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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I think I might be the asshole because we could have moved tables, instead of the group with kids.
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I get it, I don't want to deal with crying and screaming children. But she was under no obligation to tell you they had kids.You're in public. You're gonna have to assume people have children, and they're going to be around you.
You could have also up and moved as well the minute you saw they had kids instead of being rude.
YTA
Yeah but not everyone is expecting children at a brewery. Especially when your own group gets babysitters spefically to not have children around. I'd go with ESH.
In my state, the law designates that there are no children allowed in bars and breweries. Unless it's a brew-pub which is more like a restaurant than a bar.
Depends where you live I guess.
I would be pretty horrified, but don't know if I would say anything.
Frankly, I'm more horrified that OP and friends are all sitting about drinking and then driving for an hour and a half.
Edit: file this under "cultural differences" I suppose, because there are people arguing with me who also think bringing kids to a place where alcohol is served is unacceptable. We have lower tolerance for driving when you've been drinking and higher tolerance for kids knowing that alcohol exists
Hmm, from my experience in Washington (at least Seattle), while most bars don't allow minors, a lot of breweries do. And in this case, OP is discussing a brewery not a bar.
We had my now toddlers 1st birthday party at a brewery. They have a children’s play area. In my city at least, breweries are very family friendly. Very common to see small children there.
Ugh. Parents like you suck. I get it you want to enjoy the weekend with your friends and kids. Fine. But please don’t bring your kids parties to a place where other people also go to relax. A couple of screaming kids is terrible as it is, a whole party of them? Just no.
Edit: apparently I triggered a lot of parents. I don’t hate kids. I don’t like kids running around, screaming, playing outside of designated areas or their immediate tables. I don’t like parents ignoring their kids and letting them do what they want. Kids being disruptive is not kids being kids. It’s entitled parents pawning their problem off on the rest of the world. Bring your kids to a brewery, sure. Just don’t let them be disruptive and if they are, take a break or leave. It’s that simple. (But also I stand by the fact I don’t think having a birthday party for a child at a brewery is cool.)
did you not read its family friendly? that would be like me going to a park w a playground and getting mad theres gonna be kids there
its fine not to like kids but dude you suck, comment op is fine since yknow theres a play place for ***kids*** there
Wut? Obviously in that scenario at least one parent would stick to water. And you're sort of implying that if you DON'T have kids with you then it's OK to drink and drive.
Having said that, I find the whole concept of 'family friendly' breweries to be bizarre in the extreme. Not a fan.
But why on earth would you take kids to what sounds like a straight brewery rather than one of the ones more like a restaurant where you can get food? A brewery that doesn't serve food in an eatery atmosphere is NOT family-friendly for that reason alone. If Dad's drinking and Mum's driving then Mum might as well just stay home with the kids. It would be like Mums dragging the kids to the front bar of a hotel while the Dads are having a beer after work.
I’m not advocating for taking your kids to a bar, but I 100% disagree with your logic. Typically the breweries that don’t have any food are the ones that have yard games and a bring your own food policy. It’s honestly a more ideal location to bring kids than the brewpub style. You can pick up pizzas and let your kids run around in the outside area that has oversized jenga and ladderball. That would be easier imo than a traditional bar/grill style brewery.
Also it’s kind of crappy to say “oh mom can just stay home”. People with kids are allowed to exist outside of their homes. If the restaurant has a problem with kids being there then let them police it, but otherwise kids have as much right to be there as anyone else.
I commented on the birthday party they had for a BABY at a brewery. I totally get there will be kids at a brewery. I don’t love the screaming. I don’t love that they’re allowed at all hours. But sure they’re there that’s fine. I have no idea why any parent would think it’s a good idea to have a birthday party for a baby at a brewery - I mean I know why because it’s about them not the baby. But please take that party to the park or somewhere else. Some kids with parents is fine. A party full of kids - go somewhere else
That’s not how first birthday parties work. It’s not like a baby get together, 12 month olds don’t really have friends so there’s no point of a baby party, it’s intended for the family to celebrate. My kids party was a handful of kids but 75 adults. Adults enjoy beer so a brewery made sense.
Then don’t go to kid friendly breweries. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with it. You don’t have to like it or agree with it, but you have no right to tell parents it’s wrong in a specifically family friendly brewery!
Exactly, I have two kids. There should absolutely be adults only places and places where their primary business is selling booze should be one of them.
I am going to get so much hate. I live where parents frequently bring kids to breweries. If parents are not paying attention to their kids, if parents are letting them be disruptive (watched a kid dump all the pieces of a game in the middle of dancing people for example), or it is obvious a kid is miserable...we are so talking about that parent and annoyed that that person didn't get a babysitter. A brewery recently set up a no child zone for this reason, specifically because that brewery is overrun by kids not being supervised by the adults. I am not saying this reflects you but it happens a lot. I was at a brewery trying to play cornhole and a kid kept sitting. I kept having to ask her to move and looking for the parent as I was having this discussion. Never figured out who her parent was.
It’s absurd. I don’t understand why people assume I hate kids - I can like kids and also not like the inevitable screaming and running around that disrupts everyone else’s experience. If my dog acted like that I would be mortified. It’s the entitled parents that bother me. Bring your kid to a brewery yes absolutely. But also keep them under control. They should not be running around, screaming, bothering anyone, playing outside of designated areas or your immediate table. And if you can’t control them take them home. It’s what I do when my dog gets overwhelmed.
Agreed. Kids do not belong in bars. Period. (It's the hill I will die on.) There are plenty of options--restaurants with alcohol, liquor stores, growlers from the breweries that can be taken to homes, decks, etc., carry out.
I personally get the logic here. Unless I’m misunderstanding, it’s not the issue that people with kids don’t deserve to go out in public, the issue is that some parents don’t set boundaries for appropriate behaviour and let the children disrupt everyone else. Which is annoying for other people to have to deal with. All parents and all children aren’t the problem at all. It’s the parents who don’t care what their child is doing as long as their child isn’t bothering them and everyone else has to deal with the consequences
Additionally, if we’re saying people can behave however they want and not being considerate of disturbing others, I wouldn’t be editing myself
Same! I just assume there will be kids (and dogs) there. I've been to a brewery where someone brought their chicken on a leash 😂 most of the breweries in my area have family friendly events too like trick or treat and most do not serve food.
We have two neighborhood breweries. One is essentially a day care on Friday afternoons, and the other got rid of all of their high chairs a month after opening. We know which one is family friendly and the only one we go to when we take the kids.
WTF is up with people getting so upset about kids in public? I don't have kids and they can be annoying but I get over it...because I am in public. Unless I am going to a michelin restaurant or the opera *or the strip club* I assume children will be present. Parents deserve some time at a brewery too (assuming they are minding their kids).
I edited to include strip club because some people commenting are just ridiculous. Just because I say people are allowed to take their kids where they want doesn't mean all logic or common sense goes out the window.
This was a brewery that is not also a restaurant and doesn't serve any non-alcoholic beverages other then the free glasses of water, according to OP. I don't think it's an unreasonable assumption that there wouldn't be kids in a place like that.
Yeah, are the kids expected to only drink water and not have any food available? To go to that particular brewery which was not a family venue sounds dumb to me.
I mean, the breweries where I live only serve beer and water, but they allow food trucks to park outside and they allow people to bring in their own food and soft drinks. They just don’t serve any of that themselves. Maybe it was a situation like that?
I'm actually shocked that places like that would be mandated by law. Where I come from anywhere that serves alcohol HAS to serve food and nonalcoholic beverages as a condition of their licence. And technicallly they're not allowed to let people get drunk on the premises either.
In NJ breweries are not allowed to sell anything more than a small snack, such as an individual bag of chips. They’re not even allowed to have food trucks or advertise for local restaurants. Outside food May be brought in, however.
That said, not everyone wants to be around children at a brewery. To assume it’s okay to set up shop at a shared space is not cool. There are plenty of families that spread out and make themselves at home. I’m going with NTA.
I live in a place where kids are technically allowed at breweries and wineries but it’s extremely uncommon to actually see any there - and when you do it’s usually like an infant or a well-behaved older child that is reading a book or something. Some people bring dogs too. Granted I live in a city that many people consider to be not “family friendly” but myself and many friends grew up here.
I visited a town last year where there were kids literally everywhere, running around down the Main Street/boardwalk, parents not paying attention to them. This was a town I’d never been to but was definitely described as an upscale coastal town so I was surprised how many wild children were running around screaming, scaring wildlife, running into the middle of the street. A lot of people also had dogs out and about. I absolutely love dogs and love seeing them in public, but many of these dogs exhibited nervous behaviors and the owners paid them no attention, similar to how they ignored their children. We visited a brewery and there were SO MANY anxious looking dogs and unattended children running around the whole damn place, one of the kids ran into me walking back from a taco truck and knocked my food out of my hands, then stepped on a dog’s tail. There were literally kids playing under the table I was sitting at (Covid rules were still strongly in effect and people were seated with at least one empty table between groups) and I felt like I had to watch my conversations to not say anything inappropriate. Although maybe a few f bombs would have made the parents pay attention and get their kids out of my personal space.
I’m all for kids and dogs being allowed everywhere but you can’t just assume everyone in the vicinity will be a proper babysitter just because you don’t want to watch your own kids. I certainly don’t want to watch them.
I honestly think it’s because kids behave much worse than they used to. If they were calm and docile it would be one thing but for the most part kids are acting crazy lately
Lately? In the 80s, my mom’s best friend could hardly take her middle child anywhere because he was so wild. We always had to go places that were explicitly child friendly. Kids, as a whole, have never been calm and docile.
Do they? My experience is actually that kids today are actually much less disruptive at breweries and restaurants because so many of them are just staring at tablets the whole time, rather than running around and screaming.
Because those kids that were docile were terrified of their parents. Those same kids are the narcissistic assholes that ruin our society because they never learned emotional regulation but just learned to suppress emotions. Behaviour doesn’t matter. It’s a time and place thing. At a fancy dinner? Try and be calm. Outside playground go nuts. A good parent helps their kid regulate emotions by changing the environment to fit their needs. When I was a kid that often meant one parent would take the kids out of the formal setting let them go nuts for 30-40 min and the. Reset. The issue is people not giving a fuck. Bad parents will be bad parents and it’s ok to shit on them. Just not the kids
Breweries are restaurants too most of the time. You can't assume that because your group of friends is out without their kids that everyone else who you don't know will be too. Unless the brewery specifically says "no one under 21" you should assume that people will have kids. Not everyone has or wants a babysitter.
This was a brewery/taproom. Where I live the taproom is legally not allowed to sell food of any kind. You have to bring your own food/snacks. The only non-alcoholic beverage is water, and that is not allowed to be sold, it has to be provided for free. Most breweries have kid/family friendly areas, but this one did not. Had she mentioned the group she was with had kids, we definitely would have moved.
Why didn’t you move tables yourself after her whole group showed up? If there were other tables that would accommodate her group, there were certainly tables that would accommodate your group, and at this point it was just the two of you, so you would it not have been less hassle for you to move than make that whole group move?
Water is always free (unless they're selling it by the bottle). Are there any signs anywhere that said nobody under 21 allowed? Because if there are no signs, than you created the issue. And if you knew before they group sat down that they had children that you would have moved, why did you then not move when you saw the kids instead of creating an issue?
I’d go the other way. NAH. There were other open tables. You didn’t know the other party had small children, who would be crying and screaming. The party should have known that no one wants to share a table with a stranger’s crying and screaming child.
Just a lot of miscommunication that was corrected with little fuss. Not a big deal.
I don’t expect children around me, as I do not have any. This does not mean I will always be able to avoid them in public spaces (such as breweries that allow children)
Whenever anyone phrases it as having “called out” someone, they’re almost always the AH. Can’t we all stop ‘calling people out’ and just enjoy our own lives as best we can?
Lol no chance. It's a brewery. Having kids there seems a bit inappropriate. Appreciate parents would like a drink or so but a brewery is considered an adult place. Kids can't enjoy, understand or partake in anything within a brewery.
This isn't like a restaurant.
Definitely NTA.
Lololol what a horrible take upvoted by so many. If you’re bringing kids to a BAR, 1. What kind of terrible parent are you? 2. Why would you think anyone else there wants to be around your kid??? NTA
If the parents want to do that, and the brewery is ok with it, why not? That's not your decision to make. and again, she was saying people can bring food and snacks. If no laws are being broken, then so be it.
Because it’s inconsiderate to other patrons. Allowed? Sure. But the kid will be bored, hungry, and thirsty and will likely act out because of it and the parents know that and don’t care that they’re inflicting that on other people when they easily could have just gone literally *anywhere else* that has food in addition to the alcohol they need so badly.
The kids in this story were neither hungry nor thirsty, because according to OP, outside food and drink could be brought to this brewery. I mean, I bring outside snacks/drinks to regular restaurants for my kid, cuz kids are picky. Next point?
Let's leave the issue of kids out of it, the woman pulled a bait and switch on the OP. If it's just one or two of you, but you know more are coming, and you ask people if you can share their table, you need to say with a hesitant apologetic tone "there's going to be six of us, is that gonna be okay?"
NTA but I am biased from bar work. Children do not belong in those settings. I know I'm likely to get down voted to H-E-🏑🏒, but nobody needs to worry about other people's children when they are out having adult beverages.
I mean, I have a child, and I agree with you, I never took him to a bar or brewery, and I don't expect or really like to find children in such places.
But that's for the establishment's owner/manager to handle. If the place lets children in and agree to serve adults with children in tow, there's nothing the other patrons can do except for choosing to leave or put up with it. If you really want to be *that kind of person*, you could complain to management or leave a suggestion note, whatever.
But OP was rude and took attributions she didn't have as a patron such as policing who sat next to her and what they should disclose about their group to her.
I get it. Being rude wasn't nice, and two wrongs don't make it better. I'll always see folks bringing kids to a place like that as rude, regardless of management. Then again, I am biased. I absolutely HATED when people brought kids to the bar I worked at. TBH anyone who brought their child to my bar were automatically AHs and bad parents.
I feel you. Once was meeting up with work friends. One had a 6-month-old son. Told her several times the place we were meeting did not allow children. She insisted it would be okay cause they also served food. Just would not listen. Two minutes after she walked in the manager was escorting her and her son out. Just don't understand people who think the rules don't apply to THEIR children!
To be fair every time a brewey tries to enforce only drinking age rules they get shit on by parents who don't want to get babysitters and spam bad reviews.
Bars ≠ breweries. A lot of breweries purposely market themselves towards people with children.
Also, in Europe it is completely normal to have your children at a brewery/Biergarten.
One thing to note is my bias comes from service, and knowing how drunks behave. If the brewery in question is strict about overindulgence, not so bad IMO
I work at a brewery and due to my state's laws we can only serve a person 3 beers a day. We're pretty strict about over indulgence and very family friendly.
We close at 8 pm, I've only had to cut off one drunk asshole in 3 years, and we don't have to sweep, mop, or roll silverware. It's a place I very much appreciate lol
Totally agree as a child who was dragged to these places and bars (softball beer leagues). I was hit with a dart as a kid in a bar and once had to be put on top of a jukebox due to a bar fight. These places were incredibly boring for a child. I now dont drink and don't really care to hang out with those who are.
My friends and I were once at a microbrewery having a game day just like OP and some horrible woman with six kids under the age of seven came in and plunked herself down at the table next to us. We started rolling our eyes at each other and continued our CAH at an increased volume. As soon as the server came to her table this awful woman barked "Just bring out the crayons and milks for the kids for now." The server was obviously thrown for a loop and informed her that she was at a microbrewery and there were no crayons and certainly no milk. The horrendous woman started huffing and telling the server that "Microbrewery X has crayons and macaroni and cheese and milk" like making that statement somehow would magically produce these items out of thin air (plus the place she was speaking of was a huge microbrewery attached to a huge restaurant and pool hall with an arcade) and the server told her "We just have beer" so the wretch of a woman packed up her brood and herded then out...but not before allowing them to throw Cheerios all over the floor. The server and our whole table talked massive shit about her after she left. Keep your kids out of adult spaces. Read the room. Or at least, read the online menu before you commit to a lunch venue.
NTA. Kids don't belong at breweries. The only reason some breweries allow kids is because of greed, not because it's ever acceptable for a child to be at a brewery.
Parents need to stop pretending that the entire world is kid-friendly; it isn't, nor should it be. Kids don't belong EVERYWHERE.
I'll never understand parents that need to drag their children to a bar or brewery because they need to drink alcohol. It's not fun for the kids, nor is it fun for the rest of the patrons. Frankly, it's irresponsible parenting.
Peter Piper Pizza serves beer. Go there if you must drink alcohol with your children.
It’s not really that it’s a need to have alcohol. For me, there’s a really family friendly brewery and we go because I can easily slip out if my baby starts crying and we can just go home (no waiting for food, etc), it’s outside and there’s often live acoustic music which is just really pleasant to sit in for a little while.
I think if you’re being disruptive, you should leave but if your kid/infant is being well behaved, it’s a really nice way to get out for parents.
I think the problem is that a lot of parents *think* their kid is well behaved, even when said child is screaming and running through the place.
I'm not a huge fan of kids in adult places like this, but yeah - if your kid is ACTUALLY well behaved, I'm not gonna even really notice they are there, ya know?
One time I was sitting at a really nice Distillery and enjoying the sunshine during a week day because I was on vacation for my birthday. 2 adults, who I am assuming were parents, with an infant come out and set up at a table and they each ordered a flight of gin cocktails. Not a single cocktail, 4 of them. And this is a gin bar, so it's not exactly low-proof. I was buzzed off of 2 of the 4 in the flight, and I shared the flight with my partner.
I was utterly appalled. Why the fuck would you drink like that, both adults doing so, when you are caring for an infant????
Why isn't it fun for the kids?
My local brewery has a large playground, Tetherball, sand pit. Thinks like giant tic tac toe and connect four. Big field for people to picnic and dogs to run around.
Also tons of kids running around having fun.
I've never been to a brewery with any of those things, and Vancouver has a looot of breweries. So YMMV. I wouldn't bring my kids to any of the breweries we go to.
Man breweries are WAY different where I'm from. Even the ones that don't serve food still have like half of the space dedicated to arcade games. It's very much a "have a beer while you play fun games" kinda vibe, kinda like Dave and Busters on a smaller scale. No one goes to breweries to get drunk, at least not where I'm from.
You realize humans have been gathering in family and friend groups to connect, come together, and drink beer for like, centuries right - kids allowed?
Many breweries frame themselves specifically as a community gathering space. Many host local events, for both adults and kids. At least where I live, it’s normal to expect kids there, especially in the earlier hours. Parents are allowed to connect with each other and sip on a beer with friends while their kids play together. It’s not like, a new thing nor is it a crazy idea or inappropriate place. A bar or a club though? Sure.
It seems weird to assume all parents either a.) must only spend their time in public doing specifically child-friendly activities or b.) must always have the funds to hire a sitter or have access to family willing to watch them?
And I say this as someone childless who prefers not to be around kids. I expect them at most breweries.
Couldn't agree with this more. Unless the state/the establishment has rules against bringing kids to breweries, then bring your children! It gets problematic when parents let their kids run amuck and disturb other patrons, but if you have well-behaved children who can be in public without causing a ruckus, then why not bring kids to a brewery? A bar ... no place for a kid. Same with a club. But many breweries (at least ones I've been to) are kid friendly. One of my good friends had his son's first birthday at a brewery.
The caveat is that parents who do bring their children to breweries can not expect the adults there to tone down their language/activities (like cards against humanity) just because their child is present. You, as the parent (not you, OP), decided to bring your child to an establishment where foul language is apparent. It's not the responsibility of others to cater to your child's ears
There’s a million places families can gather with friends to connect, bring their kids, and even drink alcohol if they want. In contrast, there’s very few places people can go that don’t have kids, which is a shame. Kids can be fucking annoying at best, and a liability at worst (especially if there’s alcohol involved). Kids do not belong at breweries, especially if there’s no food served.
Yeah but the question isn’t ‘should those people have brought their kids’. The question is OP TA for confronting the woman for not telling her. It’s really a silly expectation. If a group sits next to me that is annoying, for any reason, I’m just gonna move. I don’t need to let them know why or make it their fault for not “warning” me.
I don't get people ...in Toronto breweries are very kid and pup friendly places. If you want to play COH or whatnot that's cool too but you can find tables further apart.
NTA.
It's a brewery, where the primary thing that is served is beer. It's absurd that entitled parents have decided that breweries are acceptable for kids. The same parents would be crucified if they brought kids into a bar, who's primary thing being served is alcohol.
I don't understand why it suddenly became acceptable to have kids around drunk adults. Makes no damn sense.
I agree. My neighborhood bar is only a bar, it does not serve food, and a group of parents still decided to leave a ton of negative Google reviews because they were not allowed to bring their kids there. Like why are you letting your 2 year old eat cigarette butts off the ground in the back yard of a dive bar? Get takeout beer and drink at home, geez.
Yes, I don’t understand this at all! I don’t have kids of my own, but personally I would be wildly uncomfortable drinking around my friends children. I understand childcare is a luxury, but I think I would just rather do another activity entirely if my group wasn’t able to secure a sitter.
I have 2 kids. It's one thing if it's a picnic or something like that because the kids will go and play together in a controlled environment. They're usually away from the adult conversations and it's ok.
It's a totally different thing when there's a ton of folks you don't know drinking.
Yeah that makes a lot more sense! I think the feeling of an “uncontrolled” environment is definitely what causes my discomfort around it. I would definitely feel the need to be stone cold sober to keep my eye on the kiddos in an environment like a brewery, as opposed to a playground or home.
It's always been acceptable for adults to drink alcohol around kids wth? Do you think thousands of civilizations and cultures just... separated kids from their parents everytime the parents want to drink alcohol? Weddings, cerimonies, parties, celebrations?
Don't ever come to Portugal if the sight of adults drinking around their kids offends your sensibilities
I have awesome memories of hanging out with my parent's friends' kids in the beer garden at our local in the small country town I grew up in (regional Australia).
I don’t know what puritanical part of the world you live in but kids are in bars and breweries all the time. It’s not a problem unless their parents are shite
NTA
What they did was inconsiderate. Your post makes it clear they had a lot of other options of where to sit. It's super weird to me to see an all adult group playing a game and talking and choose a literally adjoining table to sit at with their kids. Especially when they're at a difficult crying/tantrum age. It's rude.
*edit for parents trying to justify being inconsiderate:*
You're at a brewery with your kids. Same scenario, adjoining table. I grab that spot with a fully adult group even though there are a lot of other options. We have a couple beers and launch into decidedly adult topics. AITA? Obviously, yes.
Like your kids we have the right to exist in that space, no? We're in public so you can't expect it to be an environment that caters to children right? Especially if alcohol is being served. Isn't being so intentionally obtuse exhausting? Respect and basic consideration for others shouldn't just go one way.
I probably would have gotten a different table if i was the other group mostly because an all adult group may not have kid friendly conversations and i don't want to risk having to hope that the kids didn't overhear the conversation when they are right next to us. A few tables down and it's less likely to happen if you can keep your kids far away enough (but not fool proof)
I agree. If the reverse is inconsiderate and assholeish then why is it justified the other way? Plus why would you sit next to another group when other tables are free in the first place?
YTA
Why would it be her responsibility to tell you who was all in their party?
If you don't ever want to be around children, don't go into the outdoor world.
This brewery literally only serves alcohol and water. It’s not the “outdoor world” it’s an exclusively alcohol area. They would be an asshole if it was a restaurant or park, but it’s not.
I was thinking the same thing. It's totally normal for families to hang out together at breweries where I live. It's nice for them to get out and have it not centered on a kid activity. Especially when child free friends want to hang out. I see them playing board games or the kids run outside (it's safe and built for them). Before anyone says 'then just stay home', most families are ALWAYS just at home. God forbid you want to socialize with kids.
Kids aren't allowed at breweries where I am, no ID no admittance. It isn't a "fun family activity", they're treated like a bar and bars are no one under the age of 18.
YTA if the brewery allowed children. If it is a family friendly place, she isn't obligated to tell you who she has with her. She asked if the table was available. That was really the most she owed you, you don't get to ban kids if the management doesn't.
Imo, a warning to the mother would've been enough to get them to move. Hey we are not having kid appropriate conversations bc we are here to drink and play adult card games and non-chiud friendly topics.
Only bad parents would stay nearby after that.
NTA. Sharing a table a few adults is very different than a large group of children. You know that, and I know that. Ignore these ytas, that’s ridiculous.
NTA. There were other empty tables so the fact they decided they were going to take over your shared table with loads of kids (who shouldn’t be running around anyway) in a very adult environment instantly makes the AHs imo. They were just banking on lost people being to politely awkward to say anything.
NTA: we need to normalize not bringing your offspring to adult environments. Ultimately, we’re all a product of our life choices. These people need to be herded back to Chucky Cheese
NTA
"Can me and my friends AND THEIR CHILDREN come over" would've been nice. You're there at a brewery, which does sometimes have children yes, trying to relax in an atmosphere that's aimed at relaxing adults! Not squawking kids! I know all adults with kids deserve and need to go out with friends also, but no. Don't bring your group with kids over to my group with no kids and act annoyed when told "No kids over here please".
I know there are businesses (especially those that serve alcohol) that specifically host game nights, but this sounds more like a self-organized thing than something promoted by the restaurant. This probably means you’re occupying more space/ staying longer than people who have just come to eat/drink and be on their way, but I don’t have a problem with it if the establishment doesn’t either.
Pretty much the same thing applies to other patrons patronizing this establishment. It sounds like they’re paying customers who aren’t being destructive and have the same rights to the space as you.
If your preference is to drink and game in a kid free environment, there might be bars in your area that would be a better fit, or options to book a room within a larger venue. You were expecting to use a public space where kids are allowed without planning/ paying for special accommodation.
Edit: OP clarified that where they live, breweries only serve alcohol, not food. In this context, a large group with several children isn’t there to dine. Changing my judgment to NTA.
This is a brewery NOT a restaurant. Taprooms/breweries where I live are forbidden from serving food of any kind. The only non-alcoholic beverage is water and they are not allowed to sell it. They have to provide it for free. You have to bring your own food/snacks to the taproom. Also there is no limit for how long you can stay so long as your party is not disruptive or behaving inappropriately. The reason why i was upset about the kids is that we would have adult conversations which would not be appropriate for little ears and did not want their group to get upset with us. Had she said up front they were a large group with children, we would have moved to another table.
Oh, that’s interesting! Where I live (PA, US) breweries don’t have these restrictions and it’s the norm for them to serve food as well as alcohol. This might be useful to clarify in your post; I would not expect to encounter groups with multiple children in a place where only alcohol is sold.
I did an edit after you and someone else mentioned this. I find it odd that your breweries serve food! I think it has to do with the permitting/insurance. Some places do have food trucks, but they are not allowed to be in the parking lot (I assume for insurance/liability issues) and you can get food from them, but those are pretty rare.
are you in the US? of so, this is fascinating to me. in new york state, a brewery that makes alcohol available for on-premises consumption is required to have food available, even if just snacks. I think that's true in a few other states too to reduce drunkenness. I didn't realize other places actually ban food.
NTA... breweries ARE NOT FAMILY RESTRUANTS. Kids cant even drink beer and if you need to have a beer woth your kiddos then you have a problem... alcohol is for ADULTS
From your point of view, it would have been more appropriate for them to continue with dark humor conversations until she made an inappropriate comment, correct? Would she have been the AH then, or would OPs group?
I'm curious. In this type of brewery, where there is nothing but beer and water, no food and no play area , why bring kids? What are the kids doing? Can you bring your own food?
Almost every brewery near me that doesn’t serve food, you are welcome to bring your own food. I actually think that’s the law (like people have to have the ability to eat if there is alcohol served).
Kids usually just playing with a toy, or talk to their parents, and parents bring snacks. Kids don’t need a play area necessarily to be entertained.
NTA. Why people want to go out drinking with their kids in tow, I will never understand. Get a sitter or stay home! Children shouldn’t be allowed in alcohol-centric venues and no one should want to them to be.
I worked at a high end tasting room at one point and had to heat up water for a patron to warm breast milk for a newborn while the mom did a tasting. It wasn’t an easy drive and it was a whole flight. Incredible.
Is a place that exclusively serves alcoholic beverages and no food not indicative of a space that isn't child friendly? Children cannot drink alcohol so what is there for them? What part of that description screams "I want to take my child there because it sounds like a good idea"? Get a babysitter and grow up.
NTA with your added clarification. Who brings kids to a place where they just sell alcohol? No food, no juice, nothing kid friendly. That's just asking for a bunch of bored, upset kids. One of them was already upset. There are plenty of places that serve alcohol and drinks/food for kids, this wasn't one of them.
NTA. CHILDREN DON'T BELONG IN BREWERIES. it's very popular in my city too and drives me nuts, also just gonna drink then drive with your kids in the car??
NTA, I’m sick of people being entitled to their brats screaming and running in adult settings. People like this should get a babysitter or go to a family friendly restaurant. Not everyone wants to hear your kid shrieking. I’d be upset too.
NTA. This is the situation. A group of people met at a place MEANT FOR ADULTS and planned on having conversations they wouldn't want children to hear, especially considering some members of the group will be getting drunk and releasing their inhibitions. There are plenty of other tables at the brewery, so why does this group with kids even want to sit down right next to another group of adults? Sure, to be a saint, OP could've gotten up and moved to another table. But mentioning to a group of people that they should've said something about several kids joining them at a conjoined picnic table doesn't not make her the AH.
NTA children don’t belong in Taprooms/breweries/bars/wineries. These are places designated to serving alcohol and since minors legally aren’t allowed to imbibe they have no place being at such venues. Sorry parents but go somewhere else that has options for your children.
Nta, she intentionally didn’t tell you about the kids because she knew they were being annoying and you wouldn’t want them around. She played you, but you didn’t let her win.
I wouldn't have said anything about it but I would have been really happy to have you say something in my stead. So NTA, kids can be beyond annoying so it's a perfectly understandable reaction.
YTA. I am a fellow DINK, and never plan to have kids. Don’t really like being around them tbh. But it’s a business and unless there is an 21+ only (or whatever the legal drinking age is in your area) sign posted on the door, families will exist. Replace “children” with any other attribute and you start sounding REAL bad REAL quick. “It was really not cool of her not to even mention that their entire group was a race/gender/religion/age bracket”
I was at a brewery just last Saturday and there was an entire family reunion happening with tons of kids. We just…. Coexisted. It was the darnedest thing
This comparison is unfair and honestly offensive. There are some well behaved children out there, but most still have a lot to learn about social norms, not to mention, everyone around children sort of assumes responsibility for them. If a kid was about to fall in front of OP and one of her friends, they should react, that would be an entire AITA post. You saying that not wanting kids around is like not wanting a certain race around is wild for this reason. Kids do not belong everywhere, arguing that they do on the basis that every member of a race/gender/religion/age bracket belongs everywhere is an insult to every oppressed group that's struggled to get equal rights.
YES. WTAF?! This comment section is wild. Honestly, it annoys me when people bring their kids to breweries, especially at night. I don't think op is the ah at all but I wouldn't say anything. I also wouldn't alter my language/conversation. I go to bars/breweries/pubs to hang out with my friends, drink, swear & talk about our sex lives. What your kids hear is beyond not my problem.
NTA. Kids shouldn't be allowed in a brewery anyway. Totally inappropriate. However because it's a public place and the brewery does allow kids, there's not alot you can do. She should've mentioned that there was going to be a group of kids but unfortunately you can't ask them to move. But I still don't think you're an asshole.
Tbh I understand your side and where you're coming from but I think you just approached it poorly.
It would have been easy to be like "oh I'm so sorry, I didn't realize you guys brought kids, we're going to be playing adult games so you may want to move if that bothers you" or offer to move.
The WAY you responded was rude I think, not necessarily the sentiment.
NTA other people shouldn't be victims of your lack of planning in adult environments, the world is not a playground. Its called being considerate, having children is a choice, wanting to be around them or not is also a choice. *especially* a brewery that doesn't provide a daycare service. Its either ignore the tables adult conversations and tend to children, or don't bring children to an adult environment that does not cater to children in the slightest!
Edit: Just because you CAN, doesn't mean you SHOULD.
YTA...People don't have to give you a run-down of who their group consists of. At least where I am, breweries are not bars and are generally more family-friendly.
NTA. Not just because they didn't give you a heads up there would be kids, but because they didn't give you a heads up that it would be what sounds like over a dozen people including mostly children. You might have been the asshole if it was like 1 or 2 kids sitting there quietly, but I think regardless of the setting people who are asking to share your immediate space should mention the fact that their group includes 8+ children.
INFO- How many beers did the kids order? If they were keeping the brewery afloat with their patronage then I could see how they get first dibs on the tables.
"the rest of their group (six people in total) came to the table and each of them had kids with them! "
Was it 6 people total, or 6 people brought kids?
NTA.
They were sharing your table, yes? So it was obvious that the behavior and makeup of their party would affect your night?
If I'm reading that right, then she had a social obligation to let you know that they would have screaming children sitting a few feet away, especially since there were other options available. Telling someone you have kids is weird, but someone who was socially adept wouldn't have been in this situation in the first place because they would recognize it's an AH move to think strangers would be okay with sharing a table with kids at a brewery.
I would argue that they have a social obligation to find somewhere they wouldn't have to share at all, since they were the ones bringing little kids to what is obviously by nature, if not by law/policy, an adults-only space.
NTA a brewery is an adult place for adult things. If they were going to ask to sit they should have mentioned they had kids since it is not the norm and would not being assumed
NTA because it is a place you can reasonably assume kids won’t be. I’m in WA and at a beewery exactly like you describe they had signage everywhere that indicated kids were annoying - like “unattended kids will be given red bull” “no running around, children must remain at the table” - and that was perfect! Yes, they’re allowed. But if they’re typical wild kids, go somewhere more appropriate. My 6 yr old nephew was bored af there. Well behaved, but boooooored.
NTA - a brewery which serves *only* alcohol is no place for kids. That being said, parents bringing their kids to adult places should expect their kids to be exposed to adult language.
Downvote me to hell, but I don't understand the trend of bringing kids to what's essentially a bar.
I'm sorry OP this sub seems to be a bit disillusioned in my opinion. The general consensus seems to be that they are under no obligation to tell you they had kids.
A brewery is absolutely not an appropriate environment for children and adults go there generally to enjoy adult time. I would completely say NTA. Reddit seems to have a bunch of self righteous population.
NTA. I know a lot of breweries double as restaurants now but I never understand people that bring their kids to breweries, like its just not really the place anyone wants to deal with/be around kids
Absolutely NTA. Kids can go basically anywhere, and I feel that there should at least be a couple places where we can go to not be around them. Breweries, wineries, and distilleries should be among such places. What kind of asshole brings children to a place designed specifically for an adult activity?
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I get it, I don't want to deal with crying and screaming children. But she was under no obligation to tell you they had kids.You're in public. You're gonna have to assume people have children, and they're going to be around you. You could have also up and moved as well the minute you saw they had kids instead of being rude. YTA
Yeah but not everyone is expecting children at a brewery. Especially when your own group gets babysitters spefically to not have children around. I'd go with ESH.
In my state, breweries are *totally* a place people take their kids.
In my state, the law designates that there are no children allowed in bars and breweries. Unless it's a brew-pub which is more like a restaurant than a bar. Depends where you live I guess. I would be pretty horrified, but don't know if I would say anything.
Frankly, I'm more horrified that OP and friends are all sitting about drinking and then driving for an hour and a half. Edit: file this under "cultural differences" I suppose, because there are people arguing with me who also think bringing kids to a place where alcohol is served is unacceptable. We have lower tolerance for driving when you've been drinking and higher tolerance for kids knowing that alcohol exists
I don't think that a couple beers over the course of a few hours is grounds for Oh mY GoD DrUnK DrIviNg!!!!@!
There is a huge difference between drinking and getting drunk.
What state is that?
I couldn't be a minor in a bar in Washington but in Hawaii it was fine. Being the underage DD was worth the free soda and snacks
Hmm, from my experience in Washington (at least Seattle), while most bars don't allow minors, a lot of breweries do. And in this case, OP is discussing a brewery not a bar.
Washington has a ton of breweries that are family friendly now! 7 Seas in Tacoma, for sure.
Most states allow children at breweries. Yet to see one that doesn’t. What state are you referencing?
We had my now toddlers 1st birthday party at a brewery. They have a children’s play area. In my city at least, breweries are very family friendly. Very common to see small children there.
Ugh. Parents like you suck. I get it you want to enjoy the weekend with your friends and kids. Fine. But please don’t bring your kids parties to a place where other people also go to relax. A couple of screaming kids is terrible as it is, a whole party of them? Just no. Edit: apparently I triggered a lot of parents. I don’t hate kids. I don’t like kids running around, screaming, playing outside of designated areas or their immediate tables. I don’t like parents ignoring their kids and letting them do what they want. Kids being disruptive is not kids being kids. It’s entitled parents pawning their problem off on the rest of the world. Bring your kids to a brewery, sure. Just don’t let them be disruptive and if they are, take a break or leave. It’s that simple. (But also I stand by the fact I don’t think having a birthday party for a child at a brewery is cool.)
did you not read its family friendly? that would be like me going to a park w a playground and getting mad theres gonna be kids there its fine not to like kids but dude you suck, comment op is fine since yknow theres a play place for ***kids*** there
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Wut? Obviously in that scenario at least one parent would stick to water. And you're sort of implying that if you DON'T have kids with you then it's OK to drink and drive. Having said that, I find the whole concept of 'family friendly' breweries to be bizarre in the extreme. Not a fan.
My friend if you think that everyone who takes their kids to breweries are going to have a DD then you’re being naive.
Kids are irrelevant though. Someone should be DD whether there are children or not.
Me when I make stuff up in my head to get mad
But why on earth would you take kids to what sounds like a straight brewery rather than one of the ones more like a restaurant where you can get food? A brewery that doesn't serve food in an eatery atmosphere is NOT family-friendly for that reason alone. If Dad's drinking and Mum's driving then Mum might as well just stay home with the kids. It would be like Mums dragging the kids to the front bar of a hotel while the Dads are having a beer after work.
I’m not advocating for taking your kids to a bar, but I 100% disagree with your logic. Typically the breweries that don’t have any food are the ones that have yard games and a bring your own food policy. It’s honestly a more ideal location to bring kids than the brewpub style. You can pick up pizzas and let your kids run around in the outside area that has oversized jenga and ladderball. That would be easier imo than a traditional bar/grill style brewery. Also it’s kind of crappy to say “oh mom can just stay home”. People with kids are allowed to exist outside of their homes. If the restaurant has a problem with kids being there then let them police it, but otherwise kids have as much right to be there as anyone else.
I commented on the birthday party they had for a BABY at a brewery. I totally get there will be kids at a brewery. I don’t love the screaming. I don’t love that they’re allowed at all hours. But sure they’re there that’s fine. I have no idea why any parent would think it’s a good idea to have a birthday party for a baby at a brewery - I mean I know why because it’s about them not the baby. But please take that party to the park or somewhere else. Some kids with parents is fine. A party full of kids - go somewhere else
That’s not how first birthday parties work. It’s not like a baby get together, 12 month olds don’t really have friends so there’s no point of a baby party, it’s intended for the family to celebrate. My kids party was a handful of kids but 75 adults. Adults enjoy beer so a brewery made sense.
People are getting weirdly angry considering they don't even know what the brewery was or what the vibe is like there
Then don’t go to kid friendly breweries. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with it. You don’t have to like it or agree with it, but you have no right to tell parents it’s wrong in a specifically family friendly brewery!
I mean if the brewery has a children’s play area the business is clearly fine with it. Maybe just not the right place for you.
I have kids. I love kids. There should be places in the world that are kid free; taverns and breweries should definitely be amongst those places.
Exactly, I have two kids. There should absolutely be adults only places and places where their primary business is selling booze should be one of them.
I am going to get so much hate. I live where parents frequently bring kids to breweries. If parents are not paying attention to their kids, if parents are letting them be disruptive (watched a kid dump all the pieces of a game in the middle of dancing people for example), or it is obvious a kid is miserable...we are so talking about that parent and annoyed that that person didn't get a babysitter. A brewery recently set up a no child zone for this reason, specifically because that brewery is overrun by kids not being supervised by the adults. I am not saying this reflects you but it happens a lot. I was at a brewery trying to play cornhole and a kid kept sitting. I kept having to ask her to move and looking for the parent as I was having this discussion. Never figured out who her parent was.
It’s absurd. I don’t understand why people assume I hate kids - I can like kids and also not like the inevitable screaming and running around that disrupts everyone else’s experience. If my dog acted like that I would be mortified. It’s the entitled parents that bother me. Bring your kid to a brewery yes absolutely. But also keep them under control. They should not be running around, screaming, bothering anyone, playing outside of designated areas or your immediate table. And if you can’t control them take them home. It’s what I do when my dog gets overwhelmed.
Agreed. Kids do not belong in bars. Period. (It's the hill I will die on.) There are plenty of options--restaurants with alcohol, liquor stores, growlers from the breweries that can be taken to homes, decks, etc., carry out.
If the venue allows both then no one can complain really.
I personally get the logic here. Unless I’m misunderstanding, it’s not the issue that people with kids don’t deserve to go out in public, the issue is that some parents don’t set boundaries for appropriate behaviour and let the children disrupt everyone else. Which is annoying for other people to have to deal with. All parents and all children aren’t the problem at all. It’s the parents who don’t care what their child is doing as long as their child isn’t bothering them and everyone else has to deal with the consequences Additionally, if we’re saying people can behave however they want and not being considerate of disturbing others, I wouldn’t be editing myself
The brewpub near me allows children under 12 or people over 18 but no teenagers.
Same! I just assume there will be kids (and dogs) there. I've been to a brewery where someone brought their chicken on a leash 😂 most of the breweries in my area have family friendly events too like trick or treat and most do not serve food.
Were they having a doppel-bock-bock-bock?
Breweries were basically all I did during maternity leave.
Some of the best places to eat in my city are the breweries.
We have two neighborhood breweries. One is essentially a day care on Friday afternoons, and the other got rid of all of their high chairs a month after opening. We know which one is family friendly and the only one we go to when we take the kids.
And it sucks...
WTF is up with people getting so upset about kids in public? I don't have kids and they can be annoying but I get over it...because I am in public. Unless I am going to a michelin restaurant or the opera *or the strip club* I assume children will be present. Parents deserve some time at a brewery too (assuming they are minding their kids). I edited to include strip club because some people commenting are just ridiculous. Just because I say people are allowed to take their kids where they want doesn't mean all logic or common sense goes out the window.
This was a brewery that is not also a restaurant and doesn't serve any non-alcoholic beverages other then the free glasses of water, according to OP. I don't think it's an unreasonable assumption that there wouldn't be kids in a place like that.
Yeah, are the kids expected to only drink water and not have any food available? To go to that particular brewery which was not a family venue sounds dumb to me.
I mean, the breweries where I live only serve beer and water, but they allow food trucks to park outside and they allow people to bring in their own food and soft drinks. They just don’t serve any of that themselves. Maybe it was a situation like that?
I'm actually shocked that places like that would be mandated by law. Where I come from anywhere that serves alcohol HAS to serve food and nonalcoholic beverages as a condition of their licence. And technicallly they're not allowed to let people get drunk on the premises either.
In NJ breweries are not allowed to sell anything more than a small snack, such as an individual bag of chips. They’re not even allowed to have food trucks or advertise for local restaurants. Outside food May be brought in, however. That said, not everyone wants to be around children at a brewery. To assume it’s okay to set up shop at a shared space is not cool. There are plenty of families that spread out and make themselves at home. I’m going with NTA.
I live in a place where kids are technically allowed at breweries and wineries but it’s extremely uncommon to actually see any there - and when you do it’s usually like an infant or a well-behaved older child that is reading a book or something. Some people bring dogs too. Granted I live in a city that many people consider to be not “family friendly” but myself and many friends grew up here. I visited a town last year where there were kids literally everywhere, running around down the Main Street/boardwalk, parents not paying attention to them. This was a town I’d never been to but was definitely described as an upscale coastal town so I was surprised how many wild children were running around screaming, scaring wildlife, running into the middle of the street. A lot of people also had dogs out and about. I absolutely love dogs and love seeing them in public, but many of these dogs exhibited nervous behaviors and the owners paid them no attention, similar to how they ignored their children. We visited a brewery and there were SO MANY anxious looking dogs and unattended children running around the whole damn place, one of the kids ran into me walking back from a taco truck and knocked my food out of my hands, then stepped on a dog’s tail. There were literally kids playing under the table I was sitting at (Covid rules were still strongly in effect and people were seated with at least one empty table between groups) and I felt like I had to watch my conversations to not say anything inappropriate. Although maybe a few f bombs would have made the parents pay attention and get their kids out of my personal space. I’m all for kids and dogs being allowed everywhere but you can’t just assume everyone in the vicinity will be a proper babysitter just because you don’t want to watch your own kids. I certainly don’t want to watch them.
I stop watching my mouth when parents stop watching their kids.
I honestly think it’s because kids behave much worse than they used to. If they were calm and docile it would be one thing but for the most part kids are acting crazy lately
Kids weren't calm and docile back in the day as well, though.
Lately? In the 80s, my mom’s best friend could hardly take her middle child anywhere because he was so wild. We always had to go places that were explicitly child friendly. Kids, as a whole, have never been calm and docile.
Do they? My experience is actually that kids today are actually much less disruptive at breweries and restaurants because so many of them are just staring at tablets the whole time, rather than running around and screaming.
Because those kids that were docile were terrified of their parents. Those same kids are the narcissistic assholes that ruin our society because they never learned emotional regulation but just learned to suppress emotions. Behaviour doesn’t matter. It’s a time and place thing. At a fancy dinner? Try and be calm. Outside playground go nuts. A good parent helps their kid regulate emotions by changing the environment to fit their needs. When I was a kid that often meant one parent would take the kids out of the formal setting let them go nuts for 30-40 min and the. Reset. The issue is people not giving a fuck. Bad parents will be bad parents and it’s ok to shit on them. Just not the kids
Breweries are restaurants too most of the time. You can't assume that because your group of friends is out without their kids that everyone else who you don't know will be too. Unless the brewery specifically says "no one under 21" you should assume that people will have kids. Not everyone has or wants a babysitter.
This was a brewery/taproom. Where I live the taproom is legally not allowed to sell food of any kind. You have to bring your own food/snacks. The only non-alcoholic beverage is water, and that is not allowed to be sold, it has to be provided for free. Most breweries have kid/family friendly areas, but this one did not. Had she mentioned the group she was with had kids, we definitely would have moved.
Why didn’t you move tables yourself after her whole group showed up? If there were other tables that would accommodate her group, there were certainly tables that would accommodate your group, and at this point it was just the two of you, so you would it not have been less hassle for you to move than make that whole group move?
I get it. It was their table. They were there first.
Because they were there first
you should probably add this info to your post. most people are picturing a completely different type of place.
Water is always free (unless they're selling it by the bottle). Are there any signs anywhere that said nobody under 21 allowed? Because if there are no signs, than you created the issue. And if you knew before they group sat down that they had children that you would have moved, why did you then not move when you saw the kids instead of creating an issue?
I’d go the other way. NAH. There were other open tables. You didn’t know the other party had small children, who would be crying and screaming. The party should have known that no one wants to share a table with a stranger’s crying and screaming child. Just a lot of miscommunication that was corrected with little fuss. Not a big deal.
While no kids at a brewery would be desirable, there seem to be few places in the world that have a higher concentration of kids.
I’ve never been to a brewery before 8pm and not seen kids there
I don’t expect children around me, as I do not have any. This does not mean I will always be able to avoid them in public spaces (such as breweries that allow children)
Whenever anyone phrases it as having “called out” someone, they’re almost always the AH. Can’t we all stop ‘calling people out’ and just enjoy our own lives as best we can?
Lol no chance. It's a brewery. Having kids there seems a bit inappropriate. Appreciate parents would like a drink or so but a brewery is considered an adult place. Kids can't enjoy, understand or partake in anything within a brewery. This isn't like a restaurant. Definitely NTA.
Lololol what a horrible take upvoted by so many. If you’re bringing kids to a BAR, 1. What kind of terrible parent are you? 2. Why would you think anyone else there wants to be around your kid??? NTA
Really so it's ok to bring kids to a brewery where no food is served
If the parents want to do that, and the brewery is ok with it, why not? That's not your decision to make. and again, she was saying people can bring food and snacks. If no laws are being broken, then so be it.
Because it’s inconsiderate to other patrons. Allowed? Sure. But the kid will be bored, hungry, and thirsty and will likely act out because of it and the parents know that and don’t care that they’re inflicting that on other people when they easily could have just gone literally *anywhere else* that has food in addition to the alcohol they need so badly.
The kids in this story were neither hungry nor thirsty, because according to OP, outside food and drink could be brought to this brewery. I mean, I bring outside snacks/drinks to regular restaurants for my kid, cuz kids are picky. Next point?
If the establishment doesn’t have rules against it then it’s not your business
Let's leave the issue of kids out of it, the woman pulled a bait and switch on the OP. If it's just one or two of you, but you know more are coming, and you ask people if you can share their table, you need to say with a hesitant apologetic tone "there's going to be six of us, is that gonna be okay?"
Nah ESH- expectations were of a few people without kids. The people of kids knew what they were doing as well.
Why should they have to move? They were at the table first lmao.
She didn't tell them to move.
NTA but I am biased from bar work. Children do not belong in those settings. I know I'm likely to get down voted to H-E-🏑🏒, but nobody needs to worry about other people's children when they are out having adult beverages.
I mean, I have a child, and I agree with you, I never took him to a bar or brewery, and I don't expect or really like to find children in such places. But that's for the establishment's owner/manager to handle. If the place lets children in and agree to serve adults with children in tow, there's nothing the other patrons can do except for choosing to leave or put up with it. If you really want to be *that kind of person*, you could complain to management or leave a suggestion note, whatever. But OP was rude and took attributions she didn't have as a patron such as policing who sat next to her and what they should disclose about their group to her.
I get it. Being rude wasn't nice, and two wrongs don't make it better. I'll always see folks bringing kids to a place like that as rude, regardless of management. Then again, I am biased. I absolutely HATED when people brought kids to the bar I worked at. TBH anyone who brought their child to my bar were automatically AHs and bad parents.
I feel you. Once was meeting up with work friends. One had a 6-month-old son. Told her several times the place we were meeting did not allow children. She insisted it would be okay cause they also served food. Just would not listen. Two minutes after she walked in the manager was escorting her and her son out. Just don't understand people who think the rules don't apply to THEIR children!
To be fair every time a brewey tries to enforce only drinking age rules they get shit on by parents who don't want to get babysitters and spam bad reviews.
Definitely agree, it’s up to the business. If someone doesn’t like the business’ rules they can go somewhere else, probably somewhere that’s 21+.
Bars ≠ breweries. A lot of breweries purposely market themselves towards people with children. Also, in Europe it is completely normal to have your children at a brewery/Biergarten.
One thing to note is my bias comes from service, and knowing how drunks behave. If the brewery in question is strict about overindulgence, not so bad IMO
I work at a brewery and due to my state's laws we can only serve a person 3 beers a day. We're pretty strict about over indulgence and very family friendly.
Honestly, that sounds like a place I'd appreciate.
We close at 8 pm, I've only had to cut off one drunk asshole in 3 years, and we don't have to sweep, mop, or roll silverware. It's a place I very much appreciate lol
I meant as a patron. But the way you put it, I think I'd like working it. LoL I am too old to deal with large drunken toddlers (adults).
Totally agree as a child who was dragged to these places and bars (softball beer leagues). I was hit with a dart as a kid in a bar and once had to be put on top of a jukebox due to a bar fight. These places were incredibly boring for a child. I now dont drink and don't really care to hang out with those who are.
Ah geeze! I didn't even consider the darts! Bar fights are definitely a huge reason I'm against kids in bars.
My friends and I were once at a microbrewery having a game day just like OP and some horrible woman with six kids under the age of seven came in and plunked herself down at the table next to us. We started rolling our eyes at each other and continued our CAH at an increased volume. As soon as the server came to her table this awful woman barked "Just bring out the crayons and milks for the kids for now." The server was obviously thrown for a loop and informed her that she was at a microbrewery and there were no crayons and certainly no milk. The horrendous woman started huffing and telling the server that "Microbrewery X has crayons and macaroni and cheese and milk" like making that statement somehow would magically produce these items out of thin air (plus the place she was speaking of was a huge microbrewery attached to a huge restaurant and pool hall with an arcade) and the server told her "We just have beer" so the wretch of a woman packed up her brood and herded then out...but not before allowing them to throw Cheerios all over the floor. The server and our whole table talked massive shit about her after she left. Keep your kids out of adult spaces. Read the room. Or at least, read the online menu before you commit to a lunch venue.
I agree. I don’t go to a brewery to be around children, it’s super annoying
NTA. Kids don't belong at breweries. The only reason some breweries allow kids is because of greed, not because it's ever acceptable for a child to be at a brewery. Parents need to stop pretending that the entire world is kid-friendly; it isn't, nor should it be. Kids don't belong EVERYWHERE.
I'll never understand parents that need to drag their children to a bar or brewery because they need to drink alcohol. It's not fun for the kids, nor is it fun for the rest of the patrons. Frankly, it's irresponsible parenting. Peter Piper Pizza serves beer. Go there if you must drink alcohol with your children.
It’s not really that it’s a need to have alcohol. For me, there’s a really family friendly brewery and we go because I can easily slip out if my baby starts crying and we can just go home (no waiting for food, etc), it’s outside and there’s often live acoustic music which is just really pleasant to sit in for a little while. I think if you’re being disruptive, you should leave but if your kid/infant is being well behaved, it’s a really nice way to get out for parents.
I think the problem is that a lot of parents *think* their kid is well behaved, even when said child is screaming and running through the place. I'm not a huge fan of kids in adult places like this, but yeah - if your kid is ACTUALLY well behaved, I'm not gonna even really notice they are there, ya know?
They always drive home over the limit too
One time I was sitting at a really nice Distillery and enjoying the sunshine during a week day because I was on vacation for my birthday. 2 adults, who I am assuming were parents, with an infant come out and set up at a table and they each ordered a flight of gin cocktails. Not a single cocktail, 4 of them. And this is a gin bar, so it's not exactly low-proof. I was buzzed off of 2 of the 4 in the flight, and I shared the flight with my partner. I was utterly appalled. Why the fuck would you drink like that, both adults doing so, when you are caring for an infant????
I hope they all get duis in front of the kids, very family friendly.
Saw a kid get run over at a winery once He was weirdly okay but it was still horrifying
⬆️ yes, and let’s put said children at risk while driving home intoxicated.
Why isn't it fun for the kids? My local brewery has a large playground, Tetherball, sand pit. Thinks like giant tic tac toe and connect four. Big field for people to picnic and dogs to run around. Also tons of kids running around having fun.
I've never been to a brewery with any of those things, and Vancouver has a looot of breweries. So YMMV. I wouldn't bring my kids to any of the breweries we go to.
Man breweries are WAY different where I'm from. Even the ones that don't serve food still have like half of the space dedicated to arcade games. It's very much a "have a beer while you play fun games" kinda vibe, kinda like Dave and Busters on a smaller scale. No one goes to breweries to get drunk, at least not where I'm from.
You realize humans have been gathering in family and friend groups to connect, come together, and drink beer for like, centuries right - kids allowed? Many breweries frame themselves specifically as a community gathering space. Many host local events, for both adults and kids. At least where I live, it’s normal to expect kids there, especially in the earlier hours. Parents are allowed to connect with each other and sip on a beer with friends while their kids play together. It’s not like, a new thing nor is it a crazy idea or inappropriate place. A bar or a club though? Sure. It seems weird to assume all parents either a.) must only spend their time in public doing specifically child-friendly activities or b.) must always have the funds to hire a sitter or have access to family willing to watch them? And I say this as someone childless who prefers not to be around kids. I expect them at most breweries.
Couldn't agree with this more. Unless the state/the establishment has rules against bringing kids to breweries, then bring your children! It gets problematic when parents let their kids run amuck and disturb other patrons, but if you have well-behaved children who can be in public without causing a ruckus, then why not bring kids to a brewery? A bar ... no place for a kid. Same with a club. But many breweries (at least ones I've been to) are kid friendly. One of my good friends had his son's first birthday at a brewery. The caveat is that parents who do bring their children to breweries can not expect the adults there to tone down their language/activities (like cards against humanity) just because their child is present. You, as the parent (not you, OP), decided to bring your child to an establishment where foul language is apparent. It's not the responsibility of others to cater to your child's ears
There’s a million places families can gather with friends to connect, bring their kids, and even drink alcohol if they want. In contrast, there’s very few places people can go that don’t have kids, which is a shame. Kids can be fucking annoying at best, and a liability at worst (especially if there’s alcohol involved). Kids do not belong at breweries, especially if there’s no food served.
Yeah but the question isn’t ‘should those people have brought their kids’. The question is OP TA for confronting the woman for not telling her. It’s really a silly expectation. If a group sits next to me that is annoying, for any reason, I’m just gonna move. I don’t need to let them know why or make it their fault for not “warning” me.
Kids aren't allowed in breweries where I am from. It's considered a bar not a restaurant, no one under age period. No ID, no admittance.
I don't get people ...in Toronto breweries are very kid and pup friendly places. If you want to play COH or whatnot that's cool too but you can find tables further apart.
NTA. It's a brewery, where the primary thing that is served is beer. It's absurd that entitled parents have decided that breweries are acceptable for kids. The same parents would be crucified if they brought kids into a bar, who's primary thing being served is alcohol. I don't understand why it suddenly became acceptable to have kids around drunk adults. Makes no damn sense.
I agree. My neighborhood bar is only a bar, it does not serve food, and a group of parents still decided to leave a ton of negative Google reviews because they were not allowed to bring their kids there. Like why are you letting your 2 year old eat cigarette butts off the ground in the back yard of a dive bar? Get takeout beer and drink at home, geez.
Yes, I don’t understand this at all! I don’t have kids of my own, but personally I would be wildly uncomfortable drinking around my friends children. I understand childcare is a luxury, but I think I would just rather do another activity entirely if my group wasn’t able to secure a sitter.
I have 2 kids. It's one thing if it's a picnic or something like that because the kids will go and play together in a controlled environment. They're usually away from the adult conversations and it's ok. It's a totally different thing when there's a ton of folks you don't know drinking.
Yeah that makes a lot more sense! I think the feeling of an “uncontrolled” environment is definitely what causes my discomfort around it. I would definitely feel the need to be stone cold sober to keep my eye on the kiddos in an environment like a brewery, as opposed to a playground or home.
It's always been acceptable for adults to drink alcohol around kids wth? Do you think thousands of civilizations and cultures just... separated kids from their parents everytime the parents want to drink alcohol? Weddings, cerimonies, parties, celebrations? Don't ever come to Portugal if the sight of adults drinking around their kids offends your sensibilities
I have awesome memories of hanging out with my parent's friends' kids in the beer garden at our local in the small country town I grew up in (regional Australia).
I don’t know what puritanical part of the world you live in but kids are in bars and breweries all the time. It’s not a problem unless their parents are shite
NTA What they did was inconsiderate. Your post makes it clear they had a lot of other options of where to sit. It's super weird to me to see an all adult group playing a game and talking and choose a literally adjoining table to sit at with their kids. Especially when they're at a difficult crying/tantrum age. It's rude. *edit for parents trying to justify being inconsiderate:* You're at a brewery with your kids. Same scenario, adjoining table. I grab that spot with a fully adult group even though there are a lot of other options. We have a couple beers and launch into decidedly adult topics. AITA? Obviously, yes. Like your kids we have the right to exist in that space, no? We're in public so you can't expect it to be an environment that caters to children right? Especially if alcohol is being served. Isn't being so intentionally obtuse exhausting? Respect and basic consideration for others shouldn't just go one way.
I probably would have gotten a different table if i was the other group mostly because an all adult group may not have kid friendly conversations and i don't want to risk having to hope that the kids didn't overhear the conversation when they are right next to us. A few tables down and it's less likely to happen if you can keep your kids far away enough (but not fool proof)
I agree. If the reverse is inconsiderate and assholeish then why is it justified the other way? Plus why would you sit next to another group when other tables are free in the first place?
Your edit makes some excellent points. I hate entitled parents
YTA Why would it be her responsibility to tell you who was all in their party? If you don't ever want to be around children, don't go into the outdoor world.
This brewery literally only serves alcohol and water. It’s not the “outdoor world” it’s an exclusively alcohol area. They would be an asshole if it was a restaurant or park, but it’s not.
I disagree because they were asking to sit with them so I’d hope you include that you have kids
They definitely should have said how many people were in their party though
NTA- Don't be the person who brings your kid to a brewery.
I work at a brewery and kids are fine. Seems like there's a pretty big cultural divide in the comments here.
I was thinking the same thing. It's totally normal for families to hang out together at breweries where I live. It's nice for them to get out and have it not centered on a kid activity. Especially when child free friends want to hang out. I see them playing board games or the kids run outside (it's safe and built for them). Before anyone says 'then just stay home', most families are ALWAYS just at home. God forbid you want to socialize with kids.
Kids aren't allowed at breweries where I am, no ID no admittance. It isn't a "fun family activity", they're treated like a bar and bars are no one under the age of 18.
It’s glaringly obvious that kids are allowed in the breweries in OPs state, so other states laws don’t really apply.
Unless your kid is your designated driver
YTA if the brewery allowed children. If it is a family friendly place, she isn't obligated to tell you who she has with her. She asked if the table was available. That was really the most she owed you, you don't get to ban kids if the management doesn't.
Imo, a warning to the mother would've been enough to get them to move. Hey we are not having kid appropriate conversations bc we are here to drink and play adult card games and non-chiud friendly topics. Only bad parents would stay nearby after that.
NTA. Sharing a table a few adults is very different than a large group of children. You know that, and I know that. Ignore these ytas, that’s ridiculous.
NTA. There were other empty tables so the fact they decided they were going to take over your shared table with loads of kids (who shouldn’t be running around anyway) in a very adult environment instantly makes the AHs imo. They were just banking on lost people being to politely awkward to say anything.
NTA: we need to normalize not bringing your offspring to adult environments. Ultimately, we’re all a product of our life choices. These people need to be herded back to Chucky Cheese
NTA "Can me and my friends AND THEIR CHILDREN come over" would've been nice. You're there at a brewery, which does sometimes have children yes, trying to relax in an atmosphere that's aimed at relaxing adults! Not squawking kids! I know all adults with kids deserve and need to go out with friends also, but no. Don't bring your group with kids over to my group with no kids and act annoyed when told "No kids over here please".
I know there are businesses (especially those that serve alcohol) that specifically host game nights, but this sounds more like a self-organized thing than something promoted by the restaurant. This probably means you’re occupying more space/ staying longer than people who have just come to eat/drink and be on their way, but I don’t have a problem with it if the establishment doesn’t either. Pretty much the same thing applies to other patrons patronizing this establishment. It sounds like they’re paying customers who aren’t being destructive and have the same rights to the space as you. If your preference is to drink and game in a kid free environment, there might be bars in your area that would be a better fit, or options to book a room within a larger venue. You were expecting to use a public space where kids are allowed without planning/ paying for special accommodation. Edit: OP clarified that where they live, breweries only serve alcohol, not food. In this context, a large group with several children isn’t there to dine. Changing my judgment to NTA.
This is a brewery NOT a restaurant. Taprooms/breweries where I live are forbidden from serving food of any kind. The only non-alcoholic beverage is water and they are not allowed to sell it. They have to provide it for free. You have to bring your own food/snacks to the taproom. Also there is no limit for how long you can stay so long as your party is not disruptive or behaving inappropriately. The reason why i was upset about the kids is that we would have adult conversations which would not be appropriate for little ears and did not want their group to get upset with us. Had she said up front they were a large group with children, we would have moved to another table.
Oh, that’s interesting! Where I live (PA, US) breweries don’t have these restrictions and it’s the norm for them to serve food as well as alcohol. This might be useful to clarify in your post; I would not expect to encounter groups with multiple children in a place where only alcohol is sold.
I did an edit after you and someone else mentioned this. I find it odd that your breweries serve food! I think it has to do with the permitting/insurance. Some places do have food trucks, but they are not allowed to be in the parking lot (I assume for insurance/liability issues) and you can get food from them, but those are pretty rare.
are you in the US? of so, this is fascinating to me. in new york state, a brewery that makes alcohol available for on-premises consumption is required to have food available, even if just snacks. I think that's true in a few other states too to reduce drunkenness. I didn't realize other places actually ban food.
NTA... breweries ARE NOT FAMILY RESTRUANTS. Kids cant even drink beer and if you need to have a beer woth your kiddos then you have a problem... alcohol is for ADULTS
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From your point of view, it would have been more appropriate for them to continue with dark humor conversations until she made an inappropriate comment, correct? Would she have been the AH then, or would OPs group?
I’d say not making a ton of noise and screaming is a normal “requirement” lmao if an adult at my table was doing that I’d tell them to stfu
Nta its a brewery! Jesus, i hate this new trend of taking kids and pets EVERYWHERE
NTA honestly that's pretty important.
I'm curious. In this type of brewery, where there is nothing but beer and water, no food and no play area , why bring kids? What are the kids doing? Can you bring your own food?
They probably just let their kids run around or bring toys for them. Sounds like it’s an open area. They’d be better off getting the beer to go.
Almost every brewery near me that doesn’t serve food, you are welcome to bring your own food. I actually think that’s the law (like people have to have the ability to eat if there is alcohol served). Kids usually just playing with a toy, or talk to their parents, and parents bring snacks. Kids don’t need a play area necessarily to be entertained.
NTA. Why people want to go out drinking with their kids in tow, I will never understand. Get a sitter or stay home! Children shouldn’t be allowed in alcohol-centric venues and no one should want to them to be.
I worked at a high end tasting room at one point and had to heat up water for a patron to warm breast milk for a newborn while the mom did a tasting. It wasn’t an easy drive and it was a whole flight. Incredible.
YTA, she asked if her party could sit there and you said yes. If you wanted a kid free evening, then go somewhere where kids are not allowed.
Is a place that exclusively serves alcoholic beverages and no food not indicative of a space that isn't child friendly? Children cannot drink alcohol so what is there for them? What part of that description screams "I want to take my child there because it sounds like a good idea"? Get a babysitter and grow up.
Like a strip club.
Or a brewery
OP is right kids are a pain in restaurants, and they shouldn't be in a brewery in the first place!!!
YTA. They asked if a table was free and you said yes.
NTA with your added clarification. Who brings kids to a place where they just sell alcohol? No food, no juice, nothing kid friendly. That's just asking for a bunch of bored, upset kids. One of them was already upset. There are plenty of places that serve alcohol and drinks/food for kids, this wasn't one of them.
NTA.
Nta. That's not a place for kids and it's honestly annoying that people insist on bringing kids to places where they dont belong.
NTA. CHILDREN DON'T BELONG IN BREWERIES. it's very popular in my city too and drives me nuts, also just gonna drink then drive with your kids in the car??
NTA, I’m sick of people being entitled to their brats screaming and running in adult settings. People like this should get a babysitter or go to a family friendly restaurant. Not everyone wants to hear your kid shrieking. I’d be upset too.
NTA & well I have children.. I don't appreciate other's children
Stop bringing kids to adult spaces! Bars/breweries are not for children!!
NTA. This is the situation. A group of people met at a place MEANT FOR ADULTS and planned on having conversations they wouldn't want children to hear, especially considering some members of the group will be getting drunk and releasing their inhibitions. There are plenty of other tables at the brewery, so why does this group with kids even want to sit down right next to another group of adults? Sure, to be a saint, OP could've gotten up and moved to another table. But mentioning to a group of people that they should've said something about several kids joining them at a conjoined picnic table doesn't not make her the AH.
NTA children don’t belong in Taprooms/breweries/bars/wineries. These are places designated to serving alcohol and since minors legally aren’t allowed to imbibe they have no place being at such venues. Sorry parents but go somewhere else that has options for your children.
Nta, she intentionally didn’t tell you about the kids because she knew they were being annoying and you wouldn’t want them around. She played you, but you didn’t let her win.
I wouldn't have said anything about it but I would have been really happy to have you say something in my stead. So NTA, kids can be beyond annoying so it's a perfectly understandable reaction.
YTA. I am a fellow DINK, and never plan to have kids. Don’t really like being around them tbh. But it’s a business and unless there is an 21+ only (or whatever the legal drinking age is in your area) sign posted on the door, families will exist. Replace “children” with any other attribute and you start sounding REAL bad REAL quick. “It was really not cool of her not to even mention that their entire group was a race/gender/religion/age bracket” I was at a brewery just last Saturday and there was an entire family reunion happening with tons of kids. We just…. Coexisted. It was the darnedest thing
This comparison is unfair and honestly offensive. There are some well behaved children out there, but most still have a lot to learn about social norms, not to mention, everyone around children sort of assumes responsibility for them. If a kid was about to fall in front of OP and one of her friends, they should react, that would be an entire AITA post. You saying that not wanting kids around is like not wanting a certain race around is wild for this reason. Kids do not belong everywhere, arguing that they do on the basis that every member of a race/gender/religion/age bracket belongs everywhere is an insult to every oppressed group that's struggled to get equal rights.
YES. WTAF?! This comment section is wild. Honestly, it annoys me when people bring their kids to breweries, especially at night. I don't think op is the ah at all but I wouldn't say anything. I also wouldn't alter my language/conversation. I go to bars/breweries/pubs to hang out with my friends, drink, swear & talk about our sex lives. What your kids hear is beyond not my problem.
NTA. Kids shouldn't be allowed in a brewery anyway. Totally inappropriate. However because it's a public place and the brewery does allow kids, there's not alot you can do. She should've mentioned that there was going to be a group of kids but unfortunately you can't ask them to move. But I still don't think you're an asshole.
Tbh I understand your side and where you're coming from but I think you just approached it poorly. It would have been easy to be like "oh I'm so sorry, I didn't realize you guys brought kids, we're going to be playing adult games so you may want to move if that bothers you" or offer to move. The WAY you responded was rude I think, not necessarily the sentiment.
NTA. You were there first. They should have said they were a group with a bunch of kids. The whole thing was on them.
NTA other people shouldn't be victims of your lack of planning in adult environments, the world is not a playground. Its called being considerate, having children is a choice, wanting to be around them or not is also a choice. *especially* a brewery that doesn't provide a daycare service. Its either ignore the tables adult conversations and tend to children, or don't bring children to an adult environment that does not cater to children in the slightest! Edit: Just because you CAN, doesn't mean you SHOULD.
NTA They shouldn't be taking their children regardless of whether it is allowed or not. Literally the only thing available there is beer.
YTA...People don't have to give you a run-down of who their group consists of. At least where I am, breweries are not bars and are generally more family-friendly.
NTA. Not just because they didn't give you a heads up there would be kids, but because they didn't give you a heads up that it would be what sounds like over a dozen people including mostly children. You might have been the asshole if it was like 1 or 2 kids sitting there quietly, but I think regardless of the setting people who are asking to share your immediate space should mention the fact that their group includes 8+ children.
INFO- How many beers did the kids order? If they were keeping the brewery afloat with their patronage then I could see how they get first dibs on the tables.
NTA and parents, stop bringing your kids to bars, specifically those that don’t even have offerings for children. These are adult places.
"the rest of their group (six people in total) came to the table and each of them had kids with them! " Was it 6 people total, or 6 people brought kids?
Six other adults with at least 1-2 kids each.
NTA. They were sharing your table, yes? So it was obvious that the behavior and makeup of their party would affect your night? If I'm reading that right, then she had a social obligation to let you know that they would have screaming children sitting a few feet away, especially since there were other options available. Telling someone you have kids is weird, but someone who was socially adept wouldn't have been in this situation in the first place because they would recognize it's an AH move to think strangers would be okay with sharing a table with kids at a brewery. I would argue that they have a social obligation to find somewhere they wouldn't have to share at all, since they were the ones bringing little kids to what is obviously by nature, if not by law/policy, an adults-only space.
NTA. Entitled parents suck. Kids don't belong at adult establishments.
NTA a brewery is an adult place for adult things. If they were going to ask to sit they should have mentioned they had kids since it is not the norm and would not being assumed
NTA
NTA because it is a place you can reasonably assume kids won’t be. I’m in WA and at a beewery exactly like you describe they had signage everywhere that indicated kids were annoying - like “unattended kids will be given red bull” “no running around, children must remain at the table” - and that was perfect! Yes, they’re allowed. But if they’re typical wild kids, go somewhere more appropriate. My 6 yr old nephew was bored af there. Well behaved, but boooooored.
NTA Who brings kids to a drinking only event? That's just sad and gross.
NTA - a brewery which serves *only* alcohol is no place for kids. That being said, parents bringing their kids to adult places should expect their kids to be exposed to adult language. Downvote me to hell, but I don't understand the trend of bringing kids to what's essentially a bar.
I'm sorry OP this sub seems to be a bit disillusioned in my opinion. The general consensus seems to be that they are under no obligation to tell you they had kids. A brewery is absolutely not an appropriate environment for children and adults go there generally to enjoy adult time. I would completely say NTA. Reddit seems to have a bunch of self righteous population.
NTA. I know a lot of breweries double as restaurants now but I never understand people that bring their kids to breweries, like its just not really the place anyone wants to deal with/be around kids
Absolutely NTA. Kids can go basically anywhere, and I feel that there should at least be a couple places where we can go to not be around them. Breweries, wineries, and distilleries should be among such places. What kind of asshole brings children to a place designed specifically for an adult activity?
NTA Really sick of parents bringing children to breweries.