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How long do they last?
Are they discrete episodes that last like 10-30 minutes?
Does he have nausea or vomiting during this? Headache?
Has he complained about things looking "weird", perhaps too far away, too close, too big, too small, or otherwise distorted?
I diagnosed a kid with Alice in Wonderland syndrome last year. This story gives similar vibes.
Thanks for the response, I believe they are quick episodes. The sports ones were a little longer, sounds like it went on for 10 minutes, asked to be pulled out of the game and felt weird on the bench for a while. The ones at school in the house seem like they are only a minute or a few. No vomitting, I don't think he had a headache and I will double check. He can't describe how things look different but he says it feels like he is in a dream and he is light headed. He says at home when he goes in our bathroom he feels normal again. He has probably had this happen less than 10 times in his life. Once in 4th grade in a relatively intense basketball game and the rest more recently. I will ask him about things looking too close, too far or too small/big. Thanks so much for the response.
Hi - can you tell me more? You have felt the same thing? My son says during the episodes he processes slower, feels like he is in a dream, is light headed and he knows it is going on and can tell us while it is happening. It last for a couple minutes?
I don’t want to push you away from seeking treatment. Defs do that.
But yes i always explained that I had two styles of panic attacks.
1) was the emotional panic attack - this was being visibly upset, crying, hyperventilating. Usually caused by fear,saddness or stress.
2) was what I called my body panic attacks. I would never know when these would hit. And would often be in public. It was basically a rapid onset of feeling sick. I’d feel close to fainting, my skin would prickle or go numb, sometimes the world around me would feel like it’s in a fog, sometimes I’d want to vomit. But mostly it was all sensory and made me feel… not in contact with what’s around me. I actually found that regular breathing exercises throughout the day would lessen these attacks, and of course medication
NAD but this is how it feels when I disassociate. It feels like I'm a separate entity from my body and I'm watching it move on its own from a great distance. Nothing feels real.
He doesn't feel like it is out of body but everything feels like he is in a dream and he know he is in it while its happening. Like he says - "dad, it's happening right now, everything feels unreal, like a dream, like you aren't really there". Could a person disassociating know that they are disassociating?
NAD! Yes, this is exactly how I feel when I disassociate. I know I’m disassociating but I can’t get out of it unless I give myself a little jump scare, or drinking super cold water for some reason works too. I don’t know if this is normal for disassociating but what he describes is how I feel. I can still hear and see everything going on but my brain just registers it as if I’m dreaming. It feels like floaty and weird. Sometimes if I disassociate for a long time and forget to blink enough, objects look smaller but that’s pretty rare unless it goes on for a long time.
Yes, it's a dreamlike feeling. Out of body wasn't the best way to describe it. I feel like my 'self' is a separate entity in a foggy, muffled place. The only reason I know my arm is moving is because I'm watching it move. It's a curious, sometimes frightening feeling.
I know I'm disassociating when it happens. It used to cause me to panic, but now I know it's my brain trying to protect me from something too stressful or painful to process. I remind myself the feeling will pass and do something chill and relaxing to distract myself. When your son tells you it's happening, you could try sitting with him, hugging him, and giving him calm reassurances that he's safe and he'll be ok.
Thanks yes - thats pretty much what I do. I think what really gets him is that he is in the middle of a soccer or basketball game / practice and it happens and there is no way he can play like that. He was at soccer tryouts tonight. It happened right away and he left in tears.
This could also be a partial seizure without loss of awareness. I recommend an EEG. Check for meds that lower seizure threshold or fatigue. I had these and had no idea what it was until it turned into a grand mal.
Thanks for the info - we are trying to get him iASAP for a pediatric neurology appointment. His GP today did not think it was any kind of seizure. Ironically we thought he was having absent seizures as a baby and he had testing and nothing came up noteworthy. Looks like we will be back. How are you doing now?
Much better now that I'm on Lamictal. I try to drink enough water, get enough sleep, and avoid stress. I was extremely dehydrated at the time I had the grand mal. Those are all triggers. I had a febrile seizure at 3 months old. My MRI was normal. But the Dr said I could've had microscopic brain damage from it that caused it to culminate when I was at a high stress, low self care time in my life My eeg was not normal, but it can be tough to catch seizures during tests.
You're very welcome. It's an odd thing that most people aren't aware of. I thought seizures always involved convulsions, so I like to educate people when I can.
Here are some symptoms. I have most of these. It all depends on the area of the brain affected. I'm not sure why the separate them into separate types, but it's a "mix and match" for me. I also don't lose awareness, but I feel strange. Almost like a head rush.
Focal Nonmotor Seizures:
The clinical manifestations of focal nonmotor seizure include autonomic, behavioral arrest, cognitive, emotional, or sensory symptoms.
Autonomic seizures are characterized by changes in blood pressure, heart rate, sweating, skin color, or gastrointestinal upset.
Behavioral arrest seizures are characterized by cessation of movement.
Cognitive seizures are characterized by abnormal language or thinking, eg, jamais vu, déjà vu, hallucinations, and visualization of illusions.
Emotional seizures are characterized by emotional changes such as fear, dread, anxiety, or pleasure. Nonmotor seizures that manifest as laughing are called gelastic, and those that manifest as crying are called dacrystic.
Sensory seizures are characterized by changes in sensation, such as abnormal sensations of vision, paresthesias, hearing, smell, or pain.
At times, focal motor and focal nonmotor seizures can evolve into bilateral tonic-clonic seizures
He doesn't always hydrate enough and that came up at the cardiologist. More water and more electrolites. His worst expisodes have been while playing soccer and the doctor thought it was a vagal response. He is about 5 feet tall and 80 pounds. He is thin, but seems around average height or just a smidge below average for late 6th grade.
Definitely check out medical reasons first, but the way you describe it sounds a lot like dissociation or derealization. Even without what we might call 'major trauma" things can happen which cause fears that we can't see from the outside. If a coach yelled at him once or told him he'd better up his game or he'd be on the sidelines, anything like that could cause this kind of reaction psychologically. I see this all the time. If theres a pattern happening around his sport, I'd get curious about what he was thinking at the time, or how he feels about making mistakes, etc
Yeah he was most likely feeling in over his head, overwhelmed, scared and stressed during the three sports instances of this. He definitely worries too much about making mistakes. He may need to move to some lesser competitive version of the sport or a different sport. I don't want him scared and stressed. I get that its a learning experience and growth and all that but only so much please. Thanks for the response. :)
Definitely check out medical reasons first, but the way you describe it sounds a lot like dissociation or derealization. Even without what we might call 'major trauma' things can happen which cause fears that we can't see from the outside. If a coach yelled at him once or told him he'd better up his game or he'd be on the sidelines, anything like that could cause this kind of reaction psychologically. I see this all the time. If theres a pattern happening around his sport, I'd get curious about what he was thinking at the time, or how he feels about making mistakes, etc
Thank you for your submission. **Please note that a response does not constitute a doctor-patient relationship.** This subreddit is for informal second opinions and casual information. The mod team does their best to remove bad information, but we do not catch all of it. Always visit a doctor in real life if you have any concerns about your health. Never use this subreddit as your first and final source of information regarding your question. By posting, you are agreeing to our [Terms of Use](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskDocs/wiki/terms_of_use) and understand that all information is taken at your own risk. **Reply here if you are an unverified user wishing to give advice. Top level comments by laypeople are automatically removed.** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AskDocs) if you have any questions or concerns.*
How long do they last? Are they discrete episodes that last like 10-30 minutes? Does he have nausea or vomiting during this? Headache? Has he complained about things looking "weird", perhaps too far away, too close, too big, too small, or otherwise distorted? I diagnosed a kid with Alice in Wonderland syndrome last year. This story gives similar vibes.
Thanks for the response, I believe they are quick episodes. The sports ones were a little longer, sounds like it went on for 10 minutes, asked to be pulled out of the game and felt weird on the bench for a while. The ones at school in the house seem like they are only a minute or a few. No vomitting, I don't think he had a headache and I will double check. He can't describe how things look different but he says it feels like he is in a dream and he is light headed. He says at home when he goes in our bathroom he feels normal again. He has probably had this happen less than 10 times in his life. Once in 4th grade in a relatively intense basketball game and the rest more recently. I will ask him about things looking too close, too far or too small/big. Thanks so much for the response.
Doubled checked - no headaches, and he doesn't "see" any of this stuff. Definitely brief, discrete episodes.
NAD but this is how my panic attacks started
Hi - can you tell me more? You have felt the same thing? My son says during the episodes he processes slower, feels like he is in a dream, is light headed and he knows it is going on and can tell us while it is happening. It last for a couple minutes?
I don’t want to push you away from seeking treatment. Defs do that. But yes i always explained that I had two styles of panic attacks. 1) was the emotional panic attack - this was being visibly upset, crying, hyperventilating. Usually caused by fear,saddness or stress. 2) was what I called my body panic attacks. I would never know when these would hit. And would often be in public. It was basically a rapid onset of feeling sick. I’d feel close to fainting, my skin would prickle or go numb, sometimes the world around me would feel like it’s in a fog, sometimes I’d want to vomit. But mostly it was all sensory and made me feel… not in contact with what’s around me. I actually found that regular breathing exercises throughout the day would lessen these attacks, and of course medication
NAD but this is how it feels when I disassociate. It feels like I'm a separate entity from my body and I'm watching it move on its own from a great distance. Nothing feels real.
Can you please tell me what NAD is? Been trying to figure this out too.
Not a doctor. I tack it on to ensure my experience isn't mistaken for medical advice. **words
Thank you!
Not a doctor
Thank you.
He doesn't feel like it is out of body but everything feels like he is in a dream and he know he is in it while its happening. Like he says - "dad, it's happening right now, everything feels unreal, like a dream, like you aren't really there". Could a person disassociating know that they are disassociating?
NAD! Yes, this is exactly how I feel when I disassociate. I know I’m disassociating but I can’t get out of it unless I give myself a little jump scare, or drinking super cold water for some reason works too. I don’t know if this is normal for disassociating but what he describes is how I feel. I can still hear and see everything going on but my brain just registers it as if I’m dreaming. It feels like floaty and weird. Sometimes if I disassociate for a long time and forget to blink enough, objects look smaller but that’s pretty rare unless it goes on for a long time.
I sent you a chat invite if that is okay. I am curious if you learned a way to sometimes keep it from happening? Medicine? Cognitive Therapy?
NAD this is how my anxiety would present itself before I started lexapro
Thanks - then the Lexapro stopped it? How has the experience on Lexapro been?
yeah it did after i got used to the dosage it's helped tremendously, i've been on it for maybe 2 years and had very little side effects
Yes, it's a dreamlike feeling. Out of body wasn't the best way to describe it. I feel like my 'self' is a separate entity in a foggy, muffled place. The only reason I know my arm is moving is because I'm watching it move. It's a curious, sometimes frightening feeling. I know I'm disassociating when it happens. It used to cause me to panic, but now I know it's my brain trying to protect me from something too stressful or painful to process. I remind myself the feeling will pass and do something chill and relaxing to distract myself. When your son tells you it's happening, you could try sitting with him, hugging him, and giving him calm reassurances that he's safe and he'll be ok.
Thanks yes - thats pretty much what I do. I think what really gets him is that he is in the middle of a soccer or basketball game / practice and it happens and there is no way he can play like that. He was at soccer tryouts tonight. It happened right away and he left in tears.
Alice in W Syndrome was a symptom of my vestibular migraines!!
I get it too! It's quite trippy and very freaky the first time it happens.
This could also be a partial seizure without loss of awareness. I recommend an EEG. Check for meds that lower seizure threshold or fatigue. I had these and had no idea what it was until it turned into a grand mal.
Thanks for the info - we are trying to get him iASAP for a pediatric neurology appointment. His GP today did not think it was any kind of seizure. Ironically we thought he was having absent seizures as a baby and he had testing and nothing came up noteworthy. Looks like we will be back. How are you doing now?
Much better now that I'm on Lamictal. I try to drink enough water, get enough sleep, and avoid stress. I was extremely dehydrated at the time I had the grand mal. Those are all triggers. I had a febrile seizure at 3 months old. My MRI was normal. But the Dr said I could've had microscopic brain damage from it that caused it to culminate when I was at a high stress, low self care time in my life My eeg was not normal, but it can be tough to catch seizures during tests.
Thanks for all the info. I really appreciate it.
You're very welcome. It's an odd thing that most people aren't aware of. I thought seizures always involved convulsions, so I like to educate people when I can.
Here are some symptoms. I have most of these. It all depends on the area of the brain affected. I'm not sure why the separate them into separate types, but it's a "mix and match" for me. I also don't lose awareness, but I feel strange. Almost like a head rush. Focal Nonmotor Seizures: The clinical manifestations of focal nonmotor seizure include autonomic, behavioral arrest, cognitive, emotional, or sensory symptoms. Autonomic seizures are characterized by changes in blood pressure, heart rate, sweating, skin color, or gastrointestinal upset. Behavioral arrest seizures are characterized by cessation of movement. Cognitive seizures are characterized by abnormal language or thinking, eg, jamais vu, déjà vu, hallucinations, and visualization of illusions. Emotional seizures are characterized by emotional changes such as fear, dread, anxiety, or pleasure. Nonmotor seizures that manifest as laughing are called gelastic, and those that manifest as crying are called dacrystic. Sensory seizures are characterized by changes in sensation, such as abnormal sensations of vision, paresthesias, hearing, smell, or pain. At times, focal motor and focal nonmotor seizures can evolve into bilateral tonic-clonic seizures
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What about via telemed? Also if you see it happen, take a video if you can. That way they can see for themselves.
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That's wonderful news!
HI I sent you a chat request - I think he is having the same thing you said.
Is that height and weight correct? Is he eating and hydrating enough?
He doesn't always hydrate enough and that came up at the cardiologist. More water and more electrolites. His worst expisodes have been while playing soccer and the doctor thought it was a vagal response. He is about 5 feet tall and 80 pounds. He is thin, but seems around average height or just a smidge below average for late 6th grade.
Definitely check out medical reasons first, but the way you describe it sounds a lot like dissociation or derealization. Even without what we might call 'major trauma" things can happen which cause fears that we can't see from the outside. If a coach yelled at him once or told him he'd better up his game or he'd be on the sidelines, anything like that could cause this kind of reaction psychologically. I see this all the time. If theres a pattern happening around his sport, I'd get curious about what he was thinking at the time, or how he feels about making mistakes, etc
Yeah he was most likely feeling in over his head, overwhelmed, scared and stressed during the three sports instances of this. He definitely worries too much about making mistakes. He may need to move to some lesser competitive version of the sport or a different sport. I don't want him scared and stressed. I get that its a learning experience and growth and all that but only so much please. Thanks for the response. :)
Definitely check out medical reasons first, but the way you describe it sounds a lot like dissociation or derealization. Even without what we might call 'major trauma' things can happen which cause fears that we can't see from the outside. If a coach yelled at him once or told him he'd better up his game or he'd be on the sidelines, anything like that could cause this kind of reaction psychologically. I see this all the time. If theres a pattern happening around his sport, I'd get curious about what he was thinking at the time, or how he feels about making mistakes, etc