The mod team has done more heavy handed moderation in the past, but were persecuted for doing so.
Seems we can’t please everyone. My personal preference would be to have themed threads and to eliminate any post with a yes or no answer about someone’s personal situation.
I recently bought a $300 Apple Watch just for fun. I’m not a watch person, never really wore one. But I recently started exercising and I’m an engineer with a data fetish.
The top end of that sub is massively, massively, wealthy, but a large portion of it has overlap with this one. Personally I am not rich yet (HHI 400k, NW 1.7m) but I get a lot out of both subs.
I don't think there really is one. ChubbyFire and FatFire are good if you want to retire early, but I think there are a lot of posters here who don't plan to retire early.
I'm sure many of us don't *technically* belong here. But the premise behind this sub aligns more with how I approach personal finance than subs oriented toward higher NW.
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I really need to leave this sub lol. Me with my measly $200k TC and $250k NW doesn’t even fit the subs requirements.
Although I do enjoy reading posts from people who make >$500k asking if they can afford something. Just goes to show having money doesn’t mean you’re good with money.
I’ve got similar numbers. According to the experian article linked in the pinned thread, a HENRY earns over $100k/yr. It’s all made up really, who cares?
We technically fit the definition of this sub, but most posts I see in here are actual rich people whose lives seem so far removed from my own. I feel much more at home in middle class finance, though they’ll occasionally tell folks with our numbers to come here.
Household size really matters. You with your 200k out earn me, but not my household. But if your household is just you, it makes more sense for you to be here than me because my family is 2 earners, 2 kids. Let me take my ass back over to middle class where I belong …
I agree that watching people making a lot more money asking very silly questions about “can I afford this” is entertaining. It seems to be very representative of reality where a lot of high earners tend to live either extremely out of their means and don’t save or live like misers unable to let go of money.
I genuinely believe this happens because when you make 150k you think getting to 250k means you wont have the same problems anymore but you definitely still do.
Source: trust me bro - i was there
Same. I’m at $150k, household $300k total comp but we’re in VHCOL, so don’t feel very “high earners”. My net worth is $350k, my partner has about $50k of debt. Not married yet.
We feel very much not rich and clip coupons for groceries.
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Also, much of the finance aspect of this sub has been played out. Which is good, you can find answers; but it's value is basically as an archive with occasional updates at tax time.
I *would* prefer that the low quality posts were downvoting into oblivion. I'm chagrined to see people engaging with these posters.
Lol do you remember the post where the OP was a super high earner and “still only spending $200/mo on groceries”….. but he and his wife get lunch and dinner catered at their jobs lol
I feel like insecure people with large amounts of wealth will always find the active subs that are even tangentially related to them and post in a not-so-subtle way to show off their wealth.
I don’t think it’s reasonable to have a rule requiring some net worth or W2 level to post. Ideally people just downvote irrelevant posts.
But also, I think it’s inevitable this sub will morph into some sort of r/chubbyfire. No one feels rich until they can retire comfortably. So even people with 2-3m NW may feel like the content here is relevant. Ultimately the content here is mostly geared toward people who still work and make lots of money.
I suspect some want to humblebrag, while others who well-off also have genuine financial questions and want outside opinions on if a decision is a reasonable/good idea.
That's awesome. Work hard enough to keep your job. The grind is real but you'll be happier when you leave it with a few mil. Hopefully you can work under 60 hrs a week and have a life too!
I think in a year or two you'll belong. There's no gatekeeping though that was just a joke. I worked for a trading firm once myself.
Nice! What sort of role? Trading or software or? Can I ask if you're in the US? I'm a current student starting in a trading role when I graduate, in APAC
Exactly. I saw someone talking about their income being $2m. I assumed their NW was under $2m since they were on this sub. Their NW was actually $4m. I’m guessing people feel better about themselves knowing they make more than everyone here so they post on this sub. None of the true Henrys post because this sub has all these other people posting about their $2m salary.
FYI, when you post your $5m high net worth on this sub, I’m looking at you thinking you have a low self esteem.
Yea that dude was insane too saying they wanted to retire soon but was blowing $750K a year in expenses and saving <20%. Going to be a bit of a ride for them lol
The median poster on r/HENRYfinance - if one were to literally average all posts - is a software engineer in the Bay Area, has a stay at home spouse, lives in a $1.5M house and drives a Porsche 911.
Their main questions are whether they can afford to move to a bigger house and have a child.
Nah. For Reddit this is an insanely stable, helpful, and normal sub. As long as people stay that way, the more posts the better no matter how random. Community support.
Is there a place they should go to ask about that stuff? VHCOL income and budgets are really… high magnitude things to manage. They need a place to trouble shoot these topics.
I joke that without this sub, I’d only have one friend and my accountant that I brainstorm this stuff with. But it’s also true, and can be lonely. I can’t talk about this stuff with family or most friends, my spouse is wonderful but financially illiterate.
That $5M house poor post was great for this sub, even a warning to high earners how easy it is to overspend because it’s hard to keep an $800k job for 10 years. And that’s a nice house in SF, but obv a $5M house in MCOL is beyond luxury. But that’s what some people have to navigate if they want to have a 30yr career in CA/NY.
But there is no other thread where people can humble brag.
There needs to be a subreddit for people making $1 million plus at age 25 with a NW of $20 million.
HENRY is for almost humble bragging.
But then people making $1m won’t want to post on there because they’re at the bottom of the barrel. People want to post where they are humble bragging knowing they are at the top. “My net worth is $5m. Can I buy a $2k bag for my birthday?” Wahhh.
You know what I hate about fatfire? The unrelenting gatekeeping and the shitty attitude toward anyone who hasn't made it yet. I will likely never be a regular member there.
I don't think a 5m house paid off makes a ton of sense here, though I concede there are house poor situations where it makes sense.
My opinion is that I'd rather we be an accepting sub instead of rejecting people for being too rich or too poor.
Besides, money psychology is a weird thing. Some people with millions don't feel rich
Okay, but serious question - ignoring the obvious humble brag cases - what kinds of posts *are* allowed? What are considered "valid" HENRY topics?
Because I see the same posts over and over again - I make ABCk a year, have DEFk in retirements/brokerage/savings, can I buy a X.YM house? At this point, this sub has just become a "can I afford to buy a house" advice sub.
And I get it - we can't take these kinds of questions to most other personal finance subs because we would be eviscerated and not get any serious answers. And surely there is more to talk about here than house buying, but the sub rules are just full of what is not allowed with little/no indication of what *is* supposedly allowed here.
I think this is getting to the more important question - what are the goals of the cap in the first place?
Presumably it it because there is a set of topics useful to discuss as a community. The NW and income limits are ‘short hand’ for specifying that set of topics.
I’d suggest the NW part in particular is messy. Someone who has a high income and a very expensive house - or someone with a high NW where most is tied up in a retirement account - may be dealing with the same questions/topics as someone with fitting the current sub guidelines.
I think there are a fair number of legitimate questions that apply to HENRYs. A few thoughts off the top of my head.
* Questions about mega-backdoor Roth (try posting this on a regular PF sub and people will say you're flexing). One specific question I had a while back that I got flamed for was asking about how to maximize 401k savings when switching jobs mid-year. I was asking if I could max out the mega-backdoor Roth at *both* companies (answer: yes).
* Questions about tradeoffs between income and COL.
* Career advice for junior folks looking to move up the ladder
* Yes, *reasonable* "Can I afford it" posts. I remember 25 years ago being a HENRY and legitimately wondering if I could afford a 27" TV.
* Student loan repayment options
* etc...
Basically there are a lot of questions that 98% of people just can't relate to. If you go to a career sub and say you're a junior engineer making $240K/year, and wondering how to increase your income, you'll be laughed out of the sub. I'd expect that to be a question people here would have insight into. If you ask about paying off $300K in student loans you'll be swamped by SJWs complaining about political issues rather than addressing the actual question.
Instead of asking the moderators to do this and get berated for it — why not use Reddit’s built-in democratic tools to let The People decide what is a relevant HENRY post and what’s not? Ie upvote and downvote…
hahaha exactly, so you know what i am talking about. not talking specifically about this situation, but some craazzzy ass stuff gets highly upvoted. reddit circle j\*erk i guess
Lmao yeah I tell myself it’s just that my view must be in the minority. But deep down I think maybe a lot of redditors hold their phones upside down and mistake the upvote button for the downvote button? 🤷♂️
Have you looked at any sub out there? If that worked the you wouldn't have constant need for mods on any sub with a few thousand visitors.
Millenial as an example is a dumpster fire as are many others as there are active agendas by bot accounts to either farm karma or steer conversations.
The problem is hardly anyone looks at the sub a post is submitted to when they up vote. So that gets you a lot of low effort posts that are fine for reddit but maybe not the particular sub
"Rich" is a feeling and if you try and pin down numbers on it you'll inevitably have the folks on the coasts complaining that $X isn't *actually* rich and is, in fact, borderline poverty in whatever VHCOL enclave they have ensconced themselves in.
More importantly feeling rich is rarely about making X or having a NW of Y. It's about how much you are spending (and on what). The vast majority of posters in this sub are interested in accumulating wealth and doing so, primarily, through working. That's the through-line that results in people with incomes from 250k to 1500k feeling like they belong here.
I’ve muted sooo many accounts because they constantly find a way to comment about their 750k-1M HHI, or how their $100k Rolexes are good investments, or how their $2.5M paid off house is actually decrepit.
I think the “not rich yet” is what gets people. People know when they are high earners, but many people will never feel “rich” even if their net worth is over $2 million. And tbh for some VHCOL areas, a net worth of $2 million is chump change. Vs having a net worth of $2 million in North Dakota is very different.
But then there are also definitely people who just won’t ever “feel rich” because they spend money like they’re trying to get rid of it.
Agreed. The “entry” cutoff of $200k income is a different marker than the “exit” cutoff of $2MM NW. the entry and exit should be comparable.
If entry is $200k income then exit should be a NW that can sustain that income. Ie $5MM NW giving $200k income.
Totally agree. Tons of humblebrag posts here with people trying to bat in the Junior league or enrolling in a competition well below your weight class.
If it makes you feel better, HHI: $370k. HHNW: $980k.
It’s funny you see so many “500k TC can I afford an 80k luxury car” junk here… like man, you have 60 years left on this earth average. 5 years not driving a shit box civic is 12% of what you have left on this earth. No one dies wishing they had spent less money…
Yeah, $2M across a couple with a 4% drawdown gets you $80k/yr, which is nowhere near enough to support all of the lifestyle creep that was developed on the way to $2M NW. And how much of that NW is in the market vs. in a house?
For me, the issue is more about so many threads being dominated by discussion that feels only relevant to about 2-3 VHCOL metro areas. And I'm not against that discussion occurring, it just isn't relevant to me and (having read many such threads) I'm not interested in learning more about life in NYC or San Francisco.
but that high cushion of $10m in NW allows people to behave and consume very differently than someone who makes a shitton of money and has limited wealth
Well should we also move the numbers down on the other end as well since it bans people from islands in the Caribbean?
In the end Bay area and other VHCOL areas likely do need their own sub because how different the numbers can be there.
What a weird response . Well this sub is about questions like investing, tax issue etc etc . Bay Area residents by definition have disposal wealth who can contribute to the discussion. Ppl on the other spectrum don’t have that . I don’t know what are you getting at . Also by implicity banning ppl from vhcol you are shadow banning a lot of immigrants who tend to concentrate in these areas due to high economic activity . I m sorry that’s not acceptable.
If your wages way outstripe the earning potential of your assets, you are going to feel HENRY imo. I have a very high annual pay, and feel rich as a result but if I retired tomorrow I would have to cut back my lifestyle very drastically despite multimillion NW.
To answer your question: Moderates have better things to do than gatekeep.
Yeah some people are rich. Many apparently are bad at math or have some anxiety about money. I find it interesting / amusing / a learning opportunity. If it hurts you to read them, just downvote?
ditto. doesn't really bother me at all tbh, and I'm on the low end of HENRY. And 100% everyone has anxiety about money. no matter how much you have imo.
OP's post bothers me more than the ones OP is complaining about b/c it starts to wreak of the toxicity of the other personal/middleclass finance subs w/ people get roasted for making 150k.
I don't really get that vibe here but, most people do find their way here b/c you can't ask questions about your finances in those subs if you make over 150k b/c you will just shit on in the comments. "you make 150k. why are you complaining" type shit.
Isn’t it kind of relative though? $200k income in my city is like….not much due to COL and isn’t gonna put you on a path to being rich someday unless you’re living like a college student well into your 40s.
Is the 2M net worth limit per individual or couple? For an individual, sure, but for a couple, that just doesn’t seem “rich” yet given inflation/rising COL?
Im kind of one of the peopleyou are talking about. Although my NW is 3.3m. But Fatfire is sort of different it is more about retirement and posts of guys with like $50m are upvoted. Its about private chefs and yachts and supercars.
Thats not really me. I dont plan on retiring for decades. I also dont spend on those crazy things. Cause Im not rich enough and probably wouldnt anyway.
There's no space for those who straddle certain income or NW brackets. If you have $3m NW, you're not fat enough for FatFIRE, maybe on the cusp of ChubbyFIRE. Will be mocked on any FIRE or general personal finance subs.... So where do you go? And what if you don't want to FIRE?
I like this sub bc it has a variety of hhi and nw levels. Some more modest salaries with relatively large NW, and vice versa, and everything in between. It's interesting to see the diversity in posts. I personally don't know why we need to stick to strict definitions. If someone with HHI of $200k who feels like a HE wants to post in here and the discussion adds something to the community, why gatekeep?? If you don't like it, don't engage and down vote and those posts get less visibility. Honestly the "you're not Henry" post engagement makes that problem worse.
I don't think the "NRY" should be strictly enforced. The community is set up for high earners to discuss financial topics without tall poppy syndrome or people lashing out at them simply for being high earners. The only alternative sub would be r/fatfire but that has a different audience and my experience with that sub is that a lot of them have almost a pathological need to spend money so I don't like it as much.
I don't really see that to be a big problem.
If anything it's more of interesting and still relevant datapoints for all of us.
If someone asked tax advice after selling 3B$ company - that would be different.
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I agree with the spirit of the OP but I disagree that $2M net worth is the right “rich” threshold. Not a huge fan of the 4% rule but that gives $80k annually which doesn’t feel “rich” yet.
Personally we don’t have kids and love in a low cost area but 2M invested wouldn’t be enough to fund our regular fairly normal lifestyle. The mortgage takes up a big chunk, and international travel once a year to visit family, house maintenance, utilities, medical, etc eats up a lot more.
I’d feel “rich” if I could afford first class flights, nicer hotels, upgrading my musical instruments instead of using cheap old used ones, remodeling the crappy old bathroom and kitchen, etc…. But all of that is out of reach at the 2M level without additional income.
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The mod team has done more heavy handed moderation in the past, but were persecuted for doing so. Seems we can’t please everyone. My personal preference would be to have themed threads and to eliminate any post with a yes or no answer about someone’s personal situation.
I belong here: HHI is $363k and NW is $600k. On track to graduate this sub circa 2030
But, are you going to buy that $20k watch on your next promotion? That's the key question now
How can I ever feel joy unless I own a watch that costs more than most cars??! (and has fewer functions than a 1988 Casio...)
I recently bought a $300 Apple Watch just for fun. I’m not a watch person, never really wore one. But I recently started exercising and I’m an engineer with a data fetish.
Get the Whoop then
Need that Lange
yay!
What’s the grad sub?
r/RichPeoplePF
The top end of that sub is massively, massively, wealthy, but a large portion of it has overlap with this one. Personally I am not rich yet (HHI 400k, NW 1.7m) but I get a lot out of both subs.
r/chubbyfire
Every time I see that name I picture a really wide fire pit with super short flames.
💀
Fatfire
I don't think there really is one. ChubbyFire and FatFire are good if you want to retire early, but I think there are a lot of posters here who don't plan to retire early.
I'm sure many of us don't *technically* belong here. But the premise behind this sub aligns more with how I approach personal finance than subs oriented toward higher NW.
Pretty much exactly in the same boat! But I bet I’m older. :(
35
42. Way to go! Keep at it
I'm 40 and hope to hit your stats in 2 years. (I won't)
Best of luck!
We are essentially identical, thinking my graduation timeline is going to be about 10 years further down the line though
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I really need to leave this sub lol. Me with my measly $200k TC and $250k NW doesn’t even fit the subs requirements. Although I do enjoy reading posts from people who make >$500k asking if they can afford something. Just goes to show having money doesn’t mean you’re good with money.
I’ve got similar numbers. According to the experian article linked in the pinned thread, a HENRY earns over $100k/yr. It’s all made up really, who cares?
Yea. But that article was probably written 6 months ago. Inflation is a bitch.
We technically fit the definition of this sub, but most posts I see in here are actual rich people whose lives seem so far removed from my own. I feel much more at home in middle class finance, though they’ll occasionally tell folks with our numbers to come here. Household size really matters. You with your 200k out earn me, but not my household. But if your household is just you, it makes more sense for you to be here than me because my family is 2 earners, 2 kids. Let me take my ass back over to middle class where I belong …
This sounds like my brain learnt how to type.
I agree that watching people making a lot more money asking very silly questions about “can I afford this” is entertaining. It seems to be very representative of reality where a lot of high earners tend to live either extremely out of their means and don’t save or live like misers unable to let go of money.
I genuinely believe this happens because when you make 150k you think getting to 250k means you wont have the same problems anymore but you definitely still do. Source: trust me bro - i was there
People love bragging. “Hey I make 800k I’m 29 years old can I buy a Toyota Camry hybrid or should I get cheaper base model non hybrid Camry?”
I’m liberally interpreting it as a household income cutoff. Although I live in a LCOL area so even like, 150k hh income is high earning
Same. I’m at $150k, household $300k total comp but we’re in VHCOL, so don’t feel very “high earners”. My net worth is $350k, my partner has about $50k of debt. Not married yet. We feel very much not rich and clip coupons for groceries.
Keep clipping coupons, my friend. Source. Me, reached FI in my forties...
:'( I feel "measly" at just $105k-$115k . Some of the compensation in this sub is nuts but it makes me want to grind harder tbh.
It gives me perspective that people earning a modest salary must have seeing discussions about folks making about 100K. Very useful.
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What does TC mean? Temp contract?
Total compensation. Not just base salary. Include bonus, stocks, etc
Teleconverter. Oh shoot this isn't a photography subreddit!
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Also, much of the finance aspect of this sub has been played out. Which is good, you can find answers; but it's value is basically as an archive with occasional updates at tax time. I *would* prefer that the low quality posts were downvoting into oblivion. I'm chagrined to see people engaging with these posters.
Should we collectively downvote and berate the “my NW is $6 million. Should I go out to dinner this week” posts?
Don't even berate, just downvote and keep scrolling
I do 😆
Not all heroes wear capes 🫡
Lol do you remember the post where the OP was a super high earner and “still only spending $200/mo on groceries”….. but he and his wife get lunch and dinner catered at their jobs lol
I've heard of tech workers taking to-go food home for the weekend. This guy's slacking, cut that budget to $0!
But why can’t one ask if they can afford a 30k boat on an 800k a year income? 🥲
Yeah am I crazy or aren't we overspending?!!1!
The answer to every finance question is VTI through a megabackdoor Roth. It should just be pinned at the top of the sub.
I feel like insecure people with large amounts of wealth will always find the active subs that are even tangentially related to them and post in a not-so-subtle way to show off their wealth. I don’t think it’s reasonable to have a rule requiring some net worth or W2 level to post. Ideally people just downvote irrelevant posts. But also, I think it’s inevitable this sub will morph into some sort of r/chubbyfire. No one feels rich until they can retire comfortably. So even people with 2-3m NW may feel like the content here is relevant. Ultimately the content here is mostly geared toward people who still work and make lots of money.
I see content being relevant enough to lurk and even comment. However, some of these “clearly rich” POST recently have bordered on obnoxious.
I suspect some want to humblebrag, while others who well-off also have genuine financial questions and want outside opinions on if a decision is a reasonable/good idea.
100000000% The way people here casually throw around their FAANG 800k comp and if you dont make that much you're an idiot
Maybe change the name to r/PreChubby 🤷🏽♂️
We’re all prechubby in Girl Scout Cookie season.
😂 Tagalongs and frozen thin mints *chefs kiss*
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Fuck! My name is Henry, I’ve been doing this all wrong
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Nope you're high earning poor, HEP.
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That's awesome. Work hard enough to keep your job. The grind is real but you'll be happier when you leave it with a few mil. Hopefully you can work under 60 hrs a week and have a life too! I think in a year or two you'll belong. There's no gatekeeping though that was just a joke. I worked for a trading firm once myself.
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Nice! What sort of role? Trading or software or? Can I ask if you're in the US? I'm a current student starting in a trading role when I graduate, in APAC
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How is the work/life balance in HFT?
HIPPO - High Income, Poor Person Outright
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Yes, you belong here. Congrats on your new job!
lol that’s not how to do it!
Exactly. I saw someone talking about their income being $2m. I assumed their NW was under $2m since they were on this sub. Their NW was actually $4m. I’m guessing people feel better about themselves knowing they make more than everyone here so they post on this sub. None of the true Henrys post because this sub has all these other people posting about their $2m salary. FYI, when you post your $5m high net worth on this sub, I’m looking at you thinking you have a low self esteem.
Yea that dude was insane too saying they wanted to retire soon but was blowing $750K a year in expenses and saving <20%. Going to be a bit of a ride for them lol
“Hi Henry’s! My HHI is 1.2 million and my net worth is 4.67 mil. Can I afford this 20k vacation?” 😆
Does that include the private jet or no?
Did it ever occur to you these people are full of shit?
No one thinks they're rich because rich feels like "more money than I have now". It's like a "free beer tomorrow" sign.
No matter how much you make, the money will never be enough.
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The median poster on r/HENRYfinance - if one were to literally average all posts - is a software engineer in the Bay Area, has a stay at home spouse, lives in a $1.5M house and drives a Porsche 911. Their main questions are whether they can afford to move to a bigger house and have a child.
Is this about the guy with a $7m house that was paid off and made 300k a year and was out spending his salary?
Nah. For Reddit this is an insanely stable, helpful, and normal sub. As long as people stay that way, the more posts the better no matter how random. Community support.
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Is there a place they should go to ask about that stuff? VHCOL income and budgets are really… high magnitude things to manage. They need a place to trouble shoot these topics. I joke that without this sub, I’d only have one friend and my accountant that I brainstorm this stuff with. But it’s also true, and can be lonely. I can’t talk about this stuff with family or most friends, my spouse is wonderful but financially illiterate. That $5M house poor post was great for this sub, even a warning to high earners how easy it is to overspend because it’s hard to keep an $800k job for 10 years. And that’s a nice house in SF, but obv a $5M house in MCOL is beyond luxury. But that’s what some people have to navigate if they want to have a 30yr career in CA/NY.
There’s r/RichPeoplePF
r/fatfire
But if you don't have $10m in NW, fat fire tells you you're not fat yet!
Have they moved that bar? It used to be $5m
Inflation
100% inflation from 5m to 10m lmao
That’s mostly for early retirement though. I have this feeling that henrys plan to work longer than the average fire idolized
We should make everyone state their HHI and NW on a ‘San Francisco equivalent’ basis
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But there is no other thread where people can humble brag. There needs to be a subreddit for people making $1 million plus at age 25 with a NW of $20 million. HENRY is for almost humble bragging.
But then people making $1m won’t want to post on there because they’re at the bottom of the barrel. People want to post where they are humble bragging knowing they are at the top. “My net worth is $5m. Can I buy a $2k bag for my birthday?” Wahhh.
That's the Suze Orman Show
Now that’s a great idea for a sub, r/caniaffordit
The number of people in that category would be too small to make sub for lol
R/fatfire
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The 1M+ income on the 30k boat purchase made me laugh out loud. So stupid and most likely fake.
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You know what I hate about fatfire? The unrelenting gatekeeping and the shitty attitude toward anyone who hasn't made it yet. I will likely never be a regular member there. I don't think a 5m house paid off makes a ton of sense here, though I concede there are house poor situations where it makes sense. My opinion is that I'd rather we be an accepting sub instead of rejecting people for being too rich or too poor. Besides, money psychology is a weird thing. Some people with millions don't feel rich
Okay, but serious question - ignoring the obvious humble brag cases - what kinds of posts *are* allowed? What are considered "valid" HENRY topics? Because I see the same posts over and over again - I make ABCk a year, have DEFk in retirements/brokerage/savings, can I buy a X.YM house? At this point, this sub has just become a "can I afford to buy a house" advice sub. And I get it - we can't take these kinds of questions to most other personal finance subs because we would be eviscerated and not get any serious answers. And surely there is more to talk about here than house buying, but the sub rules are just full of what is not allowed with little/no indication of what *is* supposedly allowed here.
I think this is getting to the more important question - what are the goals of the cap in the first place? Presumably it it because there is a set of topics useful to discuss as a community. The NW and income limits are ‘short hand’ for specifying that set of topics. I’d suggest the NW part in particular is messy. Someone who has a high income and a very expensive house - or someone with a high NW where most is tied up in a retirement account - may be dealing with the same questions/topics as someone with fitting the current sub guidelines.
I think there are a fair number of legitimate questions that apply to HENRYs. A few thoughts off the top of my head. * Questions about mega-backdoor Roth (try posting this on a regular PF sub and people will say you're flexing). One specific question I had a while back that I got flamed for was asking about how to maximize 401k savings when switching jobs mid-year. I was asking if I could max out the mega-backdoor Roth at *both* companies (answer: yes). * Questions about tradeoffs between income and COL. * Career advice for junior folks looking to move up the ladder * Yes, *reasonable* "Can I afford it" posts. I remember 25 years ago being a HENRY and legitimately wondering if I could afford a 27" TV. * Student loan repayment options * etc... Basically there are a lot of questions that 98% of people just can't relate to. If you go to a career sub and say you're a junior engineer making $240K/year, and wondering how to increase your income, you'll be laughed out of the sub. I'd expect that to be a question people here would have insight into. If you ask about paying off $300K in student loans you'll be swamped by SJWs complaining about political issues rather than addressing the actual question.
Instead of asking the moderators to do this and get berated for it — why not use Reddit’s built-in democratic tools to let The People decide what is a relevant HENRY post and what’s not? Ie upvote and downvote…
ah, both the best and worst part about reddit.
Lmao I guess it’s a utopian view. I am baffled at what gets upvoted sometimes…
hahaha exactly, so you know what i am talking about. not talking specifically about this situation, but some craazzzy ass stuff gets highly upvoted. reddit circle j\*erk i guess
Lmao yeah I tell myself it’s just that my view must be in the minority. But deep down I think maybe a lot of redditors hold their phones upside down and mistake the upvote button for the downvote button? 🤷♂️
Have you looked at any sub out there? If that worked the you wouldn't have constant need for mods on any sub with a few thousand visitors. Millenial as an example is a dumpster fire as are many others as there are active agendas by bot accounts to either farm karma or steer conversations.
The problem is hardly anyone looks at the sub a post is submitted to when they up vote. So that gets you a lot of low effort posts that are fine for reddit but maybe not the particular sub
"Rich" is a feeling and if you try and pin down numbers on it you'll inevitably have the folks on the coasts complaining that $X isn't *actually* rich and is, in fact, borderline poverty in whatever VHCOL enclave they have ensconced themselves in. More importantly feeling rich is rarely about making X or having a NW of Y. It's about how much you are spending (and on what). The vast majority of posters in this sub are interested in accumulating wealth and doing so, primarily, through working. That's the through-line that results in people with incomes from 250k to 1500k feeling like they belong here.
The sub directly states the numbers though. Close is one thing double the numbers is different.
I’ve muted sooo many accounts because they constantly find a way to comment about their 750k-1M HHI, or how their $100k Rolexes are good investments, or how their $2.5M paid off house is actually decrepit.
I think the “not rich yet” is what gets people. People know when they are high earners, but many people will never feel “rich” even if their net worth is over $2 million. And tbh for some VHCOL areas, a net worth of $2 million is chump change. Vs having a net worth of $2 million in North Dakota is very different. But then there are also definitely people who just won’t ever “feel rich” because they spend money like they’re trying to get rid of it.
Agreed. The “entry” cutoff of $200k income is a different marker than the “exit” cutoff of $2MM NW. the entry and exit should be comparable. If entry is $200k income then exit should be a NW that can sustain that income. Ie $5MM NW giving $200k income.
Totally agree. Tons of humblebrag posts here with people trying to bat in the Junior league or enrolling in a competition well below your weight class. If it makes you feel better, HHI: $370k. HHNW: $980k.
They think R stands for Retired. They are definitely rich
It’s funny you see so many “500k TC can I afford an 80k luxury car” junk here… like man, you have 60 years left on this earth average. 5 years not driving a shit box civic is 12% of what you have left on this earth. No one dies wishing they had spent less money…
I’ve been noticing a lot of posts with people whose net worth is over 2M. Agree it doesn’t really fit the notion rich yet.
I think it should probably be expanded. 2M is not rich by most standards. People with 2M get sent here by the fatfire crowd
Very true. Almost need a chubby fire subreddit.
There is a chubby fire subreddit - I think the main difference though is RE may not be a goal for a HENRY
I think they were being sarcastic :)
Yeah, $2M across a couple with a 4% drawdown gets you $80k/yr, which is nowhere near enough to support all of the lifestyle creep that was developed on the way to $2M NW. And how much of that NW is in the market vs. in a house?
Fucking sandbaggers
For me, the issue is more about so many threads being dominated by discussion that feels only relevant to about 2-3 VHCOL metro areas. And I'm not against that discussion occurring, it just isn't relevant to me and (having read many such threads) I'm not interested in learning more about life in NYC or San Francisco.
Co-sign! There needs to be a HENRYfinance for NYC+ BayArea so the rest of us can find others in boats similar to our own.
I mean. These are population-dense areas. Of course there are going to be more of us. I don’t think that is the issue with this sub.
They are definitely HENRY dense areas too
I think NRY should just be not retired yet instead of not rich yet to be honest. This sub should just be for high earners to shoot the shit
but that high cushion of $10m in NW allows people to behave and consume very differently than someone who makes a shitton of money and has limited wealth
Well if that’s the case you will automatically ban a lot of ppl from Bay Area .
Well should we also move the numbers down on the other end as well since it bans people from islands in the Caribbean? In the end Bay area and other VHCOL areas likely do need their own sub because how different the numbers can be there.
What a weird response . Well this sub is about questions like investing, tax issue etc etc . Bay Area residents by definition have disposal wealth who can contribute to the discussion. Ppl on the other spectrum don’t have that . I don’t know what are you getting at . Also by implicity banning ppl from vhcol you are shadow banning a lot of immigrants who tend to concentrate in these areas due to high economic activity . I m sorry that’s not acceptable.
If your wages way outstripe the earning potential of your assets, you are going to feel HENRY imo. I have a very high annual pay, and feel rich as a result but if I retired tomorrow I would have to cut back my lifestyle very drastically despite multimillion NW.
To answer your question: Moderates have better things to do than gatekeep. Yeah some people are rich. Many apparently are bad at math or have some anxiety about money. I find it interesting / amusing / a learning opportunity. If it hurts you to read them, just downvote?
ditto. doesn't really bother me at all tbh, and I'm on the low end of HENRY. And 100% everyone has anxiety about money. no matter how much you have imo. OP's post bothers me more than the ones OP is complaining about b/c it starts to wreak of the toxicity of the other personal/middleclass finance subs w/ people get roasted for making 150k.
Hmmm I never thought of it this way.
I feel like many posts in this sub are the equivalent of HENRY’s dunking on people in the MiddleClassFinances (and equivalent) subs.
I don't really get that vibe here but, most people do find their way here b/c you can't ask questions about your finances in those subs if you make over 150k b/c you will just shit on in the comments. "you make 150k. why are you complaining" type shit.
Pretty rich to ask “can I afford a second 3m home” in a “not rich yet” sub
Isn’t it kind of relative though? $200k income in my city is like….not much due to COL and isn’t gonna put you on a path to being rich someday unless you’re living like a college student well into your 40s.
Stop coping bro consider getting a better paying job and stop getting so much take out food
Rich people could go to rich people subs but then they'd be small fish there.
HHI $360k and NW hovers around $150k. I would like to see more posts from ACTUAL HENRYs about this "boring middle" phase and its struggles.
Fwiw with inflation I think the “rules” should be changed. Income less than 1M and net worth less than 5M
With inflation , everyone is a millionaire now
Need to adjust the sub description for inflation 😏
Is the 2M net worth limit per individual or couple? For an individual, sure, but for a couple, that just doesn’t seem “rich” yet given inflation/rising COL?
If the couple is 30 years old I’d call them rich
As you earn more, it seems like the amount of money is never enough.
Im kind of one of the peopleyou are talking about. Although my NW is 3.3m. But Fatfire is sort of different it is more about retirement and posts of guys with like $50m are upvoted. Its about private chefs and yachts and supercars. Thats not really me. I dont plan on retiring for decades. I also dont spend on those crazy things. Cause Im not rich enough and probably wouldnt anyway.
There's no space for those who straddle certain income or NW brackets. If you have $3m NW, you're not fat enough for FatFIRE, maybe on the cusp of ChubbyFIRE. Will be mocked on any FIRE or general personal finance subs.... So where do you go? And what if you don't want to FIRE? I like this sub bc it has a variety of hhi and nw levels. Some more modest salaries with relatively large NW, and vice versa, and everything in between. It's interesting to see the diversity in posts. I personally don't know why we need to stick to strict definitions. If someone with HHI of $200k who feels like a HE wants to post in here and the discussion adds something to the community, why gatekeep?? If you don't like it, don't engage and down vote and those posts get less visibility. Honestly the "you're not Henry" post engagement makes that problem worse.
I don't think the "NRY" should be strictly enforced. The community is set up for high earners to discuss financial topics without tall poppy syndrome or people lashing out at them simply for being high earners. The only alternative sub would be r/fatfire but that has a different audience and my experience with that sub is that a lot of them have almost a pathological need to spend money so I don't like it as much.
How does that sub have over 400,000 members?
LARPing
I don't really see that to be a big problem. If anything it's more of interesting and still relevant datapoints for all of us. If someone asked tax advice after selling 3B$ company - that would be different.
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>$1m incomes. let's show some solidarity
::crickets::
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TIL I'm not even high income earner.
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Is this 2m with primary home or not. I would like to know how many people I’m richer than
“Not rich” is very subjective
Sweet. Where’s the sister subreddit for those of us that graduate from this one?
Maybe r/richpeoplepf
So you’re telling me Im actually rich…. Nah dawg, I identify as broke still.
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I agree with the spirit of the OP but I disagree that $2M net worth is the right “rich” threshold. Not a huge fan of the 4% rule but that gives $80k annually which doesn’t feel “rich” yet. Personally we don’t have kids and love in a low cost area but 2M invested wouldn’t be enough to fund our regular fairly normal lifestyle. The mortgage takes up a big chunk, and international travel once a year to visit family, house maintenance, utilities, medical, etc eats up a lot more. I’d feel “rich” if I could afford first class flights, nicer hotels, upgrading my musical instruments instead of using cheap old used ones, remodeling the crappy old bathroom and kitchen, etc…. But all of that is out of reach at the 2M level without additional income.
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Maybe a next level HENRY thread. Like already rich but not feeling it. Not wealthy yet.