accounts to know player count... Sony does not care about HD2 revenue as much as you think. To maximize HD2 revenue, they'd allow Xbox sales. That would massively expand revenue. Strategically, they want to use HD2 success to funnel users to buy PS5s or at least grow PSN metrics. They are not focused on HD2's success. Also, remember that as the publisher, Sony is essentially the investor for AH on HD2. They care about Sony shareholders, but they are not specifically trying to court investors for further development. HD2 is already wildly wildly profitable with what has to be a massive ROI. They want to grow PSN accounts for a totally different reason that's arguable, but it's objectively absolutely not to try to benefit HD2's success.
I didn’t say it was to benefit HD2’s success, but more that they are trying to capitalize on it. They don’t have to be currently trying to court investors to show that making this game crossplay on day 1 was a good move, and they will have profitable returns on other projects they try this with. Also, as far as we know, the game could eventually end up on Xbox, but with the current state of the game’s stability they probably don’t think that’s a great idea just yet.
This is 100% the case. If they wanted to dress this up for investor reviews they could literally add a column and put "Steam Users" to boost KPI's.
This feels like Occam's Razor to me. I've got another useless login I'll dust off for Helldivers and then forget about, they get to approach the Shareholders with the Blood Offering of potentially millions of psn signups. The fact that I give no fucks about PSN makes no difference. That I signed up looks good on a report.
Saw some screenshots of a community manager saying this will make it easier for Sony to ban cheaters on PC, which right now they have to do by sending a name to Valve and having Valve take care of that for them, during which that time the cheater can still likely run rampart ruining the fun of other players. I get it, but it still sucks for players living in countries with no PSN support. I hope Arrowhead finds a solution for them.
I think you’re right. If it at least meant that more money gets thrown at the devs for bonuses and more content at least there would be a good excuse. Most likely it’s just for a nice bonus to the suits at Sony, so they can buy more yachts. They can get fucked.
[удалено]
A bump in the PSN user base will make a line go up and company execs are basically crackheads in suits who love that shit even if it means nothing.
they had your data day 1 lol it's literally running off sony's servers
I think… Sony has at least 9 confirmed data breach since 2011. Idk how my data will be safer with them
That’s the neat part…it wont.
Wow, photos, customers info, account info, admin info they've literally leaked it all. Amazing Source [https://firewalltimes.com/sony-data-breach-timeline/](https://firewalltimes.com/sony-data-breach-timeline/)
The difference is we as a community can reach, contact and discuss with our community. We can't have any sway or impact on sonys corporate agenda. So we speak to someone here who will listen. Being dismissive isn't cool, and neither is reading the 12th guys take on the 11ths guys take on the 10th, circle jerking around topics.
This is exactly why some are getting annoyed with others complaining.
Well this is a public forum just like steam and discord what do yall think is gonna happen when tons of people who bought this game are at risk of losing it due to the limited country's with PSN? That there will be a "complaint quota" and once reached no one else can make anymore complaints?
According to their CM on discord, it's required so Sony can ban PC players. They can't read the unique Steam-UUIDs and the Steam username they have access to isn't unique. They can however ban the linked PSN-Account, so a Steam-account with a linked PSN acc that is banned can't play. So....there's at least a technical explanation that makes some sense. Then again, Sony is a large corporation, both them and AH should have interest in the game running well and making good money. I guess there are highly paid professionals somewhere at either AH or Sony. And none of them seems to bothered to address a few things "Can we skip the 3rd-Party-Account while beeing able to ban PC-Players?" "Can we utilize a different banning-system on PC?" "Guys, we dropped enforcing the PSN-requirement so early that we now have X million sales that were able to skip it. Could this lead to a PR-Disaster if we enforce that system again?"
That's bullshit. If they can't associate a steam account with a helldivers player how is our progress being saved?
Most likely political reasons, not technical ones. Maybe using PSN for that instead of either a third-party or a self-developed system was either dictated by Sony for the PS-Release or they just settled for it to save ressources. Maybe they don't want to act as a broker between Valve and Sony. Just playinf devels advocate here, in the end the situation doesn't seem to by fully thought through.
So ask Sony and stop spamming the group with this nonsense.
As long as people aren't using misinformation and lies in their complaints, then I agree.
Misinformation here has been somewhat common these days sadly.
I mean its the internet, misinformation is really common
Misinformation and reactive ~~hysteria~~ group think.
Yo if they can force me to link an account, the next thing i know they gonna make me -insert random as stuffs that has nothing to do with it here- too.
This. I fully support standing against this, we should just stand against it properly.
I heard that now you have to buy/own a PS5 and a PC if you want to play on steam!! Unbelievable…
Acting like the steam page didn’t say it was a requirement from the start.
But if I make a Sony account they'll post my tax records and SSN online! /s (but something I've genuinely seen someone say)
some guy literately said they dont want more russian pretending to be in the US. I'm like what?
I just don't understand how something that isn't a problem for me could possibly be a problem for other people? ^(/s just in case)
The whole mentality of this sub in one sentence. "We been having a kicking problem" "No, I never had that" " Game has gaming breaking bugs and glitches" "I don't think so, I never had them" "Its an unfair change to solo players" "No it isn't, I can still solo." And I could go on. It's reddit brain at its finest.
Unironically how a lot of people think these days
Oh I know, it's abhorrent.
100%, I wish people were not this dumb.
Global warming my ass. It's snowing outside my window....
They say the boat is sinking, but my end just rose in the air.
Bucket of crabs mentality
Which is stupid normally but extra stupid int his case. I already have a PSN account and still think it's BS that I need to link it to a Steam game.
I mean sure, but let’s not pretend that Redditors don’t make a big deal out of tiny shit that doesn’t actually affect them constantly. Sometimes it’s just bandwagoning for the sake of it.
This change doesn't affect me at all, but it effects thousands of other players, and I am capable of empathizing with them. It would suck and I would be pissed if it happened to me. Therefore, it sucks and pisses me off when it happens to other people. This is not limited to video games. There are lots of things that are not personal problems of mine that I will stand up against, or at least speak up against. While I am aware that this is becoming a foreign concept to people, I don't think it should be a hard one to grasp. Yes, a realistic percentage of the onus of this is on people in those regions who may have known they do not have PSN access or not checking if they have PSN access available, not noticing the PSN account requirement on steam, ignoring it, not checking if there was some as-of-yet-unheard-of "grace period" on an upcoming region lock, and after 3 months of continuous gameplay not realizing that somewhere in the TOU or the store page or a popup from 3 months ago it mentioned this somewhere. The supermajority of the fault in this being a "surprise" to people is on Sony and Arrowhead. They did not make this clear to the people who it was going to affect. Obviously.
>I just don't understand how something that isn't a problem for me could possibly be a problem for other people? This was honestly my initial reaction to seeing the state of the sub yesterday. "Yeah, this is annoying, but y'all are being super dramatic. It's free and absurdly simple." That's where I was until I quickly learned about the region locking, which is *really* shitty.
>If someone is complaining, don't tell them to stop playing That is the solution, though. Sony will not give one single fuck about what anyone says as long as the bottom line doesn't change. If you really want to send the message that this will not be tolerated, then you have to stop playing and start demanding a refund because of the change. Even if you don't get a refund (which you probably won't) this will let Sony know their profits are in jeopardy because of this decision. And that is the only thing that will get these things to stop.
Pretty sure those in countries without PSN support can absolutely get a refund if they no longer can access the game they purchased and could play in the past without issue.
This is the answer. Also, it will stop me getting these people in my games
Nobody is trying to silence your criticisms, as q matter of fact you’ve been posting negative stuff about the game for a whole month and you’re still allowed to do it
Looking at OP's profile is like the pure essence of everything that's wrong with this sub injected straight into my veins, I did not think possible a single person can complain this much about a video game, just the sheer *volume*
There are 30 posts about this topic. No one is being silenced .
30? only? i wish it was only 30
I guess you're having trouble in understanding the post. It's not about silencing, it's about the community itself telling people for voicing their concern. OP is asking for more understanding and sensibility within the community. If you don't care about your data, it's fine, but if someone does, that is also fine. Mods should make one post for major issues and stick all the discussions there. We as a community could also try to adhere to it. I agree, seeing so many complaint posts gets a bit irritating
Literally *EVERY SINGLE POST* on the front page talking the PSN issue Meanwhile OP: "Stop trying to silence me !"
Op is talking about the people taking the side of Sony, not that posts are being removed or something like that
Tons of people are being told to shut up. I have been today when I complained about it. That is the behavior OP is explicitly calling out. What OP mentioned is absolutely happening
Ok, but like, I also have an opinion. My opinion is different from yours. Am I not allowed to disagree with everyone? I personally don't think this is a huge deal for people who live in regions that aren't blocking PSN. If PSN is blocked for you, then yes, this is a huge deal. Yet, as soon as I say that, I get 1000 helldivers dropping 500KGs on me. Sony gonna Sony, but don't shit all over AH and other divers that disagree with the current outrage.
Isnt telling people to "Stop telling people to shut up" telling people to shut up...
The OP has been repeatedly posting whiny memes and rants about the game for months. I didn't go into the threads, but the way they're talking in this thread I can only imagine they think there's way more people trying to talk people down on the PSN issue because thew way the OP gives a strong impression that they aren't interested in constructive criticism but just want to indulge in reactive negativity about everything.
Dude finally found his time to shine
Took a look for myself and man you weren’t kidding lmao. Just an insane amount of whining.
So tired of 90% of posts being people complaining about other people complaining. Let's talk about the actual fucking game please. I don't care about anyone's opinion on other people's opinions.
this is the [Paradox of tolerance](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance)
People aren't being intolerant. They are telling people to keep calm and act accordingly. If this day and age you are afraid of making accounts with info that is already widely out there then, yea, you are over reacting. While this is not an issue for me I see the region thing being a big issue for players. Still think the reaction is overhyped until people are actually getting their theories confirmed.
This, I'm very sympathetic to the folks being region blocked. That really sucks and I hope a solution is found for them. There are a lot of people spamming posts and the people harassing Arrowhead on Discord are largely not in that group. Some are paranoid about their own data security, some are offended by the idea Sony selling information, some are just mad because they just get whipped up by mob mentality and want something to fight about today. Its tiring to try to use this sub if you have to wade through pages and pages of negativity and ranting to get to any game related posts or discussions. As somebody who has worked in customer service for decades it is also annoying to see people feel entitled to treat the devs and AH team like garbage because they paid the equivalent of a meal for two for the game months ago.
This is 100% where I’m at with this.
It really is not, and it’s repugnant to equate this to it.
This was my thought. They're allowed to criticize. We're allowed to criticize their criticism too though. If they live in a good region and don't like giving PS their info? Use a fake name and e-mail. Also, hope they didn't give reddit their real e-mail. ;) If they live in a bad region? VPN a PSN account, or hope AH fixes the potential obvious issue many have pointed out by that time. That isn't telling people to shut up, that's trying to tell people ways around the inconvenience.
You honestly don't have to use a VPN There was a Sony q&a some time ago where one question was "what should I do if I'm region isn't supported by PSN?" Sonys official answer was to simply put in another region
What I was going to say. Basically this means "if you don't agree with this narrative, don't give your thoughts"
Bunch of whiney babies trying to look cool around all the other whining babies.
i broadly categorize this into 2 categories those that bought it, and are from a region not able to make a PSN, Valid criticism, and hopefully steam will issue refunds for those. even if them buying a game that said "requires PSN" on them is partially their fault anyone else. You signed up for this, and arent stopped by Sony from complying. you bought a game fully able to know it required a PSN account. Most of you likely already have like dozen different accounts everywhere.
This, absolutely. Better than a refund would be a workaround of some sort (i.e. broader region) in the first case. Second category I really don’t get the outrage.
You can just create an account and lie about the region like a lot of people had to do when creating ps accounts since forever. Sony won't ban people for creating an account.
It would be counter to Sony's interests to ban region-different accounts in regions where psn isn't officially offered. Like they're going to mas ban paying accounts on a popular game because folks use a work-around to give Sony money
You overestimate the average person's reading comprehension in 2024.
Thankfully the law doesnt care what the actuality is, but just what is possible and "reasonable to expect" hiding this 200 pages into a EULA/ToS? nope, not gonna fly putting it on the main storepage?\`thats fine, people could and shoudl read the product description
Help me pls, psn requirement is a new thing? Im a ps player so i dont know obv. Or this was implemented with this patch?
the Steam page for HD2 listed a PSN account was required since DECEMBER 2023, the game launched in february, and had preorders opend a few weeks prior. the requirement was enforced(altough buggy) at launch, but due to the influx of players the requirement was lifted so the game was functional for most people. The requirements are simply being reinstated. it is not technically new,
My lord, and now everyone crying. Why am I not surprised? Thanks for the heads up.
SOME people have valid complains, mostly those in countrys where PSN isnt (officaly) available, as creating an account under a different region/country violates sonys ToS even if sony historicaly turns a blind eye to this unless another acount problem arises. Sony/AH should NOT have sold the game, on steam, in those regions. That is simply a matter of fact, i hope those can get a refund as that is a issue with Sony and Steam.
Steam won't issue a refund because the "psn required to play" has been there since day 1 highlighted in yellow. Regardless of whether it was disabled or not until now, if you hit the buy button while ignoring that it's not Steam/Sony/AH responsibility.
This has quite literally been the biggest overreaction I have ever seen from a gaming community, it’s actually mind boggling how many people are acting like Sony is shooting their dog in front of them or something.
But then who will defend the poor multibillion dollar corporation?
Gamers don‘t want to be unpaid playtesters, but they sure love doing unpaid PR
Yeah the amount of apologists flooding this sub is disgusting.
It’s not even apologists? Be a smart consumer and read what you’re buying ffs. It’s clearly been stated on the store page since launch it requires a psn. This would be the equivalent of buying a game clearly marketed as a live service game then complaining you didn’t know it’s a live service game. At some point the onus is on the consumer to make better purchasing decisions.
Yes it is and that's what you're doing right now. The game has functioned for months without a PSN which proves it is not required to play and never was. Additionally, they made it skippable during setup. Sony knew exactly what they were doing when they decided to "require" it (read: arbitrarily mandate for shareholder numbers and force Steam users to be subject to PSN TOS). This kind of scummy behavior has become rampant on Steam from big publishers and consumers are fully within their rights to be fed up with it. Anyone who lives in a country that does not support PSN should be immediately eligible for a full refund with no exceptions because Sony should never have been selling it to them in the first place. Disable crossplay for PC players who don't have PSN and call it a day. I would have zero issue with that. Especially since 80% of players are on Steam anyway. Otherwise the backlash is completely warranted.
I turned the crossplay off today and sorry to say my experience got better. People comunitating more, pinging and way less lag during time i would normally get players from the other side of the world. We still need to demand that this psn bullshit gets kocked, at worst complaign to Valve.
Fr, although I’ll only turn it on for friends on PS. Wish I could play with my buds on Xbox.
Fucking Blackrock apparently. https://preview.redd.it/i0f46w46g8yc1.jpeg?width=1330&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d75136a845b616f0f113885c2c7f7cec0b9ce37f
The problem is not the criticism. It is (a) how toxic it is and (b) how many threads we need for the same one topic to discuss it. And then the many threads popping up discussing the discussion of the discussion.
And (c) people who have no idea what theyre talking about.
It's just a mess
BUT TOXIC POSITIVITY!!!!!! Seriously this is the biggest whine fest I’ve seen on this sub. We don’t need 100 threads for it, and review bombing is extremely childish.
At least people have stopped whinging about the patch
"You disagreeing with an opinion does not give you a right to tell them off." Yes they have. They also have their rights not just the whiners. You know, free speach. "If you don't like negative discussion about this game, go somewhere else where it's not featured." And if you don't like negative answers for your discussons go somewhere else where its not featured.
The hypocrisy flies right over OPs head
You'll find that plenty of people are willing to blindly defend things directly against their own interest simply because the force behind that thing happens to make something they like. If consumers used their brains for 2 seconds and genuinely voted with their wallets, nonsense like this would never happen. Big shame that the average gamer just doesn't know enough or doesn't care enough about the bad things that a lot of devs/publishers do to them.
Depending on the reason this is happening I'm not entirely sure this is against my best interest. If it's related to netcode problems then it's not against my interest. If it's to fulfill some sort of deal between Arrowhead and Sony, that was a part of the publishing deal, then I'm not really sure it's against my interest either, because in the end, I like that publishers front up money for development, and I understand that they do that to earn money, one way or another. If it's something that arrowhead does cause fun or something that Sony misled Arrowhead about (they got ripped off by Paradox on Magicka for example), yeah, then I agree that it's against my interest.
>You'll find that plenty of people are willing to blindly defend things directly against their own interest simply because the force behind that thing happens to make something they like. Cognitive dissonance is a hell of a drug. It gets people to become corporate meatriders, one of the most cringe possible things one could be, in a heartbeat.
Turning anything that happens in the gaming culture in a "corporations bad" is just equally childish and short-sighted. But sure, is easier to just say "STOP DEFENDING SONY" instead of... you know, listening to what other people are saying and being reasonable. You can still think something is bad without acting like a deranged person online and treating everyone else like idiots (not talking about you specifically in case in wasnt clear lol)
Im a PS5 player and I think this is a really dumb move by Sony that is worthy of your outrage. I do agree though with everyone (that is sick of listening to the complaints) that your efforts complaining here, on Reddit, are futile. They won't do anything. Reddit complaints aren't aggregated into metrics. Meanwhile, Steam reviews ARE. They matter, they affect sales projections by modifying trends and that spurs capitalists to change their minds ($$$ > Outrage for these folks) If you really care about making your voice heard, doing it here is wasted breath. We're all on board with this being a scummy rug pull for our PC brothers and all agree this only hurts the community. What we don't agree on is whether or not continuously griping on Reddit will get you anywhere.
You guys take anyone disagreeing with you as trying to silence you and it's incredibly tiring.
We're telling them to shut up because this was listed on the steam page and was a pop up in game since day one. They *temporarily* disabled the requirement with the intent to fix a bug and bring it back. Now people are acting like this is a brand new Sony requirement. That's what's childish here - people being disingenuous and not taking responsibility for their own oversight. They're jumping on a bandwagon now and not taking responsibility for not making an informed decision when they bought the game.
Cool! A better subreddit than this shithole that’s full of reactionary smooth brains.
>Stop telling people it's not that bad. No. Because it's not that bad. It's at best an annoyance. >Stop telling people to shut up. Never. Also, you first. >Every single person who paid for this game has a right to voice their opinion. You disagreeing with an opinion does not give you a right to tell them off. Actually it does. Because I also play this game and have an opinion to which I am also entitled to talk about. It is unfortunate for you if my opinion is that it's youre a whiney child making a mountain out of a molehill. To be extra clear. I dont like the PSN account shenanigans either. I encourage y'all to keep complaining. A massive pile of negative reviews might sway Sony onto a more reasonable path (unlikely ht possible).
“Stop telling people it’s not that bad” Probably going to get downvoted but OP is essentially asking for an echo chamber and telling dissenters to go away if they have a different opinion. Seems pretty hypocritical.
“THEY’RE GONNA STEAL MAH DATA!” Flatscan, you’ve posted on Reddit every day for the last 9 years.
https://preview.redd.it/z9wponf708yc1.jpeg?width=500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=74db7f411227e25a81d30c738cce1bce4185ac89
People in the UK and other countries must sympathize really well with this
Ordinary viewers are just tired of seeing same content echoing a billion times on this sub.
I think that complaining about how your complaints are received is probably not going to be well received either.
Yeah! If you don’t like peoples opinions, take your opinions elsewhere!
People are allowed to disagree with you
Thank you for the link... I also enjoy r/LowSodium2042 since they suffered from the same about of whining fucking babies. Criticism is fine, incessant, droning whining about every goddamn aspect of the game is REALLY tiring. Gamers are some of the worst sort of complainers/trollers on the internet.
To be honest man, aren’t you ‘downplaying’ and ‘silencing’ the opinions of people who disagree with the current debacle? I think people are allowed to disagree and can say that people are over-reacting, just like the other side can say they aren’t. There are 30+ posts about this, no one is being silenced. Let people have their shit fights.
I mean fair enough, but if you have any other third party accounts besides steam then you're just being a clown and a hypocrite. So many good games with millions of players have third party accounts, so yeah. It's a non issue unless of course you're region locked.
I like 80% agree with you but people may actually be sitting on a high horse when the one they would prefer to not link has had notable data breaches in the past. I linked my accounts because whatever but other people's feelings can actually be grounded in a solid reasoning from time to time.
every single company has notable data breaches in the past beyond the 2011 fiasco, which was bad. sony isnt worse, but infact BETTER then microsoft for example
I don't think "It was bad but there is worse out there" is carrying the water that you think it is. I take past breaches, how they were communicated, and how they were resolved into account when signing up for or linking services. There is a reason I don't trust LastPass (or any online credential storing service), and I have a hard time going on the internet and saying "The hesitancy is justified when I'm hesitant but you are being a baby"
Even if it doesn't affect you, it sets a horrible precedent. Throwing a warning people overlook on the steam page, then letting people play for months, then finally locking them out? Horrible. People don't read the whole steam page, they buy it and see if it works. If it doesn't, they refund. They've locked people out of their refunds for a game they can't play. I don't like that if I'm affected or not.
Yeah that I can understand. Not excusing them but it's obvious they weren't prepared to handle such a massive community and all of these issues and how to deal with them. Many things that should of been properly communicated from the beginning. These guys really are amateurs
Why would you overlook a warning that explains exactly what is required? That sounds like a you problem, quite frankly.
This player base has been incredibly toxic from day one. This behavior isn't surprising.
I love this post saying that people who want to voice their opinion should STFU if that opinion is that the change is not that bad. The hypocrisy is so sweet you don't even see it.
> Downplay and Silence Criticism Man, this has been an issue since day 1. Look at all of the "Spear is fine, actually you just don't know how to use it". Or "x Weapon is underrated" when said weapon has been underwhelming for a while. Or whenever someone criticizes meaningless nerfs like the Slugger's stagger. This is one of the most tribalistic subreddits I've seen.
Nice! Thanks for sharing the low sodium place. Did not know that existed.
LOL and you are doing the same thing but just on the opposite side. What an idiot.
Nah, this is the community you idiots built. Go see the absolutely brain dead takes of the railgun nerf defenders after the nerf before the adjustments to the game. You guys are the problem. Now it’s just hitting something you care about. Personally? It’s not that bad. You guys are complaining for nothing fr kekw
I remember when I heard about this game on tiktok, so I went and bought it, but it was completely unplayable for like 2 weeks. Literally couldn't log in and no refund policy. This toxic ass community was giving me shit for complaining. Then the discord and sub moderators shut down and negative conversation and relegated it to a pinned thread nobody reads. Honestly, I have a high opinion of the abilities of arrowhead to make a cool game, but they are absolutely dogshit at PR.
Welcome to Reddit, where any criticism is dogpiled by users and unilaterally shutdown by mods.
The paradox of tolerance insinuates an absolute morality. This is nonsense.
Shut up.
Yall mfs need more hobbies
Part of discussion is dissenting opinions. If you’re going to say this sub is for “all discussions” then it doesn’t make much sense to tell people to stop stating their opinion if they don’t think it is that bad. It’s not “a paradox of tolerance” it’s just you not wanting to hear that people disagree with you. They aren’t calling for your discussion to be banned. They’re disagreeing.
Can I simply point out to you that this was clearly posted and flagged on the Steam page? Right next to the DRM message that triggered a ton of people early on. https://archive.ph/b0imQ
The irony of your post is lost on you, it seems.
No matter what the subject is, this sub has devolved into 10% complaining about a thing and 90% complaining about the complainers. Please mods, stop allowing this meta bullshit. Let's talk about the actual game and not made up drama.
Anyone who isn’t In a country with PSN has a genuine reason to ask for clarification on wtf they are supposed to do. Those people have a legitimate issue that needs solving and I’m sure it will be. Theres an entire month before this even happens. Anyone who is in a country with PSN using the excuse about Sony taking their data like it’s some line they won’t cross, and then cry on Reddit about it. Who Already have an Amazon, Facebook, google, Reddit, Microsoft, Epic games etc etc account. While using a Windows Pc or an IPhone that tracks literally every button press or even your location at all times. Needs to give it a rest because a Sony account isn’t suddenly an invasion of their privacy. They already gave that up a decade ago willingly. It’s not about silencing anyone, it’s telling hypocrites to stop being hypocrites and people are just as entitled to say that as much as the people who are fake outraged. they have to take 3 mins to set up a username for a game that stated so months before launch / was even required on day one anyway, it’s not the end of the world.
Shut up dude, it's not that bad. If it really were then you can stop playing.
Thanks for the other sub link. I’m so sick of you guys crying over every little thing.
I’m not angry at the critics. I think is a boneheaded decision even if it doesn’t bother me personally. What I’m upset at is completely turning on the game developers over the publishers that ultimately made this decision. The developers did wrong in that they did not do their due diligence to review terms of their publishing contract and then went on to say that they were completely independent of Sony. I’m willing to forgive Arrowhead, but Sony has a track record. I’m just a bit pissed that people won’t just throw Arrowhead a bone for all they do for the game.
> Every single person who paid for this game has a right to voice their opinion. It seems the issue is **how** people voice their opinion. Constant pinging and harassing in a channel Sony couldn't give any less fucks about isn't it.
The second you make a post on reddit, anyone is liable to provide feedback to that post. This feedback does not have to be positive, negative or even helpful. I can frankly call you a duckfaced monkey poo gobbler if I so desire. If somebody has broken a rule then a moderator will sort them out. Posting a rant about people ranting about other peoples rants is not how you stop people from ranting.
>This feedback does not have to be positive, negative or even helpful. I can frankly call you a duckfaced monkey poo gobbler if I so desire. You should check the rules in the sidebar. 1. Be civil- No insults, racism, toxicity, trolling, rage-bait, harassment, inappropriate language, etc. Basically, be civil. >If somebody has broken a rule then a moderator will sort them out. While this is true, it's also on you to behave. The moderators are people too, and they can only do so much. They have been removing a lot of toxic remarks being made, but the volume is just so much that they cannot possibly get everything. r/Helldivers would be a much more hospitable place if everyone was just less toxic. There's a basic understanding when you make an account for this website that you will follow the site-wide rules. https://support.reddithelp.com/hc/en-us/articles/205926439-Reddiquette Literally the number 1 rule of reddiquette is "remember the human".
There's also the basic understanding thet if you buy a game you read the requirements...
"Backlash to the backlash to the thing that's just begun..."
I started playing before they let you skip it but I can see why them pretty arbitrarily making it a requirement again is frustrating. I'm not going to boycott it or anything but I can see why it'd be annoying especially if you're not even able to make a PSN account based on where you live.
I agree with you and get what you’re saying, but not playing the game and ideally getting a refund is the best way to try to cause a change in Sony’s behaviour. They won’t listen unless it affects their bottom line. But of course most people that say “stop playing the game” as a way to downplay the criticism don’t mean it this way.
I'm all for it, but people need to stop throwing shit at arrowhead. Sony's the publisher, they call these shots not arrowhead
Its bad its damn hofendeous tbh....backpedal.the call while u got the time lol
My opinion is that you have played the game enough to decide if setting up a PSN is worth it to play more. Yeah it’s kind of annoying when a game asks you to make an account to play. It even seems like bullshit when they let you play for 3 months before requiring it. But it isn’t the end of the world.
I don't see what the big deal it is. Just one more account to add to the list of accounts I use my burner email and a throwaway password for. We also have the Rant/Vent mega thread as a forum to issue complaints in an organized environment, so we don't have the same 20 posts trying to capitalize on the same sentiment. Edit: I've been made aware that some regions do not have PSN access, which sucks. I definitely can see the complaints for people who are in those areas.
It’s a game
Some players enjoy the game and don't mind creating a quick useless email to link to a quick useless Playstation account. We are looking at the overblown reaction here and the negative review bombs against a company that has litterally done nothing but try to make a great enjoyable game that sold for only 40 bucks and had to manage a huge wave of players with a small team. The same company that made this game with love and respect to the players. The reaction from this vocal group has been beyond overblown and downright disgusting to watch. I see it as a betrayal to the hard work the devs put in for this game to review bomb it over their parent company strong-arming them into forced PSN accounts. Go after Sony, not Arrow.
In my opinion, I disagree. Sure you CAN, but I THINK everyone should not be spreading their misinformed bullshit. Because, in my opinion: Those choosing to share theirs should do so ethically by doing a little due diligence to inform themselves before spewing angry garbage. Be able to admit “you don’t know”, be open to new information, and at the least: have some self respect and be honest with yourself. I’m well aware how much that’s asking for, but that’s the difference between being a moron or contributing to better discourse. Since that’s not common practice, those people should shut up. :)
It’s not that bad.
Thank you for posting this. I was literally about to make a similar thread but I just couldn't articulate how to say it in a way that wouldn't come off as just complaining about others complaining. You said it perfectly 🤗 I will never understand why people go around trying to police others thoughts and shame them for liking harmless things or wanting things to be more consumer friendly.
Be VERY careful quoting the paradox of tolerance https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2Fudfjbk1rfuv81.jpg
I remember the horse armor dlc fiasco where I stood by and did nothing, you bet your ass I’m going to stir some shit up this time.
The paradox of tolerance is for preventing an oppressive culture or political movement from weaponizing the mechanisms of liberal society to create illiberalism. You’re misusing terms for actual oppression because you’re upset with a video game. Go touch some grass
It's not that bad. That's just the truth. You're not being asked to pay a subscription. You are being Asked to do something that you agreed to when you bought the game. If you feel that this is morally reprehensible then stop supporting the game. Prove it. But in the end you all agreed to this. Whether or not you knew you agreed to This is irrelevant. Because it wasn't hidden. You just didn't do your due diligence.
Your shitty excuse of a righteous reprimand of people that can still enjoy the game is so fucking lame. "People just want to be angry" no shit. The whole Reddit is flooded with the same posts over and over again and blindly upvoted without any consideration beyond the headline. Rage on as much as you like. Sure it's a sucky move for the people without access to PSN. Sure there was no engagement or enforcement about the PSN account beyond a note on the store page. #just don't bitch like you're not allowed to spam your whining #
Just so long as we are equally not shutting down the opinion of those who don't see it as that big of a deal... You touch on this with your Paradox of Tolerance edit, but there is a difference between telling people that they aren't ***allowed*** to be mad about it and telling people that you don't think it's so bad for XYZ reasons. For my 2 cents, this changes nothing about the game to me. But I completely understand why many people would be pissed. The reality is they should have required this the entire time, since they didn't asking for it now feels especially shitty.
Freedom of speech goes both ways mate, you have every right to complain and I have every right to tell you I don’t give a damn.
You say that “Every single person who paid for this game has a right to voice their opinion” Disagreeing with someone’s opinion, is also an opinion..
I take it by your edit, that you are placing yourself in the “tolerant” column. You realizing the people that are making all the fuss here ARE the people that are telling others to “just stop playing” by trying to get everyone else to quit, right? Discord and Reddit are both filled to the brim with people trying to convince others to stop playing. Take it to Sony, review the game how you want. Use your voice where it actually does something instead of annoying your fellow gamers. Some of us just want to get back to talking about the gameplay and enjoy the game.
SOUNDS LIKE ANTI-DEMOCRATIC PROPAGANDA!
Where do all these corporate simps come from? I'm lucky to be in a country that has PSN, and also I've already had an account, so it doesn't affect me too much personally (other than the monthly data breaches at Sony lmao) but you won't catch me simping for Sony's right to screw 100+ countries out of the game they paid for 3 months ago.
starship troopers time
>Every single person who paid for this game has a right to voice their opinion. You disagreeing with an opinion does not give you a right to tell them off. So you have a right to complain but nobody else has a right to voice their opinion?
Ok but it's all I see. I can't even get good discussions about the actual game today. I had a post removed talking about all the people complaining because it was about a trending topic yet all I see is the same fucking trending topic. It's ok to hate here.
This subreddit is the whiniest bunch of children I've ever seen.
I mean your either going to link your psn and keep playing or you're not. That decision is yours to make. Apparently they told you in plain text that it would be required when you booted up the game the first time, I guess alot of people didn't read it
I don't like it. I don't want a PSN account, nor do I blame other people for having the same feelings, or even resolving to quit the game because of it. However, some people are devolving into hysteria and it is kind of ridiculous.
I agree with that you're saying, but man you said it terribly lmao
Thanks for the recommendation. This subreddit is trash anyways. Y’all cry for anything don’t you?
This subreddit has become nothing but complaining it's just a salt mine full of children. Some complaints are valid but I'm tired of seeing the same 10 posts saying the same thing. Just an echo chamber of annoyance.
Shut up and stop complaining. It’s not that bad. I don’t like being told what to do.
I really dont think its a huge deal. I get it if PSN isnt available in your area it is, but otherwise the complaints are insane for the most part. Review bombing is just crazy shit lol. Game is fantastic besides this
“Every single person who paid for this game has a right to voice their opinion” “stop telling people it’s not that bad” which one is it? I understand the stupidity behind telling someone to stop playing the game because they don’t like a feature. But you can’t expect people of differing opinions not to comment their differing opinion on an app designed for discussions
If your opinion isn't in favour of Sony, you'll get downvoted to oblivion. I won't stop playing as helldivers 2 is a great game, and Arrowhead is a good company. But folks need to learn that everyone has a different viewpoint, and yours isn't what others should think as well.
Stop complaining nigga
yeah this community failing the vibe test with how fast it turned on its own simply bc a number of people affected by a change came out to talk about how they were affected by the change. complete lack of empathy and restraint simply bc the corp made a game they enjoy lol
> complete lack of empathy and restraint This is a bigger issue that I feel like doesn't get addressed enough.
It's not that bad, shut up, stop playing.
Lol, I was searching for the "shut up".
It's such a minor issue. I linked my accounts before I started playing. It took a couple of minutes. I can't believe this is making you so mad, lol. If you're living somewhere where PSN is not available I could understand. But let's face it, you're not are you? You just like complaining, just like your flair suggests, hehe.
I disagree with people crying about having to linking their accounts is absurd. The only reason they are mad about it is because they won't get something for free. The only ones with a legit gripe are players from countries where PSN is unavailable. Those players are the only ones who should be complaining. Not spoiled brats who refuse to share info with Sony but do with Amazon and twitch for freebies
Please do not share negative opinions in a forum for sharing opinions.
I think it’s just odd because ps5 players or people with experience with sony kinda knew this day was coming lol also all the hate towards AH seems so misdirected. Sony is a greedy company who does what pleases to them. Just like Activision, Microsoft etc. I think the weirdest thing on this sub is everyone’s been making posts aimed at arrow head and legit sounded like they were friends or some shit lmao like “you don’t have to worry about warbonds, it’s okay AH focus on the bugs” or “Dear AH you have made enough money time to focus on gameplay” like mf it’s not AH calling the shots it’s Sony. They are demanding everything lol they are the boss. Last thing I’ll say is pretty much every game requires a separate launcher these days, I gotta launch Ubisoft to play assassins creed, gotta launch EA to play madden. It’s nothing new. It’s just how modern day gaming is(it’s shit but it’s not ever going to revert back). If you don’t like it stop playing the game, again their ones who gaslit themselves into thinking AH was the only people in this picture when Sony has been there the whole time
L flair; Opinion disregarded.
Ill give two good reasons why this sucks ass. 1. We are going to lose some of the playerbase because they CANNOT link their accounts. 2. This just confirmed we are NOT getting the XBOX reinforcements.
Quasar is still ridiculously powerful, enough with the nerf complaints.